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This is really straight forward - a nation's economic activity is always going to be shaped by its military policy and investment. For example - the US dominan

This is really straight forward - a nation's economic activity is always going to be shaped by its military policy and investment. For example - the US dominance in fields like internet, electronics and aviation is probably directly related to the investment the country has made in related fields for military reasons. Once you have a manufacturing base and labor force that knows how to do X, they will do it commercially. Israel is a small nation of well educated people which is consistently dealing with external existential threads. Of course its military strategy is going to be intelligence-based (rather pre-empt on pin-point basis rather than go to all out war down the road.) And then of course people will graduate from that military experience of using computers for broad data analysis and look to put it to commercial use. This manifests in cyber security and ad tec and plenty of other civilian uses like medical imaging. None of this is particularly malign or surprising. It comes down to - if you have a large labor force who can do X, and there are subsets of X you don't like, there's going to be some proportion of what the country does that you won't like.

helge9210 6y ago
> Israel is a small nation of well educated people Out of 9 million population, only 200k work in Hi-Tech and only 28k of those work in startups. Only half of the high school students successfully pass matriculation examination. Very common mistake (even in Israel) to confuse Jews as a nation and Israel as Jewish state. Half of the jews chose not to live in Israel. The educated half.
- NeverFade 6y ago
  > Out of 9 million population, only 200k work in Hi-Tech Per available data, that is 321,000 employees, comprising 9.2% of the overall workforce. That is a very high portion, higher even than here in the US, where only 7.7% are tech workers. https://nocamels.com/2020/02/israeli-high-tech-industry-grows-workforce-shortage-18500/ https://nocamels.com/2020/02/israeli-high-tech-industry-grow... > Half of the jews chose not to live in Israel. The educated half. It's very clear that you have a blatant anti-Israeli agenda. Still important to point out that contrary to your biased, counterfactual claims, Israeli Jews are no less educated or talented than others, based on the actual facts of the Israeli technology industry and its economic achievements: https://www.amazon.com/Start-up-Nation-Israels-Economic-Miracle/dp/0446541478 https://www.amazon.com/Start-up-Nation-Israels-Economic-Mira...
- AzzieElbab 6y ago
  Hmm being and remaining a Jewish state is the very cornerstone of Israel and Israeli Palestinian conflict. Otherwise they could have just agreed to the right to return and ended the whole thing
  - dogma1138 6y ago
    Even if the Jewish state status wouldn’t be an issue right of return will never happen it would be a social and economic suicide. This isn’t the German unification it’s not even the possible Korean unification there is really no way to deal with it other than grant Palestinian refugees an actual refugee status and settle them. Keep in mind even the PA doesn’t want to grant RoR to refugees many of them weren’t refugees from the land that is now Israel but wasn’t pre-1967 or even 1948, many of them escaped from what is now the West Bank, some one their own, some due to Israeli pressure some due to Jordanian pressure.
    - AzzieElbab 6y ago
      But that is the entire point. Of course PA doesn’t want refugees to resettle in the West Bank, they want them to return to Israel main. Two states solution means completely different things depending on who you are talking to. To the Palestinians it means two Arab states
    - bjourne 6y ago
      In the 1990s, over a million Jews from the former Soviet Union settled in Israel. We should be clear about that. It is technically possible for the Palestinians to return. What prevents them from returning is deeply entrenched racism: "In 2009, 72 percent named a Jewish majority as one of their two leading values, versus 71 percent in 2007, while 36 percent and 29 percent, respectively, named Greater Israel as a leading value. Democracy has been losing public support in the last five years. In 2009, 35 percent of the population opted for democracy as their most or the second most important value; in contrast in 2005, 60 percent of respondents chose democracy as their most or the second most important value." https://reliefweb.int/report/israel/vox-populi-trends-israeli-public-opinion-national-security-2004-2009 https://reliefweb.int/report/israel/vox-populi-trends-israel...
maybelsyrup 6y ago
The idea that the nation with the most lethal, best organized, and richest military in the region by orders of magnitude - the only military in the neighborhood with nuclear weapons, and invincible submarine-launched nuclear weapons at that - faces any sort of existential threat from anyone is a bad joke. That you see this "argument" so often only speaks to the effectiveness of a decades-long PR campaign, and not any reality. Does Israel have enemies? Plenty, and justifiably so in many cases! But enemies and existential threats are not the same thing. There is no existential threat to Israel, certainly not any in the form of a foreign aggressor. Anyone even considering becoming a serious existential threat to Israel has to contend with the reality of attempting to get rid of it militarily, assuming they could even come close to doing so: the inevitable (and probably immediate) annihilation, Dr. Strangelove-style, of the entire region in retaliatory nuclear strikes. Israel has militarily guaranteed its continued existence, and wagging our fingers at each other on the internet cannot change anything about it. If anything, with an arsenal like that, you wonder whether other countries in the neighborhood might ask whether Israel is an existential threat to them. Who could tell them they're wrong?
- refurb 6y ago
  This seems like a really odd take. Iraq attempted to develop nuclear weapons back in the 80's. Iran is currently attempting to do so. Israel's enemies are often non-state actors that have already demonstrated they don't really care about their personal survival or civilian casualties (theirs or Israel's). You could argue that Israel is well equipped to control any existential threat by it's neighbors, but to argue such a threat doesn't exist is kind of silly.
  - nickik 6y ago
    > Iran is currently attempting to do so. You know what Israel is also good at. Propaganda and creating fake intelligence. Israel has for almost 30 years now argued that Iran is just a year away from nuclear weapons and the US must instantly attack Iran. Iran had no plan to develop anything and wanted civilian nuclear power, complete controlled by France in terms of import and export of nuclear fuel. When this was blocked Iran moved said, well I guess we will invest in this ourself. Once they had the started capability to do so, again with no evidence of developing nuclear weapons Israel/US started the assassinate Iranian scientists, create one of the most aggressive sanctions programs in world history and a whole host of other things such as stuxnet. Despite multiple US intelligence agencies saying there was no evidence of a nuclear weapons program and many expert predicting Iran had no such plans. Iran eventually agree to the most extreme observation of their nuclear program that any nation has ever agree on in history of nuclear agreements. And this program was active for quite a while, and found no evidence what so ever that there had ever been a nuclear program. Basically all expert saying that it was practically impossible for them to have a nuclear weapons program with those safegurads in control. The US then left an international agreement, despite every other nation that was part of the agreement agree that Iran had behaved perfectly within the agreement. Iran was certified multiple times of having not engaged in any activity that was not allowed in the agreement. And even after the US left the agreement, Iran and the other nations still hold to the agreement and safeguards are still in place. So this idea that Iran is this big danger is simply propaganda pushed by Israel mostly and other US interests who hate Iran for various reasons. What really mind blowing about this whole 'Iran nuclear controversy' is that ironical Isreal IS ACTUALLY nuclear rough state. Iran is a signatory of the NPT while Israel is not. But of course them having them is just fine and proper, but anybody else getting them existential thread. But that argument of course is never allowed to be made the other way around. If there is a state of rebellious fanatics that repress large parts of their population that is a thread to the world, I know what state I would pick. And if I were the neighbour of such a state, I be very concerned. It is Israel actually that has invaded other countries repeatedly far more often then they were invaded. Just about right now that Biden might even consider even possible reopening negotiations, the propaganda machine is pumping out this garbage again.

