11 ms·

FairEmail: Open-source, privacy friendly email app for Android

234 points by mpsq 6y ago

sebsauvage 6y ago
I have been using this email app for months, with 4 different email providers. It works like a charm, it's snappy, and privacy-oriented (preview links before opening them, block pixel tracking, and lot of other clever features.) Oh and the developer is very active (several versions a week), very kind and answers very quickly. One of the best bargains. (I bought the full version)
- mahathu 6y ago
  > preview links before opening them I noticed this feature in the default macOS mail App too but I'm not quite sure I understand correctly. If you click on the little arrow next to a link, it opens the website in a little window -- from a privacy/security POV, is that really helpful? Wouldn't the sender know you read the E-Mail if my computer sends a request to their server using that URL, no matter if it's for a preview window or my actual browser (except the latter has cookies etc)
  - g_p 6y ago
    In FairEmail, the "preview" is to show you exactly what URL is about to be opened, and give you the chance to force it to HTTPS, or remove known tracking parameters from it. It also warns you prominently if the link's text differs from the target address, and allows you to pick which you actually want to visit (good for newsletters that mangle links for click tracking, but which show the raw link in the text). Tapping a link will pop this box up, without the site being alerted, giving you the chance to decide whether you want to actually visit it or not.
- muppetman 6y ago
  You've typed exactly what I was going to type, except I only use it for 3 providers.
- Assossa 6y ago
  The developer is so active that it is actually annoying for me. I get a notification to update my client almost every time I open the app.
pw6hv 6y ago
Just switched from K9-mail to FairEmail. I was using the Google Play version of K9 so at the moment I am quite happy of the switch. There is only one thing that I did not manage to find in FairEmail which is the ability to read the header of emails. Like the whole information, from SPF, DKIM validation and so on. Does anyone know if it's possible to get this? For the moment I am planning to stay with FairEmail and maybe one day try the F-Droid version of K9 as I heard it has evolved a lot in the recent times.
- dlkmp 6y ago
  I'm using the FDroid version of K9. What do you like from FairEmail over K9?
  - pw6hv 6y ago
    I've been on the Google Play version of K9 for years and I must say that it was perfectly fine. I changed to FairEmail as I thought having a very old version of an email client might not be ideal from a security perspective. At the moment the biggest change from my workflow is the UI, which looks better that the old K9. Now I am not switching to K9 F-Droid version just because I am lazy to configure everything again another time. But please bear in mind that my way of using email on my phone is very minimal. I usually just need something to read and for most of my productivity task I use mutt.
    - stonesweep 6y ago
      We had a HN thread a few weeks back on the K-9 Donations blog, basically the K-9 Play version is still the old client UI (but the betas are not 100% feature complete); you can opt-in to the K-9 beta on Play or F-Droid and get the new UI experience if some features like IMAP IDLE are not that important to you. (side comment, the new K-9 betas allow export/import of settings but not sure about the older version you're currently using)
      - tjoff 6y ago
        The old ones have export/import as well.
bantunes 6y ago
Good it's open source and all that, but it's very hard to use and parse what's on the screen.
- burundi_coffee 6y ago
  I agree, which is why I stuck with the default email app that comes with LineageOS for now.
- feanaro 6y ago
  Indeed, this is the only pain point I have with FairEmail. I would love it if a skilled designer overhauled the interface.
- sgc 6y ago
  Yeah, I had to tweak a lot of settings to make it more readable. I still don't have everything perfectly the way I would like. But it is highly configurable.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
Snetry 6y ago
I've been using FreeMail for a while now and I can only say that its a fantastic app. The setup and settings are a bit unintuitive but despite that its great
kop316 6y ago
I was curious to see if FairEmail could work with OAuth without Google Play (I have a school Google account that does not allow me to log in without OAuth): https://github.com/M66B/FairEmail/blob/master/FAQ.md#user-content-faq111 https://github.com/M66B/FairEmail/blob/master/FAQ.md#user-co... "OAuth for Gmail is supported via the quick setup wizard. The Android account manager will be used to fetch and refresh OAuth tokens for selected on-device accounts. OAuth for non on-device accounts is not supported because Google requires a yearly security audit ($15,000 to $75,000) for this. You can read more about this here." You can see it here too: https://support.google.com/cloud/answer/9110914#zippy=%2Cexceptions-to-verification-requirements%2Cwhen-does-my-app-have-to-be-verified-by-google%2Csecurity-assessment https://support.google.com/cloud/answer/9110914#zippy=%2Cexc...
- pomian 6y ago
