6 ms·

What’s a gemini server?

by baby 6y ago

pmlnr 6y ago
Gopher on TLS.
- webmaven 6y ago
  > Gopher on TLS. Going through the docs, it's apparent that Gemini is a bit more than just that. A description that is almost as succinct but more accurate would be 'A Gopher inspired protocol, over TLS'. It is worth noting that using TLS doesn't seem like an afterthought (it's required, not optional), and more closely resembles SCP rather than HTTPS, with the use of client certs a first-class feature for example. It would be an interesting project to implement a REST-like API over Gemini.
  - tenebrisalietum 6y ago
    > It would be an interesting project to implement a REST-like API over Gemini. URLs are limited to 1024 characters according to the spec, and query strings look like it's the only way for clients to talk to servers outside of the URL, so you have a pretty narrow pipe.
  - lolinder 6y ago
    My understanding is that the designers explicitly do not want applications to be possible/practical over Gemini. The request format is intentionally not extensible, and consists exclusively of a URL.
  - ufmace 6y ago
    It would be neat, but it's impossible, because Gemini explicitly forbids any request types other than GET, or rather a practical clone of GET that isn't called that because there isn't anything else anyways. Without a POST or other support for sending larger bodies, there's a ton of interesting stuff you just can't ever do. If they know they don't ever want that to be possible, well fair enough it's their protocol, but I don't see the point of a cool feature like identifying clients explicitly by client TLS certs only when clients can never do anything but view documents and maybe do a simple search anyways.
mxuribe 6y ago
A server for the gemini protocol (kinda like a web server for http). Info on gemini can be obtained here: https://gemini.circumlunar.space/ https://gemini.circumlunar.space/
ecliptik 6y ago
It's for the gemini:// protocol, >Gemini is a new application-level internet protocol for the distribution of arbitrary files, with some special consideration for serving a lightweight hypertext format which facilitates linking between files. https://gemini.circumlunar.space/docs/faq.gmi https://gemini.circumlunar.space/docs/faq.gmi
jai_ 6y ago
It's an internet protocol with the intent of being extremely simple and with the goal of fostering an alternative internet space. https://gemini.circumlunar.space/docs/faq.gmi https://gemini.circumlunar.space/docs/faq.gmi https://drewdevault.com/2020/11/01/What-is-Gemini-anyway.html https://drewdevault.com/2020/11/01/What-is-Gemini-anyway.htm...
snvzz 6y ago
A poorly thought of protocol, with political goals. It's supposed to be simple in order to support trivial clients, and to prevent it from suffering the web's ill fate. But it forces complexity into clients, by making TLS (of all possible ways to do e2ee!) mandatory and by not even giving the client the length of a response before the response is sent. Of course, for political reasons, protocol can't be extended, and while it's still new and could be made sane, it won't; The authors don't want outside input. I'd look into Gopher instead. It's old and tested, not to mention free of political bullshit.
- kaoD 6y ago
  What political bullshit?
  - snvzz 6y ago
    >What political bullshit? Refer to "non-extensibility" in the FAQ[0]. Particularly, as applied to content length in 2.12. [0]: https://gemini.circumlunar.space/docs/faq.html https://gemini.circumlunar.space/docs/faq.html
    - kaoD 6y ago
      I don't see what's political about that. It seems like a design decision you don't agree with (and neither do I at a first glance) but I fall to see any political intent.
      - snvzz 6y ago
        Their whole decision-making process seems to be political. See 1.1 for their rationale against extensions. Whereas 2.x is full of examples of bad decisions which they're stubborn about not fixing. It is basically somebody's pet project, opinionated and full of rough edges they refuse to ever polish. It lacks the processes and, at the core, the quality expected of a standard, and thus we should be very careful not to mislabel it a standard.
      - cooperadymas 6y ago

What’s a gemini server?

by baby 6y ago

What’s a gemini server?

pmlnr 6y ago

Gopher on TLS.

webmaven 6y ago
> Gopher on TLS. Going through the docs, it's apparent that Gemini is a bit more than just that. A description that is almost as succinct but more accurate would be 'A Gopher inspired protocol, over TLS'. It is worth noting that using TLS doesn't seem like an afterthought (it's required, not optional), and more closely resembles SCP rather than HTTPS, with the use of client certs a first-class feature for example. It would be an interesting project to implement a REST-like API over Gemini.
- tenebrisalietum 6y ago
  > It would be an interesting project to implement a REST-like API over Gemini. URLs are limited to 1024 characters according to the spec, and query strings look like it's the only way for clients to talk to servers outside of the URL, so you have a pretty narrow pipe.
- lolinder 6y ago
  My understanding is that the designers explicitly do not want applications to be possible/practical over Gemini. The request format is intentionally not extensible, and consists exclusively of a URL.
- ufmace 6y ago
  It would be neat, but it's impossible, because Gemini explicitly forbids any request types other than GET, or rather a practical clone of GET that isn't called that because there isn't anything else anyways. Without a POST or other support for sending larger bodies, there's a ton of interesting stuff you just can't ever do. If they know they don't ever want that to be possible, well fair enough it's their protocol, but I don't see the point of a cool feature like identifying clients explicitly by client TLS certs only when clients can never do anything but view documents and maybe do a simple search anyways.

mxuribe 6y ago

A server for the gemini protocol (kinda like a web server for http). Info on gemini can be obtained here: https://gemini.circumlunar.space/ https://gemini.circumlunar.space/

ecliptik 6y ago

It's for the gemini:// protocol, >Gemini is a new application-level internet protocol for the distribution of arbitrary files, with some special consideration for serving a lightweight hypertext format which facilitates linking between files. https://gemini.circumlunar.space/docs/faq.gmi https://gemini.circumlunar.space/docs/faq.gmi

jai_ 6y ago

It's an internet protocol with the intent of being extremely simple and with the goal of fostering an alternative internet space. https://gemini.circumlunar.space/docs/faq.gmi https://gemini.circumlunar.space/docs/faq.gmi https://drewdevault.com/2020/11/01/What-is-Gemini-anyway.html https://drewdevault.com/2020/11/01/What-is-Gemini-anyway.htm...

snvzz 6y ago

A poorly thought of protocol, with political goals. It's supposed to be simple in order to support trivial clients, and to prevent it from suffering the web's ill fate. But it forces complexity into clients, by making TLS (of all possible ways to do e2ee!) mandatory and by not even giving the client the length of a response before the response is sent. Of course, for political reasons, protocol can't be extended, and while it's still new and could be made sane, it won't; The authors don't want outside input. I'd look into Gopher instead. It's old and tested, not to mention free of political bullshit.

kaoD 6y ago
What political bullshit?
- snvzz 6y ago
  >What political bullshit? Refer to "non-extensibility" in the FAQ[0]. Particularly, as applied to content length in 2.12. [0]: https://gemini.circumlunar.space/docs/faq.html https://gemini.circumlunar.space/docs/faq.html
  - kaoD 6y ago
    I don't see what's political about that. It seems like a design decision you don't agree with (and neither do I at a first glance) but I fall to see any political intent.
    - snvzz 6y ago
      Their whole decision-making process seems to be political. See 1.1 for their rationale against extensions. Whereas 2.x is full of examples of bad decisions which they're stubborn about not fixing. It is basically somebody's pet project, opinionated and full of rough edges they refuse to ever polish. It lacks the processes and, at the core, the quality expected of a standard, and thus we should be very careful not to mislabel it a standard.
    - cooperadymas 6y ago