helge9210 6y ago

> Israel is a small nation of well educated people Out of 9 million population, only 200k work in Hi-Tech and only 28k of those work in startups. Only half of the high school students successfully pass matriculation examination. Very common mistake (even in Israel) to confuse Jews as a nation and Israel as Jewish state. Half of the jews chose not to live in Israel. The educated half.

NeverFade 6y ago
> Out of 9 million population, only 200k work in Hi-Tech Per available data, that is 321,000 employees, comprising 9.2% of the overall workforce. That is a very high portion, higher even than here in the US, where only 7.7% are tech workers. https://nocamels.com/2020/02/israeli-high-tech-industry-grows-workforce-shortage-18500/ https://nocamels.com/2020/02/israeli-high-tech-industry-grow... > Half of the jews chose not to live in Israel. The educated half. It's very clear that you have a blatant anti-Israeli agenda. Still important to point out that contrary to your biased, counterfactual claims, Israeli Jews are no less educated or talented than others, based on the actual facts of the Israeli technology industry and its economic achievements: https://www.amazon.com/Start-up-Nation-Israels-Economic-Miracle/dp/0446541478 https://www.amazon.com/Start-up-Nation-Israels-Economic-Mira...
AzzieElbab 6y ago
Hmm being and remaining a Jewish state is the very cornerstone of Israel and Israeli Palestinian conflict. Otherwise they could have just agreed to the right to return and ended the whole thing
- dogma1138 6y ago
  Even if the Jewish state status wouldn’t be an issue right of return will never happen it would be a social and economic suicide. This isn’t the German unification it’s not even the possible Korean unification there is really no way to deal with it other than grant Palestinian refugees an actual refugee status and settle them. Keep in mind even the PA doesn’t want to grant RoR to refugees many of them weren’t refugees from the land that is now Israel but wasn’t pre-1967 or even 1948, many of them escaped from what is now the West Bank, some one their own, some due to Israeli pressure some due to Jordanian pressure.
  - AzzieElbab 6y ago
    But that is the entire point. Of course PA doesn’t want refugees to resettle in the West Bank, they want them to return to Israel main. Two states solution means completely different things depending on who you are talking to. To the Palestinians it means two Arab states
  - bjourne 6y ago
    In the 1990s, over a million Jews from the former Soviet Union settled in Israel. We should be clear about that. It is technically possible for the Palestinians to return. What prevents them from returning is deeply entrenched racism: "In 2009, 72 percent named a Jewish majority as one of their two leading values, versus 71 percent in 2007, while 36 percent and 29 percent, respectively, named Greater Israel as a leading value. Democracy has been losing public support in the last five years. In 2009, 35 percent of the population opted for democracy as their most or the second most important value; in contrast in 2005, 60 percent of respondents chose democracy as their most or the second most important value." https://reliefweb.int/report/israel/vox-populi-trends-israeli-public-opinion-national-security-2004-2009 https://reliefweb.int/report/israel/vox-populi-trends-israel...