  Using both this and k9 without Google play or any Google. They work great. But both of them, no longer allow storing your mail and/or attachments on 'external' or SD card. That is frustrating. This anti feature, just started in the last few months.
  - llarsson 6y ago
    Could be a new API that needs to be supported. I just downloaded another app (NewPipe) that let me specifically choose some new API that made its external storage permissions work.
  - kop316 6y ago
    I use k9 right now for my fastmaol account, and that works fine. I just can't use my school account that is gmail. I'm not sure how you're using it?
- antman 6y ago
  No thanks for me, my gmail account will always remain disconnected from anything else. Better have alternative google accounts for logins, android apps etc which are not tied to primary especially on the phone.
- 6y ago
CuriousNinja 6y ago
Does IMAP clients handle Gmail labels well? Last time I tried to use an IMAP client it treated all the labels as separate folders.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- kitsunesoba 6y ago
  I may be wrong but my understanding is that this is just a limitation of Gmail's IMAP implementation. Every IMAP client I've tried so far displays tags as separate folders.
- gtf21 6y ago
  I think this is down to the way Google implemented labels. I looked into this when I moved all my email off Google's servers and noticed they just list them as folders on IMAP, so a client would have to implement a special google-specific way of dealing with them. There are other ways to implement labels in IMAP (I've forgotten the exact details but I did it successfully while interacting with the IMAP server using `openssl s_client`).
- contravariant 6y ago
  If you mean the [IMAP]/Read kind of labels then yeah it handles those properly.
curt15 6y ago
K-9 Mail had some difficulty getting IMAP IDLE to work with Android's Doze. Does FairEmail fare better?
- g_p 6y ago
  Yes, this is probably the biggest feature of FairEmail. If your server supports IDLE, it will work well. I've got it working with 3 different backend mail servers, and I'm told by friends that it actually receives mail faster than the official Gmail Android app (which had access to Google push servers). FairEmail will ask you to disable doze for it, but don't be concerned - it's a very power efficient solution and it doesn't impact on battery. It even works out its own back-off timers for keepalives to minimise wakes.
meremortals 6y ago
I've been loving FairEmail for the last 6 months
mike-cardwell 6y ago
Can somebody with access to an Android phone test out this client with https://www.emailprivacytester.com https://www.emailprivacytester.com and report back please.
- ivann 6y ago
  The only test turning red for me was the "DNS Prefetch - Anchor" one.
throwaway81523 6y ago
I'm using F-droid K-9 and am happy with it. What would be the point of switching? If the new thing is flat-out better then it might be worth considering, but I haven't seen any explanation of this.
- g_p 6y ago
  IMAP IDLE push support for any server that supports it, good configurability in settings for a wide range of advanced power user features, and good private-by-default settings (avoiding and blocking tracking pixels/images in emails, and stripping known tracking parameters from links you click, etc.) Those would be my top 3 personally.
  - tadfisher 6y ago
    IDLE is especially difficult on recent Android versions without a hosted service piping through FCM. You may be able to get away with a foreground service that displays a permanent notification, but I believe Android 11 or 12 limits even those services so you cannot have a persistent process keeping a socket open. Power usage would be an interesting problem as well, because I'm not sure if keeping a socket open would pin the radio active.
    - g_p 6y ago
      I haven't had any issues on Android 11 with FairEmail using a foreground service. I believe that the changes coming in 12 are able to be worked around though, and at minimum a version distributed outside of the Play Store won't be affected. There's some get-outs to Google's changes at least as they stand right now, but who knows if that will remain the case in subsequent versions. I haven't seen any suggestion the radio is being pinned active - it seems to still sleep fine, and I believe an incoming messages triggers a downlink page to the phone, which will then wake the radio to deliver the packets.
  - licebmi__at__ 6y ago
    Doesn't k9 already supports IDLE? I kinda remember researching about this years ago, unfortunately, IDLE on it's own is no equivalent to native push notifications that use google services. Either way, it was just a hobby research and I might be wrong.
cassepipe 6y ago
I was wondering it seems like when you get a mail app, Android ends up storing that mail address as an account in the account section of the parameters. Is there a way to avoid this ?
- g_p 6y ago
  Just checked on mine and no FairEmail email account is listed in the accounts list in Android - it's all handled in-app.
  - cassepipe 6y ago
    Beautiful. Thank you.
- tadfisher 6y ago
  This is the user interface to the AccountManager API, which is one of the standard mechanisms to manage auth tokens and background sync. IIRC it's been around since Android 1.0 and it's probably not a useful vector for third-party tracking.
  - tjoff 6y ago
