9 ms·

I'm Indian, and some of the most amusing conversations I've had about food have been with Italians. An Italian professor was insistent that I stand up and defe

I'm Indian, and some of the most amusing conversations I've had about food have been with Italians. An Italian professor was insistent that I stand up and defend the need for Indian food to use a million spices. He was proud of the fact that delicious Italian food could be whipped up using just three ingredients. I was in full agreement with him, that Italian food was wonderful, and that it was commendable how far they could take simple ingredients. But he was almost demanding (diplomatically of course) that I take the other side and argue that one needed a million spices to make good food. An Italian friend was aghast that I would suggest putting Onion and Garlic in the same meal. It was strictly either/or for him.

simongray 6y ago
I have had similar conversations with Italians about food or coffee. They're very passionate about both and - at least when it comes to coffee - will also get into heated discussions over it with other Italians, not just foreigners. I think it's just the culture.
- plafl 6y ago
  I'm Spanish, not Italian, but we also talk quite loud. Maybe all discussions look heated to foreigners.
  - Sharlin 6y ago
    Italian discussions literally look very heated to, say, Northern Europeans, due to the very animated body language.
  - andrepd 6y ago
    In Portugal there's a saying: "he/she shouts like a Spaniard". Then again who are we of all people to judge?
- zwaps 6y ago
  I have a different story. I come from a Northern country where there was no "good" coffee for decades, just regular filter coffee, usually too strong. We accept our inferiority in this regard. When I was in Italy or France, I took a liking to their coffee. Sure, seems complicated for home use, but nice in a cafe or bar. To me, living in Paris, this was (at the time) good coffee. So then I met an American, and when I related the above, I was told that the coffee wasn't actually that good at all, and I should try some real artisanal coffee like they do in New York. Luckily, this was getting popular in Europe as well. So, I tagged along to a new and hip coffee place and found, to my surprise, that the mysterious espresso machines had been replaced by good old filters, but with a very arcane and complex production process. The other difference was that the coffee was weak and tasted more like tea than coffee. I did not like it at all, as I wanted a coffee and not some weak watery tea. I like all sorts of coffees - from espresso to filter to Nescafe - for their own unique taste, except this one. Anyway, my point is that I found American coffee snobs to be more snobby than French or Italian ones.
reader_mode 6y ago
If you want to be snobbishly criticised about arbitrary food choices by strangers Italy is the place. I've worked for a client in Italy, a short guy trying to aggressively assert superiority because of how he drinks coffee is a uniquely Italian experience. Oh and the hands and feet mime English is equally entertaining.
rich_sasha 6y ago
> An Italian friend was aghast that I would suggest putting Onion and Garlic in the same meal. It was strictly either/or for him. That's a new one for me. No mixing of the two? Surely the very basis of a good tomato sauce is sweated onions and garlic? Ditto for risotto..?
- agurk 6y ago
  Not knowing where you are from, I'd take a guess at American as there is a sharp divide in garlic use between Italian and Italian-American cusine. Italian food typically has a lot less garlic in it and if you had it in any of the classic dishes like ragù alla bolognese or risotto alla milanese it would be surprising. Dishes like spaghetti alla puttanesca or aglio e olio are classic examples where it is used. Marinara sauce of course has garlic as a key ingredient but this is normally thought of as a Italian-American dish and not something you'd typically find in Italy. Likewise if you had a ragu or risotto in the US you'd probably be surprised if there wasn't garlic in it. And let us not forget that other American invention of garlic bread. One thing I learned recently was that the typical types of garlic available in the US and Italy are different - softneck and hardneck respectively. Hardneck is a _lot_ more flavourful than softneck which I believe goes a long way to explaining why it's used so much more frequently in the US (and in seemingly incredible quantities). There's a very good YouTube channel [0] about Italian cooking (In Italian, usually with English subtitles available) where on one episode of chef's reacting to other videos of "Italian cooking" they had a laugh about this stereotype of Italians eating lots of garlic. [0] https://youtube.com/user/italiasquisita https://youtube.com/user/italiasquisita
  - steinuil 6y ago
    In my region (Piemonte) we certainly do. One of the most distinctive dishes is bagna cauda, which is a dip sauce made mainly of anchovies and tons of garlic. It's usually recommended that you eat it before a day where you don't have to go out and interact with other people because you'll smell really badly of garlic :)
    - agurk 6y ago
pjc50 6y ago
This is food-as-fandom, isn't it? It's not enough to enjoy your own tastes, you have to get out there and tell people that your taste is superior to theirs. You can see it playing out even in this thread.
daveslash 6y ago
Re>> aghast that I would suggest putting Onion and Garlic in the same meal. It was strictly either/or for him. American here. This is quite surprising to me - that wouldn't have occurred to me. Pan searing garlic and onion (before adding additional ingredients) is the "omg, what are you cooking?!, it smells _great_!!" starter kit in my home - when it's literally just those two things.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
castlecrasher2 6y ago
Indian food is one of my favorites, saag being my top choice. I'm amazed at how many ingredients go into it.
- divtiwari 6y ago
  FYI 'Saag' is just a generic name to refer to gravy dishes, that are eaten with chapatis. There are hundreds of varieties of saag.
  - DerDangDerDang 6y ago
    Thanks, I always thought saag was any sauce made primarily from leafy greens
    - krtkush 6y ago
      I'm Indian and for me saag is "leafy greens" too. Spinach to be more particular. The thing is that in India some meanings change with geography and location. For example, for me bhujia meant this [1] for the longest time. However, when I moved to a different part of the country, bhujia also meant potato fritters. Then, there is bhaji which means fried veggies. But some people also call potato fritters as bhaji. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bikaneri_bhujia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bikaneri_bhujia
      - DerDangDerDang 6y ago
        Aha that makes sense, thanks In the U.K. (at least while I was growing up) we had ‘Bombay mix’[1] which included your version of bhujia. Bhaji and Pakora seem to be interchangeable in British-Indian cuisine. If the bulk is onion it’s called a bhaji, otherwise pakora. Halwa is another one that can be wildly different, it seems. Though most parts of the world have their own version I guess, all irresistible but very different. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombay_mix?wprov=sfti1 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombay_mix?wprov=sfti1
- d13 6y ago
michaelscott 6y ago
Indian food was the first cuisine I thought of when reading GP's comment. Indian food is, at least in my opinion, just as incredible and delicious as Italian food while utilising many spices and ingredients. You also get unique kinds of flavours that are impossible to achieve using European approaches to cooking, and to miss out on these because of culinary snobbery seems extremely sad.

