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PG tends to write in a, “take it or leave it” style, you get used to it. He’s never, to my eyes, seemed interested in convincing you via flashy argument, he’d

PG tends to write in a, “take it or leave it” style, you get used to it. He’s never, to my eyes, seemed interested in convincing you via flashy argument, he’d rather spend the extra time conveying what he’s experienced a bit more, and let you decide if it’s worth caring about. For me, I try to remember that a lot of what he’s saying may pattern match to an arrogant heuristic, but that’s just because 99 out of 100 people who strike that tone are blowhards. He is the 100th person, and there’s a lot to be gained if I set aside my own ego and just try to understand what he’s describing.

diego 6y ago
The main issue with the article is the imperative title. It's not "here's why I like to write in this style." It's telling the reader to write that way. Sorry but no, I won't write the way you do because you tell me to. edit: the point of my comment is not that I won't write that way. It's that the author is talking about his own preferences, but the title makes it sound prescriptive. In a way it illustrates the opposite point. Opinions are nuanced, and a two-word title written in the imperative doesn't convey the nuance of what the author is trying to say.
- TameAntelope 6y ago
  Surely you can work through that and pick out the parts you find useful/interesting, no? Or are you saying the assertive voice makes that harder?
  - askafriend 6y ago
    The commenter is not saying the writing has no value. They're saying that the main issue is the prescriptive title.
- hombre_fatal 6y ago
  This is weirdly sensitive. Like the guy who sees guitar lessons advertised on the bulletin board and gets mad because he doesn’t want guitar lessons.
  - diego 6y ago
    No, that's not the point. I'm not talking about _me_ specifically, I'm talking about how the article has a prescriptive title. It implies that everyone should write this way. In reality it's about the author's preferences.
- 1vuio0pswjnm7 6y ago
  If the blog post is about programming and it adopts a didactic style, i.e., telling the reader what to do, and it is obviously based on personal preferences -- either the author's or someone else's -- I react the same way. To me, these writings are only opinions. The internet is absolutely loaded with programmers offering opinions or repeating the opinions of others but framing them as directives. Do this or don't do that. Or the more subtle: I like X and and you should, too. These authors can be argumentative if the opinions are challenged, as if one was disobeying a directive, or contradicting a fact, instead of disagreeing with an individual or group opinion.
  - nottrobin 6y ago
    I'm not so convinced of the difference between the "real world" and online. Misinformation, propaganda & charlatans all existed in droves long before the internet. In fact, it's almost certainly true that your average internet user is far better informed about actual facts than the average pre-internet person. Scepticism about what you read is advisable everywhere, internet users have become better at it than previous generations. Hence, I also don't think there's anything at all wrong with the imperative style of writing (or I might as well say "there is nothing wrong with it"). Since it is incumbent upon the reader to consider whether or how far to trust the author anyway, it should make no difference whether the statements are presented as fact or opinion. To treat them differently is to give the author far too much power over your thinking. And so, as the author, given that any sensible reader will put your statements in context anyway, you might as well simply state them directly.
    - 1vuio0pswjnm7 6y ago
      "Scepticism about what you read is advisable everywhere [unsolicited advice], internet users have become better at it than previous generations.[opinion stated as if fact]" https://ed.stanford.edu/news/stanford-researchers-find-students-have-trouble-judging-credibility-information-online https://ed.stanford.edu/news/stanford-researchers-find-stude... https://www.nea.org/advocating-for-change/new-from-nea/students-still-cant-tell-fact-fiction-internet https://www.nea.org/advocating-for-change/new-from-nea/stude... https://www.chronicle.com/article/students-fall-for-misinformation-online-is-teaching-them-to-read-like-fact-checkers-the-solution/ https://www.chronicle.com/article/students-fall-for-misinfor...
tyre 6y ago
Having written other things that are popular doesn't answer to the OP's comment nuanced arguments are a good and helpful thing. PG doesn't pattern match as such because other people are blowhards. He's actually arrogant. Which is fine! He's been very successful enough times that it seems unlikely to be coïncidence. But he also writes essays that are complete whiffs. It's not an ego thing by the reader. There are many examples of no nuance where there is actually a hell of a lot of nuance in the subject at hand. So people quote the essays or act on them blindly because they rely on them as exhaustive when I don't think that that is the case or his actual intention.
sillysaurusx 6y ago
PG tends to write in a, “take it or leave it” style, you get used to it. He’s never, to my eyes, seemed interested in convincing you via flashy argument PG's "responses" are a good contrast, if you're curious what "pg trying to persuade the reader" sounds like. http://paulgraham.com/kedrosky.html http://paulgraham.com/kedrosky.html