    Why not? Being the standard way of doing it since beginning of time is just an argument for why it is a useful source to steal contact information and track users.
spacebeer 6y ago
I've been using FairEmail for some time (premium version, F-Droid) and it is great. I have my main IMAP account there But I also use K-9 Mail (beta, from F-Droid). It is easier for me to handle multiple (secondary) accounts with K9, than FE
Animats 6y ago
I've been running that for years.
rexreed 6y ago
Am I a weirdo for using POP mail on an Android? I don't trust any third party with storing my email. Is there a reason why I should move to IMAP? I mean I know the technical reasons. But it says on the FairEmail page: "FairEmail might be for you if you value your privacy." and also says "works with virtually all email providers, including Gmail, Outlook and Yahoo!" For me, privacy is more than what's on the client - the server matters too. POP has seemed to work for me for 25+ yrs.
- lisper 6y ago
  If you don't trust your provider then POP won't help you because you can't trust them not to keep copies. The only solution is to run your own SMTP server, at which point you might as well use IMAP.
  - rexreed 6y ago
    I'm in control of my server (host) which is a shared-hosting account. While it is possible for them to store copies of the email, it is much more cumbersome for them to do that than if I just had my entire IMAP store residing on their server. For POP copies to work, they would have to purposefully copy and store all the email, whereas with IMAP they would just need to query the data store.
    - lisper 6y ago
      Ah, so you do trust them. You trust that they are too lazy to take the initiative to keep a copy, but merely untrustworthy enough that they might sneak a peek if they can do so without having to put forth even the minor effort of making backups of the spool directories. Fair enough, but that strikes me as a very odd risk posture to take. Either your email privacy is valuable to you, in which case I would think you would want to protect it against non-lazy people as well, or it isn't, in which case what difference does it make? But it's obviously your call.
      - deleted 6y ago
        [deleted]
hnarn 6y ago
While I applaud any effort to make email more usable and secure, I can't escape the feeling that email is quickly becoming the new snail mail. It seems most people only use it for very "official" communication, or communication with more or less autonomous services, while using other channels for almost everything else. For me at least, email is moving into the same space as a phone number: something you know you need to reliably have, but you'd throw out in a minute if you could get away with it.
ancarda 6y ago
Is anyone else getting this error on F-Droid? Download failed! The requested file was not found. https://f-droid.org/repo/eu.faircode.email_1518.apk How can I download this app? I use K-9 Mail at the moment, but I'd like to try this to see if it's any better.
- rhamzeh 6y ago
  Sometimes, the FDroid client errors out. Some steps I generally found helpful to fix this issue were: - Refresh the repos (pull down to refresh) - Reduce the caching thresold (Settings => Other (Bottom of the screen) => Keep Cached Apps) - Wait for a bit then try again You can also always download this directly from the browser.
  - ancarda 6y ago
    I cleared F-Droid's cache and data. After an hour, I still can't download it :(
  - mdaniel 6y ago
    I got so fed up with the F-Droid client that I moved to Foxy Droid, which I ironically installed via F-Droid: > Foxy Droid (Yet another F-Droid client) - https://f-droid.org/packages/nya.kitsunyan.foxydroid https://f-droid.org/packages/nya.kitsunyan.foxydroid I believe there are a few other clients too but I just like Foxy so far
- severine 6y ago
  Same error, for several different apps, since yesterday.
- unilock 6y ago
  I fixed this by disabling all mirrors except f-droid.org for the official F-Droid repo. (Settings > Repositories > F-Droid > Official mirrors)
Black101 6y ago
been using this app for months... my favorite email app in this current market.
aasasd 6y ago
Am I the only one who can't make FairMail deliver mail faster than 15-20 minutes? The notification is on, the battery optimization for the app is off, still nothing. K9 actually receives the message earlier, despite not having a persistent notification.
- RedComet 6y ago
  I was having the same issue when I last used it.
- artificialLimbs 6y ago
  Same. It also drank my battery juice like an electroholic.
- mdaniel 6y ago
  Have you opened an issue for that behavior? I haven't looked at the repo's issue reporting policy, but my experience says that telling HN isn't nearly as effective as telling the issue tracker. I would be especially interested in knowing if that happens in a DeGoogled setup, versus on "normal" Android
  - aasasd 6y ago
    > isn't nearly as effective as telling the issue tracker I don't agree with this conjecture, at all. After seeing plenty of projects with hundreds of open issues, I don't create them anymore unless I'm ready to submit a patch, or it's just a quick question. Whereas here in a thread that will be out of sight by tomorrow, it's a no-brainer—two people answered already. FairEmail makes this decision even easier by 1) promoting its paid version, which I didn't buy and thus am not in a position to demand anything; and 2) not having an issue tracker in the first place.