simongray 6y ago

I have had similar conversations with Italians about food or coffee. They're very passionate about both and - at least when it comes to coffee - will also get into heated discussions over it with other Italians, not just foreigners. I think it's just the culture.

plafl 6y ago
I'm Spanish, not Italian, but we also talk quite loud. Maybe all discussions look heated to foreigners.
- Sharlin 6y ago
  Italian discussions literally look very heated to, say, Northern Europeans, due to the very animated body language.
- andrepd 6y ago
  In Portugal there's a saying: "he/she shouts like a Spaniard". Then again who are we of all people to judge?
zwaps 6y ago
I have a different story. I come from a Northern country where there was no "good" coffee for decades, just regular filter coffee, usually too strong. We accept our inferiority in this regard. When I was in Italy or France, I took a liking to their coffee. Sure, seems complicated for home use, but nice in a cafe or bar. To me, living in Paris, this was (at the time) good coffee. So then I met an American, and when I related the above, I was told that the coffee wasn't actually that good at all, and I should try some real artisanal coffee like they do in New York. Luckily, this was getting popular in Europe as well. So, I tagged along to a new and hip coffee place and found, to my surprise, that the mysterious espresso machines had been replaced by good old filters, but with a very arcane and complex production process. The other difference was that the coffee was weak and tasted more like tea than coffee. I did not like it at all, as I wanted a coffee and not some weak watery tea. I like all sorts of coffees - from espresso to filter to Nescafe - for their own unique taste, except this one. Anyway, my point is that I found American coffee snobs to be more snobby than French or Italian ones.

reader_mode 6y ago

If you want to be snobbishly criticised about arbitrary food choices by strangers Italy is the place. I've worked for a client in Italy, a short guy trying to aggressively assert superiority because of how he drinks coffee is a uniquely Italian experience. Oh and the hands and feet mime English is equally entertaining.

