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Record 3,200 Migrant Children Stuck in Border Patrol Custody, Past Legal Limit
- beervirus 6y agoReminder, we no longer call them “children in cages” now that bad orange man is gone.
- rayiner 6y agoThe Associated Press "fact check" explains that the claim that Biden is putting "kids in cages" is "missing context." https://apnews.com/article/fact-checking-afs:Content:9970724533 https://apnews.com/article/fact-checking-afs:Content:9970724... Funny I don't remember them being so careful to provide all that "context" for what Trump said or did.
- redis_mlc 6y agoIn case you were hoping for facts from the MSM, that hasn't existed for a few years now. I mostly watch NTD Media now. Back in the 80s/90s, although it had inaccuracies, the US media wasn't part of the Red Terror. Glenn Greenwald, who's based in Brazil now, has explained that his US journalist friends must toe the cultural Marxist line or they're cancelled (fired and disowned by all journo friends.)
- ethanwillis 6y agoWhy NTD Media in particular? I hadn't heard of them before so I looked them up and it looks like they'd have their own particular bias. That's not some kind of judgement as basically all media has some kind of bias.
- mrkeen 6y ago> All this dumb jargon you're using - "sjws" and "Oberlin sophomores" and "cultural marxists" - proves you have no fucking idea what my views are. https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/1312443170064535553 https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/status/1312443170064535553
- andrepd 6y agoSo in order to avoid media bias you... get your information from a single source? Also, using the phrase "cultural Marxism" is a pretty strong red flag that you have your own ideological biases yourself.
- lemmsjid 6y agoThe article that links to specifically mentions cases where Trump was wrongfully accused putting children in cages via false information, and actually does you the favor of linking to an AP article entitled, "AP FACT CHECK: 2014 photo wrongly used to hit Trump policies". But apparently your preconceived narrative is so comprehensively correct that you don't even bother reading the linked article...
- rat87 6y agoThey were and did add context The problem is when the context is that the Trump administration was cruel on purpose as part of their war on immigration it makes them look worse not better
- andrepd 6y ago> Funny I don't remember them being so careful to provide all that "context" for what Trump said or did. Literally the first result from googling "AP fact check trump cages": https://apnews.com/article/election-2020-democratic-national-convention-ap-fact-check-immigration-politics-2663c84832a13cdd7a8233becfc7a5f3 https://apnews.com/article/election-2020-democratic-national... > WASHINGTON (AP) — Michelle Obama assailed President Donald Trump on Monday for ripping migrant children from their parents and throwing them into cages, picking up on a frequent and distorted point made widely by Democrats. > THE FACTS: The reference to cages is misleading and a matter that Democrats have persistently distorted. But hey, don't let _reality_ stand in the way of your apoplectic fury! For fuck's sake people.
- tptacek 6y agoAnother rare instance where I think you're just straight-up wrong. The contexts are radically different: Trump separated children from their families universally and deliberately, for the explicit purpose of deterring immigration. That's not at all what Biden is doing (or what Obama did). It's a popular "dunk" on Democrats and "resistance" types, but I'm sure you can see that what it also does is normalize deterrent family separation, as if it was something we have routinely done historically (it was not). The AP isn't always right (how weird would it be if they were?) but they are in this case.
- bhupy 6y agoThis is a rare instance where I actually think both you and rayiner (both otherwise awesome HN users) are wrong. Your characterization of Trump vs Biden/Obama is refuted by the AP themselves: https://apnews.com/article/election-2020-democratic-national-convention-ap-fact-check-immigration-politics-2663c84832a13cdd7a8233becfc7a5f3 https://apnews.com/article/election-2020-democratic-national... > WASHINGTON (AP) — Michelle Obama assailed President Donald Trump on Monday for ripping migrant children from their parents and throwing them into cages, picking up on a frequent and distorted point made widely by Democrats. > THE FACTS: The reference to cages is misleading and a matter that Democrats have persistently distorted. Rayiner's characterization that the AP has never provided "context" for what Trump did is wrong per the above link, which could actually be found in the original link cited.
- tptacek 6y agoBy way of example: WaPo today, reporting on the peak of children in HHS custody under Biden, comparing unfavorably to Trump, leaves out that those children are confined for an average of 4.5 days before being transferred to family members and sponsors. During Trump's family separation program, that number was 154 days, and in some cases for over a year.
- at_a_remove 6y agoI recall that last October Trump's people, in a move that was as petty as it was somewhat dead-on, made the Wifi password for the Press "WhoBuiltTheCagesJoe?" I think it ought to have been the SSID, myself, and the password being the correct answer, but I suppose it was a start.
- SkinTaco 6y agoI have barely been following the "children in cages" thing and know very little about it and have almost no context for it. Can someone explain why OP is being downvoted? This goes with what I've (very passively) seen, as far as I know the Biden administration has not done very much to change this, but I have noticed that the narrative has lightened up on this since he was elected
- mercurysmessage 6y ago"Can someone explain why OP is being downvoted?" Probably for implying that Trump wasn't that bad, when he clearly was.