- g_p 6y ago
  This sounds like you are having an issue with the notifications. Does your server support IMAP IDLE? I'm wondering whether K9 is polling for email, and the server isn't supporting push messages via IDLE.
dane-pgp 6y ago
It's interesting that the FAQ says: > FairEmail will send the Autocrypt header for use by other email clients, but only for signed and encrypted messages because too many email servers have problems with the often long Autocrypt header. That might be out of date, now that Autocrypt version 1.1 has been published: > the 1.0 version of the Level 1 spec mandated RSA 3072 keys for ecosystem reasons and only the more recent 1.1 version from February 2019 now mandates that the new default scheme for creating Autocrypt keys is Curve 25519 keys. https://autocrypt.org/faq.html#why-also-rsa3072-and-not-only-curve-25519-keys https://autocrypt.org/faq.html#why-also-rsa3072-and-not-only...
safaci2000 6y ago
it looks like a cool project though what I'd love to see is some solution that makes PGP/Secure Email more accessible to the common person. I know hushmail, tutanota, and protonmail are all around, but still only works if everyone is on the same service. it's interesting how secure email has been solved decades ago (how to do it) but making it accessible has been an ongoing struggle. :( Anyone ran across a more tangible solution for the common man?
- muppetman 6y ago
  Why use PGP when there are such better alternatives these days? Signal springs to mind immediately. PGP is clunky in every way. I know I can readily communicate with almost every one of my workmates securely using Signal or WhatsApp. None of them would have anything other than a passing idea of what PGP was, or how to use it. 20 years ago when there was no better solution, PGP was great. But I think it's probably had its time in the spotlight and now the world has moved on, when it comes to using it to secure email. I think the solution is that if you want to communicate in a secure manner, don't use email.
  - forgotmypw17 6y ago
    PGP has support for every language, client, and platform one may be using. It,s time tested and the most widely adopted standard. It supports plaintext. Signal has support for... Signal.
    - muppetman 6y ago
      None of those points detract from the fact PGP is a complex nightmare to use. There's a reason millions of people have Signal/WhatsApp installed and not PGP. Even Media organisations have ditched it in favour of things like Securedrop (and/or Signal). I'd argue that Signal is much more widely adopted that PGP ever was.
      - forgotmypw17 6y ago
        I agree that a good interface is missing... But the protocol has all the capabilities needed. Nor is full support of every feature needed by every client. I think from a crypto strength perspective, it,s silly to reinvent the same thing over again. (The thing being basic PKI of just public/private keys and signed/encrypted messages.)
jesse_m 6y ago
I love this app. I really like how it shows you tracking images and stuff in the emails.
andrewshadura 6y ago
No JMAP support?
- syncbehind 6y ago
  Does anything have JMAP support outside of Fastmail?
  - andrewshadura 6y ago
    Yes.
  - Mailtemi 6y ago
    Here is a link to support him. https://github.com/jmapio/jmap/blob/master/software/software.mdown https://github.com/jmapio/jmap/blob/master/software/software... As far as I know, at least one of the European countries requires it for some new projects.
doc_gunthrop 6y ago
FYI this is by the same developer who authored the popular NetGuard (https://github.com/M66B/NetGuard https://github.com/M66B/NetGuard) for Android.
- _e 6y ago
  ... and M66B developed XPrivacyLua: https://github.com/M66B/XPrivacyLua https://github.com/M66B/XPrivacyLua it spoofs and restricts Android API calls made by apps.
cassepipe 6y ago
Just bought the premium features because this is both simple and well thought and works very well. I really like it.
saagarjha 6y ago
Scrolled down to the bottom to look at the screenshots, but they look mildly stretched to me. Is anyone else seeing this?
fungos 6y ago
I've been using SimpleMail. Seems to have all the same features as FairEmail but without banners and paid Pro-version.
- aorth 6y ago
  Do you mean SimpleEmail? https://framagit.org/dystopia-project/simple-email https://framagit.org/dystopia-project/simple-email It kinda looks like it is based on FairEmail...? Even parts of the readme have the same language. edit: it seems it is a fork. This is addressed in the SimpleEmail FAQ: https://framagit.org/dystopia-project/simple-email/blob/master/docs/FAQ.md#what-is-the-difference-between-simpleemail-and-fairemail https://framagit.org/dystopia-project/simple-email/blob/mast...
sundbry 6y ago
It looks great, I want to give it a try over K-9 Mail. Your f-droid apk link looks broken however: https://hostux.pics/image/screenshot-20210308-194330.ulO https://hostux.pics/image/screenshot-20210308-194330.ulO
igorstellar 6y ago
This is amazing, happy to support! I have a question: when developing an app with strong privacy guarantees, how do you handle analytics and crash reporting? E.g what if some group of users gets some weird error in a use case, or what if the app crashes? How do you figure and fix such issues? Many thanks for the app!