rich_sasha 6y ago

> An Italian friend was aghast that I would suggest putting Onion and Garlic in the same meal. It was strictly either/or for him. That's a new one for me. No mixing of the two? Surely the very basis of a good tomato sauce is sweated onions and garlic? Ditto for risotto..?

agurk 6y ago
Not knowing where you are from, I'd take a guess at American as there is a sharp divide in garlic use between Italian and Italian-American cusine. Italian food typically has a lot less garlic in it and if you had it in any of the classic dishes like ragù alla bolognese or risotto alla milanese it would be surprising. Dishes like spaghetti alla puttanesca or aglio e olio are classic examples where it is used. Marinara sauce of course has garlic as a key ingredient but this is normally thought of as a Italian-American dish and not something you'd typically find in Italy. Likewise if you had a ragu or risotto in the US you'd probably be surprised if there wasn't garlic in it. And let us not forget that other American invention of garlic bread. One thing I learned recently was that the typical types of garlic available in the US and Italy are different - softneck and hardneck respectively. Hardneck is a _lot_ more flavourful than softneck which I believe goes a long way to explaining why it's used so much more frequently in the US (and in seemingly incredible quantities). There's a very good YouTube channel [0] about Italian cooking (In Italian, usually with English subtitles available) where on one episode of chef's reacting to other videos of "Italian cooking" they had a laugh about this stereotype of Italians eating lots of garlic. [0] https://youtube.com/user/italiasquisita https://youtube.com/user/italiasquisita
- steinuil 6y ago
  In my region (Piemonte) we certainly do. One of the most distinctive dishes is bagna cauda, which is a dip sauce made mainly of anchovies and tons of garlic. It's usually recommended that you eat it before a day where you don't have to go out and interact with other people because you'll smell really badly of garlic :)
  - agurk 6y ago

pjc50 6y ago

This is food-as-fandom, isn't it? It's not enough to enjoy your own tastes, you have to get out there and tell people that your taste is superior to theirs. You can see it playing out even in this thread.

daveslash 6y ago

Re>> aghast that I would suggest putting Onion and Garlic in the same meal. It was strictly either/or for him. American here. This is quite surprising to me - that wouldn't have occurred to me. Pan searing garlic and onion (before adding additional ingredients) is the "omg, what are you cooking?!, it smells _great_!!" starter kit in my home - when it's literally just those two things.

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]

castlecrasher2 6y ago

Indian food is one of my favorites, saag being my top choice. I'm amazed at how many ingredients go into it.

divtiwari 6y ago
FYI 'Saag' is just a generic name to refer to gravy dishes, that are eaten with chapatis. There are hundreds of varieties of saag.
- DerDangDerDang 6y ago
  Thanks, I always thought saag was any sauce made primarily from leafy greens
  - krtkush 6y ago
    I'm Indian and for me saag is "leafy greens" too. Spinach to be more particular. The thing is that in India some meanings change with geography and location. For example, for me bhujia meant this [1] for the longest time. However, when I moved to a different part of the country, bhujia also meant potato fritters. Then, there is bhaji which means fried veggies. But some people also call potato fritters as bhaji. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bikaneri_bhujia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bikaneri_bhujia
    - DerDangDerDang 6y ago
      Aha that makes sense, thanks In the U.K. (at least while I was growing up) we had ‘Bombay mix’[1] which included your version of bhujia. Bhaji and Pakora seem to be interchangeable in British-Indian cuisine. If the bulk is onion it’s called a bhaji, otherwise pakora. Halwa is another one that can be wildly different, it seems. Though most parts of the world have their own version I guess, all irresistible but very different. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombay_mix?wprov=sfti1 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombay_mix?wprov=sfti1
d13 6y ago

michaelscott 6y ago

Indian food was the first cuisine I thought of when reading GP's comment. Indian food is, at least in my opinion, just as incredible and delicious as Italian food while utilising many spices and ingredients. You also get unique kinds of flavours that are impossible to achieve using European approaches to cooking, and to miss out on these because of culinary snobbery seems extremely sad.