3 ms·

Competing with Twitch is not realistic and I’m surprised you think it’s bad. Facebook and Microsoft have both spent huge sums of money trying to and failed. And

by waprin 6y ago

Competing with Twitch is not realistic and I’m surprised you think it’s bad. Facebook and Microsoft have both spent huge sums of money trying to and failed. And both those companies have deep engineering talent which GameStop does not and it will not be trivial to compete with those companies for engineers. Plus livestream is just really expensive in terms of compute and network costs. Finally and most importantly, Twitch has more network effects than people realize with its follower/subscriber ecosystem. Streamers spend a lot of time building that audience and make more money than you might expect when they do it, so it won’t be easy to pull them away.

Judgmentality 6y ago
Everybody I know that uses twitch hates it. Like seriously, it's really bad. The conversations streamers have on discord are very different from what they'll say while streaming. They use it because there is no alternative. I am well aware that others have tried to compete and failed. But there is a market and nobody likes the only player. Eventually somebody is going to figure it out. And I am extremely confident it won't be Amazon. I'd short twitch in a heartbeat if it weren't propped up by the most valuable company on Earth.
- candybar 6y ago
  What in particular do they hate about twitch and what type of streamers are they? (top, emerging, casual, etc). I too hear a lot of complaints about Twitch too but I feel that most of them have nothing to do with the product, but the zero-sum and competitive nature of gaming streaming. It's just difficult to succeed as a gaming streamer (or content creator more generally) and the vast majority of people who try will never make any meaningful amounts of money, so frustrations tend to be attributed to the arbitrary quirks of the platform, even though that's just the nature of any content business.
  - Judgmentality 6y ago
    > What in particular do they hate about twitch and what type of streamers are they? (top, emerging, casual, etc). Everything and everyone. Seriously, even the people making literally millions on twitch hate the DMCA takedowns, the completely capricious bans, the ridiculous barrage of forced ads which twitch has straight up lied about, the fact that Amazon streamed anti-union ads on twitch and then pretended it was an accident, the fact that titty streamers get special priveleges...and that's what I thought of in just 30 seconds off the top of my head. twitch is fucking awful because it's owned by Amazon. It was great before the acquisition and shortly thereafter. I never said it was easy. I'm saying twitch fucking sucks and when somebody makes something that doesn't suck it will instantly be an 11 digit market cap company. Right now the most likely contender is Gamestop, even if I'd only put that at about a 1% chance of happening.
    - candybar 6y ago
      I don't see how any of these are deal-breakers for the viewers and if the viewers are there, the streamers aren't going anywhere. The network effect is real - it doesn't matter how good your streaming platform is if no one is using it.
      - Judgmentality 6y ago
        People are leaving twitch because it's so bad. Unfortunately I can't share that data with you, so I don't expect you to believe me. Anyway, let's agree to disagree because we're not finding common ground here.
        candybar 6y ago
        Where are they going?
        Judgmentality 6y ago
        Netflix? Books? Youtube? They're giving up on streaming because they hate twitch that much.
- jasonwatkinspdx 6y ago
  This is a very poor assessment. I'd suggest watching some Devin Nash videos. Whoever you're talking to on discord is not giving you a complete picture. Twitch is essentially a hardcore user's platform. Engagement is extremely high vs other platforms. That's what keeps content creators on twitch, even if they're making the bulk of their income from putting the VODs on youtube: they can't create the same content and interactions on other platforms. Again, as explained in a sibling comment, competing against twitch is a terrible opportunity. It's a miserable business to try to make a profit margin on, and your #1 competition doesn't care if twitch loses money all day. The ad market for streamers is all wonky because so much of the content is radioactively toxic.
syshum 6y ago
>> Facebook and Microsoft have both spent huge sums of money trying to and failed. That does not mean it is not possible, it is not shocking to me that large institutions like Facebook and MS could not compete even with their deep pockets. you seem to have conflated Money with creativity, and/or vision. it will not be a Microsoft of Facebook that will topple twitch or you tube, it will be a startup of some kind that is completely removed from Corporate culture and the extreme chains on innovation that large companies have

by waprin 6y ago

Judgmentality 6y ago

Everybody I know that uses twitch hates it. Like seriously, it's really bad. The conversations streamers have on discord are very different from what they'll say while streaming. They use it because there is no alternative. I am well aware that others have tried to compete and failed. But there is a market and nobody likes the only player. Eventually somebody is going to figure it out. And I am extremely confident it won't be Amazon. I'd short twitch in a heartbeat if it weren't propped up by the most valuable company on Earth.

candybar 6y ago
What in particular do they hate about twitch and what type of streamers are they? (top, emerging, casual, etc). I too hear a lot of complaints about Twitch too but I feel that most of them have nothing to do with the product, but the zero-sum and competitive nature of gaming streaming. It's just difficult to succeed as a gaming streamer (or content creator more generally) and the vast majority of people who try will never make any meaningful amounts of money, so frustrations tend to be attributed to the arbitrary quirks of the platform, even though that's just the nature of any content business.
- Judgmentality 6y ago
  > What in particular do they hate about twitch and what type of streamers are they? (top, emerging, casual, etc). Everything and everyone. Seriously, even the people making literally millions on twitch hate the DMCA takedowns, the completely capricious bans, the ridiculous barrage of forced ads which twitch has straight up lied about, the fact that Amazon streamed anti-union ads on twitch and then pretended it was an accident, the fact that titty streamers get special priveleges...and that's what I thought of in just 30 seconds off the top of my head. twitch is fucking awful because it's owned by Amazon. It was great before the acquisition and shortly thereafter. I never said it was easy. I'm saying twitch fucking sucks and when somebody makes something that doesn't suck it will instantly be an 11 digit market cap company. Right now the most likely contender is Gamestop, even if I'd only put that at about a 1% chance of happening.
  - candybar 6y ago
    I don't see how any of these are deal-breakers for the viewers and if the viewers are there, the streamers aren't going anywhere. The network effect is real - it doesn't matter how good your streaming platform is if no one is using it.
    - Judgmentality 6y ago
      People are leaving twitch because it's so bad. Unfortunately I can't share that data with you, so I don't expect you to believe me. Anyway, let's agree to disagree because we're not finding common ground here.
      - candybar 6y ago
        Where are they going?
        Judgmentality 6y ago
        Netflix? Books? Youtube? They're giving up on streaming because they hate twitch that much.
jasonwatkinspdx 6y ago
This is a very poor assessment. I'd suggest watching some Devin Nash videos. Whoever you're talking to on discord is not giving you a complete picture. Twitch is essentially a hardcore user's platform. Engagement is extremely high vs other platforms. That's what keeps content creators on twitch, even if they're making the bulk of their income from putting the VODs on youtube: they can't create the same content and interactions on other platforms. Again, as explained in a sibling comment, competing against twitch is a terrible opportunity. It's a miserable business to try to make a profit margin on, and your #1 competition doesn't care if twitch loses money all day. The ad market for streamers is all wonky because so much of the content is radioactively toxic.

syshum 6y ago

>> Facebook and Microsoft have both spent huge sums of money trying to and failed. That does not mean it is not possible, it is not shocking to me that large institutions like Facebook and MS could not compete even with their deep pockets. you seem to have conflated Money with creativity, and/or vision. it will not be a Microsoft of Facebook that will topple twitch or you tube, it will be a startup of some kind that is completely removed from Corporate culture and the extreme chains on innovation that large companies have