234 points by mpsq 6y ago

I have been using this email app for months, with 4 different email providers. It works like a charm, it's snappy, and privacy-oriented (preview links before opening them, block pixel tracking, and lot of other clever features.) Oh and the developer is very active (several versions a week), very kind and answers very quickly. One of the best bargains. (I bought the full version)

mahathu 6y ago
> preview links before opening them I noticed this feature in the default macOS mail App too but I'm not quite sure I understand correctly. If you click on the little arrow next to a link, it opens the website in a little window -- from a privacy/security POV, is that really helpful? Wouldn't the sender know you read the E-Mail if my computer sends a request to their server using that URL, no matter if it's for a preview window or my actual browser (except the latter has cookies etc)
- g_p 6y ago
  In FairEmail, the "preview" is to show you exactly what URL is about to be opened, and give you the chance to force it to HTTPS, or remove known tracking parameters from it. It also warns you prominently if the link's text differs from the target address, and allows you to pick which you actually want to visit (good for newsletters that mangle links for click tracking, but which show the raw link in the text). Tapping a link will pop this box up, without the site being alerted, giving you the chance to decide whether you want to actually visit it or not.
muppetman 6y ago
You've typed exactly what I was going to type, except I only use it for 3 providers.
Assossa 6y ago
The developer is so active that it is actually annoying for me. I get a notification to update my client almost every time I open the app.

pw6hv 6y ago

Just switched from K9-mail to FairEmail. I was using the Google Play version of K9 so at the moment I am quite happy of the switch. There is only one thing that I did not manage to find in FairEmail which is the ability to read the header of emails. Like the whole information, from SPF, DKIM validation and so on. Does anyone know if it's possible to get this? For the moment I am planning to stay with FairEmail and maybe one day try the F-Droid version of K9 as I heard it has evolved a lot in the recent times.

dlkmp 6y ago
I'm using the FDroid version of K9. What do you like from FairEmail over K9?
- pw6hv 6y ago
  I've been on the Google Play version of K9 for years and I must say that it was perfectly fine. I changed to FairEmail as I thought having a very old version of an email client might not be ideal from a security perspective. At the moment the biggest change from my workflow is the UI, which looks better that the old K9. Now I am not switching to K9 F-Droid version just because I am lazy to configure everything again another time. But please bear in mind that my way of using email on my phone is very minimal. I usually just need something to read and for most of my productivity task I use mutt.
  - stonesweep 6y ago
    We had a HN thread a few weeks back on the K-9 Donations blog, basically the K-9 Play version is still the old client UI (but the betas are not 100% feature complete); you can opt-in to the K-9 beta on Play or F-Droid and get the new UI experience if some features like IMAP IDLE are not that important to you. (side comment, the new K-9 betas allow export/import of settings but not sure about the older version you're currently using)
    - tjoff 6y ago
      The old ones have export/import as well.

bantunes 6y ago

Good it's open source and all that, but it's very hard to use and parse what's on the screen.

burundi_coffee 6y ago
I agree, which is why I stuck with the default email app that comes with LineageOS for now.
feanaro 6y ago
Indeed, this is the only pain point I have with FairEmail. I would love it if a skilled designer overhauled the interface.
sgc 6y ago
Yeah, I had to tweak a lot of settings to make it more readable. I still don't have everything perfectly the way I would like. But it is highly configurable.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

Snetry 6y ago

I've been using FreeMail for a while now and I can only say that its a fantastic app. The setup and settings are a bit unintuitive but despite that its great

kop316 6y ago

I was curious to see if FairEmail could work with OAuth without Google Play (I have a school Google account that does not allow me to log in without OAuth): https://github.com/M66B/FairEmail/blob/master/FAQ.md#user-content-faq111 https://github.com/M66B/FairEmail/blob/master/FAQ.md#user-co... "OAuth for Gmail is supported via the quick setup wizard. The Android account manager will be used to fetch and refresh OAuth tokens for selected on-device accounts. OAuth for non on-device accounts is not supported because Google requires a yearly security audit ($15,000 to $75,000) for this. You can read more about this here." You can see it here too: https://support.google.com/cloud/answer/9110914#zippy=%2Cexceptions-to-verification-requirements%2Cwhen-does-my-app-have-to-be-verified-by-google%2Csecurity-assessment https://support.google.com/cloud/answer/9110914#zippy=%2Cexc...