maybelsyrup 6y ago

The idea that the nation with the most lethal, best organized, and richest military in the region by orders of magnitude - the only military in the neighborhood with nuclear weapons, and invincible submarine-launched nuclear weapons at that - faces any sort of existential threat from anyone is a bad joke. That you see this "argument" so often only speaks to the effectiveness of a decades-long PR campaign, and not any reality. Does Israel have enemies? Plenty, and justifiably so in many cases! But enemies and existential threats are not the same thing. There is no existential threat to Israel, certainly not any in the form of a foreign aggressor. Anyone even considering becoming a serious existential threat to Israel has to contend with the reality of attempting to get rid of it militarily, assuming they could even come close to doing so: the inevitable (and probably immediate) annihilation, Dr. Strangelove-style, of the entire region in retaliatory nuclear strikes. Israel has militarily guaranteed its continued existence, and wagging our fingers at each other on the internet cannot change anything about it. If anything, with an arsenal like that, you wonder whether other countries in the neighborhood might ask whether Israel is an existential threat to them. Who could tell them they're wrong?

refurb 6y ago
This seems like a really odd take. Iraq attempted to develop nuclear weapons back in the 80's. Iran is currently attempting to do so. Israel's enemies are often non-state actors that have already demonstrated they don't really care about their personal survival or civilian casualties (theirs or Israel's). You could argue that Israel is well equipped to control any existential threat by it's neighbors, but to argue such a threat doesn't exist is kind of silly.
- nickik 6y ago
  > Iran is currently attempting to do so. You know what Israel is also good at. Propaganda and creating fake intelligence. Israel has for almost 30 years now argued that Iran is just a year away from nuclear weapons and the US must instantly attack Iran. Iran had no plan to develop anything and wanted civilian nuclear power, complete controlled by France in terms of import and export of nuclear fuel. When this was blocked Iran moved said, well I guess we will invest in this ourself. Once they had the started capability to do so, again with no evidence of developing nuclear weapons Israel/US started the assassinate Iranian scientists, create one of the most aggressive sanctions programs in world history and a whole host of other things such as stuxnet. Despite multiple US intelligence agencies saying there was no evidence of a nuclear weapons program and many expert predicting Iran had no such plans. Iran eventually agree to the most extreme observation of their nuclear program that any nation has ever agree on in history of nuclear agreements. And this program was active for quite a while, and found no evidence what so ever that there had ever been a nuclear program. Basically all expert saying that it was practically impossible for them to have a nuclear weapons program with those safegurads in control. The US then left an international agreement, despite every other nation that was part of the agreement agree that Iran had behaved perfectly within the agreement. Iran was certified multiple times of having not engaged in any activity that was not allowed in the agreement. And even after the US left the agreement, Iran and the other nations still hold to the agreement and safeguards are still in place. So this idea that Iran is this big danger is simply propaganda pushed by Israel mostly and other US interests who hate Iran for various reasons. What really mind blowing about this whole 'Iran nuclear controversy' is that ironical Isreal IS ACTUALLY nuclear rough state. Iran is a signatory of the NPT while Israel is not. But of course them having them is just fine and proper, but anybody else getting them existential thread. But that argument of course is never allowed to be made the other way around. If there is a state of rebellious fanatics that repress large parts of their population that is a thread to the world, I know what state I would pick. And if I were the neighbour of such a state, I be very concerned. It is Israel actually that has invaded other countries repeatedly far more often then they were invaded. Just about right now that Biden might even consider even possible reopening negotiations, the propaganda machine is pumping out this garbage again.