diego 6y ago

The main issue with the article is the imperative title. It's not "here's why I like to write in this style." It's telling the reader to write that way. Sorry but no, I won't write the way you do because you tell me to. edit: the point of my comment is not that I won't write that way. It's that the author is talking about his own preferences, but the title makes it sound prescriptive. In a way it illustrates the opposite point. Opinions are nuanced, and a two-word title written in the imperative doesn't convey the nuance of what the author is trying to say.

TameAntelope 6y ago
Surely you can work through that and pick out the parts you find useful/interesting, no? Or are you saying the assertive voice makes that harder?
- askafriend 6y ago
  The commenter is not saying the writing has no value. They're saying that the main issue is the prescriptive title.
hombre_fatal 6y ago
This is weirdly sensitive. Like the guy who sees guitar lessons advertised on the bulletin board and gets mad because he doesn’t want guitar lessons.
- diego 6y ago
  No, that's not the point. I'm not talking about _me_ specifically, I'm talking about how the article has a prescriptive title. It implies that everyone should write this way. In reality it's about the author's preferences.
1vuio0pswjnm7 6y ago
If the blog post is about programming and it adopts a didactic style, i.e., telling the reader what to do, and it is obviously based on personal preferences -- either the author's or someone else's -- I react the same way. To me, these writings are only opinions. The internet is absolutely loaded with programmers offering opinions or repeating the opinions of others but framing them as directives. Do this or don't do that. Or the more subtle: I like X and and you should, too. These authors can be argumentative if the opinions are challenged, as if one was disobeying a directive, or contradicting a fact, instead of disagreeing with an individual or group opinion.
- nottrobin 6y ago
  I'm not so convinced of the difference between the "real world" and online. Misinformation, propaganda & charlatans all existed in droves long before the internet. In fact, it's almost certainly true that your average internet user is far better informed about actual facts than the average pre-internet person. Scepticism about what you read is advisable everywhere, internet users have become better at it than previous generations. Hence, I also don't think there's anything at all wrong with the imperative style of writing (or I might as well say "there is nothing wrong with it"). Since it is incumbent upon the reader to consider whether or how far to trust the author anyway, it should make no difference whether the statements are presented as fact or opinion. To treat them differently is to give the author far too much power over your thinking. And so, as the author, given that any sensible reader will put your statements in context anyway, you might as well simply state them directly.
  - 1vuio0pswjnm7 6y ago
    "Scepticism about what you read is advisable everywhere [unsolicited advice], internet users have become better at it than previous generations.[opinion stated as if fact]" https://ed.stanford.edu/news/stanford-researchers-find-students-have-trouble-judging-credibility-information-online https://ed.stanford.edu/news/stanford-researchers-find-stude... https://www.nea.org/advocating-for-change/new-from-nea/students-still-cant-tell-fact-fiction-internet https://www.nea.org/advocating-for-change/new-from-nea/stude... https://www.chronicle.com/article/students-fall-for-misinformation-online-is-teaching-them-to-read-like-fact-checkers-the-solution/ https://www.chronicle.com/article/students-fall-for-misinfor...

tyre 6y ago

Having written other things that are popular doesn't answer to the OP's comment nuanced arguments are a good and helpful thing. PG doesn't pattern match as such because other people are blowhards. He's actually arrogant. Which is fine! He's been very successful enough times that it seems unlikely to be coïncidence. But he also writes essays that are complete whiffs. It's not an ego thing by the reader. There are many examples of no nuance where there is actually a hell of a lot of nuance in the subject at hand. So people quote the essays or act on them blindly because they rely on them as exhaustive when I don't think that that is the case or his actual intention.

sillysaurusx 6y ago

PG tends to write in a, “take it or leave it” style, you get used to it. He’s never, to my eyes, seemed interested in convincing you via flashy argument PG's "responses" are a good contrast, if you're curious what "pg trying to persuade the reader" sounds like. http://paulgraham.com/kedrosky.html http://paulgraham.com/kedrosky.html