pomian 6y ago
Using both this and k9 without Google play or any Google. They work great. But both of them, no longer allow storing your mail and/or attachments on 'external' or SD card. That is frustrating. This anti feature, just started in the last few months.
- llarsson 6y ago
  Could be a new API that needs to be supported. I just downloaded another app (NewPipe) that let me specifically choose some new API that made its external storage permissions work.
- kop316 6y ago
  I use k9 right now for my fastmaol account, and that works fine. I just can't use my school account that is gmail. I'm not sure how you're using it?
antman 6y ago
No thanks for me, my gmail account will always remain disconnected from anything else. Better have alternative google accounts for logins, android apps etc which are not tied to primary especially on the phone.
6y ago

CuriousNinja 6y ago

Does IMAP clients handle Gmail labels well? Last time I tried to use an IMAP client it treated all the labels as separate folders.

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
kitsunesoba 6y ago
I may be wrong but my understanding is that this is just a limitation of Gmail's IMAP implementation. Every IMAP client I've tried so far displays tags as separate folders.
gtf21 6y ago
I think this is down to the way Google implemented labels. I looked into this when I moved all my email off Google's servers and noticed they just list them as folders on IMAP, so a client would have to implement a special google-specific way of dealing with them. There are other ways to implement labels in IMAP (I've forgotten the exact details but I did it successfully while interacting with the IMAP server using `openssl s_client`).
contravariant 6y ago
If you mean the [IMAP]/Read kind of labels then yeah it handles those properly.

curt15 6y ago

K-9 Mail had some difficulty getting IMAP IDLE to work with Android's Doze. Does FairEmail fare better?

g_p 6y ago
Yes, this is probably the biggest feature of FairEmail. If your server supports IDLE, it will work well. I've got it working with 3 different backend mail servers, and I'm told by friends that it actually receives mail faster than the official Gmail Android app (which had access to Google push servers). FairEmail will ask you to disable doze for it, but don't be concerned - it's a very power efficient solution and it doesn't impact on battery. It even works out its own back-off timers for keepalives to minimise wakes.

meremortals 6y ago

I've been loving FairEmail for the last 6 months

mike-cardwell 6y ago

Can somebody with access to an Android phone test out this client with https://www.emailprivacytester.com https://www.emailprivacytester.com and report back please.

ivann 6y ago
The only test turning red for me was the "DNS Prefetch - Anchor" one.

throwaway81523 6y ago

I'm using F-droid K-9 and am happy with it. What would be the point of switching? If the new thing is flat-out better then it might be worth considering, but I haven't seen any explanation of this.

g_p 6y ago
IMAP IDLE push support for any server that supports it, good configurability in settings for a wide range of advanced power user features, and good private-by-default settings (avoiding and blocking tracking pixels/images in emails, and stripping known tracking parameters from links you click, etc.) Those would be my top 3 personally.
- tadfisher 6y ago
  IDLE is especially difficult on recent Android versions without a hosted service piping through FCM. You may be able to get away with a foreground service that displays a permanent notification, but I believe Android 11 or 12 limits even those services so you cannot have a persistent process keeping a socket open. Power usage would be an interesting problem as well, because I'm not sure if keeping a socket open would pin the radio active.
  - g_p 6y ago
    I haven't had any issues on Android 11 with FairEmail using a foreground service. I believe that the changes coming in 12 are able to be worked around though, and at minimum a version distributed outside of the Play Store won't be affected. There's some get-outs to Google's changes at least as they stand right now, but who knows if that will remain the case in subsequent versions. I haven't seen any suggestion the radio is being pinned active - it seems to still sleep fine, and I believe an incoming messages triggers a downlink page to the phone, which will then wake the radio to deliver the packets.
- licebmi__at__ 6y ago
  Doesn't k9 already supports IDLE? I kinda remember researching about this years ago, unfortunately, IDLE on it's own is no equivalent to native push notifications that use google services. Either way, it was just a hobby research and I might be wrong.

cassepipe 6y ago

I was wondering it seems like when you get a mail app, Android ends up storing that mail address as an account in the account section of the parameters. Is there a way to avoid this ?

g_p 6y ago
Just checked on mine and no FairEmail email account is listed in the accounts list in Android - it's all handled in-app.
- cassepipe 6y ago
  Beautiful. Thank you.
tadfisher 6y ago
This is the user interface to the AccountManager API, which is one of the standard mechanisms to manage auth tokens and background sync. IIRC it's been around since Android 1.0 and it's probably not a useful vector for third-party tracking.
- tjoff 6y ago
  Why not? Being the standard way of doing it since beginning of time is just an argument for why it is a useful source to steal contact information and track users.