- lemmsjid 6y agoI personally don't downvote opinions, but my assumption is that the OP is taking 'children in cages' out of context, and is also making a rhetorical point that all Trump opposition is based on personal hatred of him, and that they believe suddenly everything is fine because Biden is in charge. There are definitely two sides to the story, and a certain amount of research will make that clear, which the OP does not acknowledge. The controversy was a very specific and cruel Trump administration policy to separate children from their families by automatically criminalizing crossings (typically border crossings are civil rather than criminal offenses, until criminality has been established). It specifically came out of Stephen Miller's 'zero tolerance' policy for illegal immigration. Many of those involved (with the strong exception of Miller himself) have expressed regret for enacting the policy, because it led to permanent separations of children from their parents, before the typical standards of criminal behavior were met. Obviously that is a tremendous trauma for children. Indeed, there has been misinformation from the opposition, taking pictures of children behind fences out of context in order to make the policy seem more cruel. While in my strong opinion the policy was cruel and was very much intended to be cruel, people on all political sides can and do use social media manipulations to make fallacious points. It's never just 'those people' doing it. So the waters are muddied. I think a good HN post acknowledges the muddiness of the situation, rather than a black-and-white pronouncement--hence the downvoting.
- spamizbad 6y agoThe politics around this are absolutely mind-bendingly stupid. If you support putting children in cages and think its GOOD: You're a horrible person! Fascist! If you support putting children in cages but HATE that we have to do it (for their own good! We have no better options!): A rational, sensible liberal way to see things! If you think the migrant crisis requires a more humanitarian approach, and that they should be given better accommodations and we should reevaluate our Latin American policy to prevent such things: Tankie! You're being unrealistic! You support open bordered! Really drives home how so much of American politics is just aesthetics. You can do bad things you just have to acknowledge their bad and feel bad about them. But not dwell on it too much because that helps the opposition.
- simfree 6y agoThe politics are not what they appear. Free movement advocates found a broadly appealing wedge (children being caged, malnourished and freezing/boiling) and have successfully made a large chunk of Americans anti-border control. Whether the neoliberal politicians flip flop is not the point, the goal is to move the Overton Window of the conversation.
- lumberingjack 6y agoThese children were born in to cages they just weren't locked up yet. Mexican here lots of these kids were created because they were going to be a "free ride."
- commandlinefan 6y agoHow could they not have thought about what to do once they passed the “legal limit”?
- ct0 6y agoThe government will surely fine themselves and learn their lesson. /s
- disgrunt 6y agoConsidering it went from 9 to 3,200 in less than a month, wouldn't a better question be what caused this sudden spike? Apparently the U.S. detained 100,000 migrants on the Mexican border in February alone. [0] [0]: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-immigration-border-idUSKCN2AX2FE?taid=6042cbe7452dcf000173ad26&utm_campaign=trueAnthem:+Trending+Content&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-immigration-border-id...
- zo1 6y ago100,000 sounds like an invasion army. No wonder it has a lot of people upset for various reasons.
- rat87 6y agoComparing a bunch of kids to an invading army is stupid
- azinman2 6y agoSounds like a humanitarian disaster to me.
- ripply 6y ago100,000 isn’t a “bunch of kids” it’s a small town
- zo1 6y agoDismissing a 100,000 foreign individuals crossing your border as "a bunch of kids" is even more disingenuous and further fuels the issues the anti-immigration folk have. 100,000 is not peanuts. As the other commenter mentioned, that's a bigger than probably hundreds of towns in the USA. Anywho, if we really "cared" about all the "bunch of kids" suffering in Mexico, we would have invaded Mexico and installed a "democratic" government years ago.
- redis_mlc 6y agoIf somebody has an informative link, I'm curious why this is still an issue. My understanding is that guides are using children as accessories/human shields, so the US govt. is unsure of who the parents are or where they're from, so they're detained? Prior to 2020, I considered this one of the country's greatest shames, but maybe there's some plausible operational excuse for it. I sure hope so.
- inasio 6y agoTo me the key difference post-Trump is that the family separation policy is no longer in effect.
- Sevii 6y agoIf people are coming across the border with kids that they don’t have proof are theirs, what do you do? Do we send the kids back across the border with the adults that brought them across? How do we find the parents of these kids once they are detained? It seems like a hard problem to me. Ideally we’d reunite these kids with their parents. The logistics of finding the parents of thousands of undocumented minors is pretty intense.
- rat87 6y agoThe thing is that some Trump defenders tried to make up stories about seperating kids die to trafficking to justify the Trump administration purposely seperating children from their parents to be cruel in the hope that cruelty would deter legal(assylum seekers) and illegal immigration. In the process they lost track of where kids parents were due to incompetence
- mercurysmessage 6y agoYes, it's long been known that it was a lie and excuse, it's sad that people on this site somehow aren't aware of this. Trump had two neo-nazis in his administration, this is just some of the fallout of that.
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- throw_away_2x8 6y agoThe only sensible policy is stop accepting anyone, and fund agencies in Mexico to return children to countries they are coming from. Plus good policies in those countries to build them up. If we continue to keep accepting people who cross the border, they will keep coming. We are encouraging parents to send their kids up here. Even worse during a pandemic.
- gatlin 6y agoSurely the simpler solution is to stop putting humans in cages. It's not clear that it benefits anyone anywhere.
- stevespang 6y agoNot only that, but it's reported by reliable sources that the drug cartels (which are terrorist organizations) control all the Southern border on the Mexico side. Migrants have to pay $7,000 to $10,000 each to the cartels to cross, so in effect, migrants are funding the cartels - - - a crime in itself. History will not be kind to democrats whose policies are contributing to the Mexification of America with millions of dirt poor, uneducated migrants - - instead of doctors, scientists, tech workers and similar whom we should be encouraging to come here - - those who support themselves, pay taxes, and quite rarely sponge off the free health care and social nets.
- lumberingjack 6y agoI call upon all entrepreneurs to invest in Mexico property and businesses like grocery stores make Mexico great again