spacebeer 6y ago

I've been using FairEmail for some time (premium version, F-Droid) and it is great. I have my main IMAP account there But I also use K-9 Mail (beta, from F-Droid). It is easier for me to handle multiple (secondary) accounts with K9, than FE

Animats 6y ago

I've been running that for years.

rexreed 6y ago

Am I a weirdo for using POP mail on an Android? I don't trust any third party with storing my email. Is there a reason why I should move to IMAP? I mean I know the technical reasons. But it says on the FairEmail page: "FairEmail might be for you if you value your privacy." and also says "works with virtually all email providers, including Gmail, Outlook and Yahoo!" For me, privacy is more than what's on the client - the server matters too. POP has seemed to work for me for 25+ yrs.

lisper 6y ago
If you don't trust your provider then POP won't help you because you can't trust them not to keep copies. The only solution is to run your own SMTP server, at which point you might as well use IMAP.
- rexreed 6y ago
  I'm in control of my server (host) which is a shared-hosting account. While it is possible for them to store copies of the email, it is much more cumbersome for them to do that than if I just had my entire IMAP store residing on their server. For POP copies to work, they would have to purposefully copy and store all the email, whereas with IMAP they would just need to query the data store.
  - lisper 6y ago
    Ah, so you do trust them. You trust that they are too lazy to take the initiative to keep a copy, but merely untrustworthy enough that they might sneak a peek if they can do so without having to put forth even the minor effort of making backups of the spool directories. Fair enough, but that strikes me as a very odd risk posture to take. Either your email privacy is valuable to you, in which case I would think you would want to protect it against non-lazy people as well, or it isn't, in which case what difference does it make? But it's obviously your call.
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]

hnarn 6y ago

While I applaud any effort to make email more usable and secure, I can't escape the feeling that email is quickly becoming the new snail mail. It seems most people only use it for very "official" communication, or communication with more or less autonomous services, while using other channels for almost everything else. For me at least, email is moving into the same space as a phone number: something you know you need to reliably have, but you'd throw out in a minute if you could get away with it.

ancarda 6y ago

Is anyone else getting this error on F-Droid? Download failed! The requested file was not found. https://f-droid.org/repo/eu.faircode.email_1518.apk How can I download this app? I use K-9 Mail at the moment, but I'd like to try this to see if it's any better.

rhamzeh 6y ago
Sometimes, the FDroid client errors out. Some steps I generally found helpful to fix this issue were: - Refresh the repos (pull down to refresh) - Reduce the caching thresold (Settings => Other (Bottom of the screen) => Keep Cached Apps) - Wait for a bit then try again You can also always download this directly from the browser.
- ancarda 6y ago
  I cleared F-Droid's cache and data. After an hour, I still can't download it :(
- mdaniel 6y ago
  I got so fed up with the F-Droid client that I moved to Foxy Droid, which I ironically installed via F-Droid: > Foxy Droid (Yet another F-Droid client) - https://f-droid.org/packages/nya.kitsunyan.foxydroid https://f-droid.org/packages/nya.kitsunyan.foxydroid I believe there are a few other clients too but I just like Foxy so far
severine 6y ago
Same error, for several different apps, since yesterday.
unilock 6y ago
I fixed this by disabling all mirrors except f-droid.org for the official F-Droid repo. (Settings > Repositories > F-Droid > Official mirrors)

Black101 6y ago

been using this app for months... my favorite email app in this current market.

aasasd 6y ago

Am I the only one who can't make FairMail deliver mail faster than 15-20 minutes? The notification is on, the battery optimization for the app is off, still nothing. K9 actually receives the message earlier, despite not having a persistent notification.

RedComet 6y ago
I was having the same issue when I last used it.
artificialLimbs 6y ago
Same. It also drank my battery juice like an electroholic.
mdaniel 6y ago
Have you opened an issue for that behavior? I haven't looked at the repo's issue reporting policy, but my experience says that telling HN isn't nearly as effective as telling the issue tracker. I would be especially interested in knowing if that happens in a DeGoogled setup, versus on "normal" Android
- aasasd 6y ago
  > isn't nearly as effective as telling the issue tracker I don't agree with this conjecture, at all. After seeing plenty of projects with hundreds of open issues, I don't create them anymore unless I'm ready to submit a patch, or it's just a quick question. Whereas here in a thread that will be out of sight by tomorrow, it's a no-brainer—two people answered already. FairEmail makes this decision even easier by 1) promoting its paid version, which I didn't buy and thus am not in a position to demand anything; and 2) not having an issue tracker in the first place.
g_p 6y ago
This sounds like you are having an issue with the notifications. Does your server support IMAP IDLE? I'm wondering whether K9 is polling for email, and the server isn't supporting push messages via IDLE.

dane-pgp 6y ago

It's interesting that the FAQ says: > FairEmail will send the Autocrypt header for use by other email clients, but only for signed and encrypted messages because too many email servers have problems with the often long Autocrypt header. That might be out of date, now that Autocrypt version 1.1 has been published: > the 1.0 version of the Level 1 spec mandated RSA 3072 keys for ecosystem reasons and only the more recent 1.1 version from February 2019 now mandates that the new default scheme for creating Autocrypt keys is Curve 25519 keys. https://autocrypt.org/faq.html#why-also-rsa3072-and-not-only-curve-25519-keys https://autocrypt.org/faq.html#why-also-rsa3072-and-not-only...

safaci2000 6y ago

it looks like a cool project though what I'd love to see is some solution that makes PGP/Secure Email more accessible to the common person. I know hushmail, tutanota, and protonmail are all around, but still only works if everyone is on the same service. it's interesting how secure email has been solved decades ago (how to do it) but making it accessible has been an ongoing struggle. :( Anyone ran across a more tangible solution for the common man?

muppetman 6y ago
Why use PGP when there are such better alternatives these days? Signal springs to mind immediately. PGP is clunky in every way. I know I can readily communicate with almost every one of my workmates securely using Signal or WhatsApp. None of them would have anything other than a passing idea of what PGP was, or how to use it. 20 years ago when there was no better solution, PGP was great. But I think it's probably had its time in the spotlight and now the world has moved on, when it comes to using it to secure email. I think the solution is that if you want to communicate in a secure manner, don't use email.
- forgotmypw17 6y ago
  PGP has support for every language, client, and platform one may be using. It,s time tested and the most widely adopted standard. It supports plaintext. Signal has support for... Signal.
  - muppetman 6y ago
    None of those points detract from the fact PGP is a complex nightmare to use. There's a reason millions of people have Signal/WhatsApp installed and not PGP. Even Media organisations have ditched it in favour of things like Securedrop (and/or Signal). I'd argue that Signal is much more widely adopted that PGP ever was.
    - forgotmypw17 6y ago
      I agree that a good interface is missing... But the protocol has all the capabilities needed. Nor is full support of every feature needed by every client. I think from a crypto strength perspective, it,s silly to reinvent the same thing over again. (The thing being basic PKI of just public/private keys and signed/encrypted messages.)

jesse_m 6y ago

I love this app. I really like how it shows you tracking images and stuff in the emails.

andrewshadura 6y ago

No JMAP support?

syncbehind 6y ago
Does anything have JMAP support outside of Fastmail?
- andrewshadura 6y ago
  Yes.
- Mailtemi 6y ago
  Here is a link to support him. https://github.com/jmapio/jmap/blob/master/software/software.mdown https://github.com/jmapio/jmap/blob/master/software/software... As far as I know, at least one of the European countries requires it for some new projects.

doc_gunthrop 6y ago

FYI this is by the same developer who authored the popular NetGuard (https://github.com/M66B/NetGuard https://github.com/M66B/NetGuard) for Android.

_e 6y ago
... and M66B developed XPrivacyLua: https://github.com/M66B/XPrivacyLua https://github.com/M66B/XPrivacyLua it spoofs and restricts Android API calls made by apps.

cassepipe 6y ago

Just bought the premium features because this is both simple and well thought and works very well. I really like it.

saagarjha 6y ago

Scrolled down to the bottom to look at the screenshots, but they look mildly stretched to me. Is anyone else seeing this?

fungos 6y ago

I've been using SimpleMail. Seems to have all the same features as FairEmail but without banners and paid Pro-version.

aorth 6y ago
Do you mean SimpleEmail? https://framagit.org/dystopia-project/simple-email https://framagit.org/dystopia-project/simple-email It kinda looks like it is based on FairEmail...? Even parts of the readme have the same language. edit: it seems it is a fork. This is addressed in the SimpleEmail FAQ: https://framagit.org/dystopia-project/simple-email/blob/master/docs/FAQ.md#what-is-the-difference-between-simpleemail-and-fairemail https://framagit.org/dystopia-project/simple-email/blob/mast...

sundbry 6y ago

It looks great, I want to give it a try over K-9 Mail. Your f-droid apk link looks broken however: https://hostux.pics/image/screenshot-20210308-194330.ulO https://hostux.pics/image/screenshot-20210308-194330.ulO

igorstellar 6y ago

This is amazing, happy to support! I have a question: when developing an app with strong privacy guarantees, how do you handle analytics and crash reporting? E.g what if some group of users gets some weird error in a use case, or what if the app crashes? How do you figure and fix such issues? Many thanks for the app!