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I'm not american (Nor european) but I would still be extremely uncomfortable in an all-male shower let alone a unisex shower. I'm curious what you think the re

I'm not american (Nor european) but I would still be extremely uncomfortable in an all-male shower let alone a unisex shower. I'm curious what you think the reasons that nudity is not as big of a deal to Europeans are.

minxomat 6y ago
I mean for one, a nude shower is the standard at pretty much all pools. Gender-separated most of the time, but still. From elementary school swimming lessons (which to be fair happen before pools open to the general public), to attending them as an adult, you drop all clothes when you enter and shower in one big room. Sure there might be partial walls for the extra shy, but most just don't care. Same goes for gym showers. Maybe not the commercial ones, but def sport clubs or similar. As a European (German), not sure what would be uncomfortable about that. The enormous gaps in US toilet stalls are far more terrifying ;-)
- ZephyrBlu 6y ago
  > As a European (German), not sure what would be uncomfortable about that I don't have a rational reason for feeling uncomfortable, nudity just feels very personal to me.
- aksss 6y ago
  > The enormous gaps in US toilet stalls are far more terrifying ADA compliance?
  - souprock 6y ago
    I think he refers to the 1-inch gaps between the stall and the wall, and on the hinge side of the door. He might also refer to the 1-foot gap below the door or the half-inch gap by the door latch. American stalls are also short, so tall people can look right over the top. With gaps so big, why do we bother?
    - aksss 6y ago
      Ohh I see. Yeah, that is a little weird but it’s hard to look in the gaps casually when you’re walking by without being obviously creepy (a friend tells me). Like it seems more visible from the inside where you’re stationary than from the outside in motion.
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
- edgyquant 6y ago
  I’m American and the public pools I’ve been to are mostly not like this. They have individuals “cubicles” that you go into and then you can take close off and shower.
  - refurb 6y ago
    Huh. I’m American and we had a change room at work and all the guys would walk around nude and nobody thought anything of it.
    - edgyquant 6y ago
      You can definitely walk around naked in the pool locker rooms I’ve been to, but they have cubicles so you don’t have to
centimeter 6y ago
I don’t think there’s any complicated explanation; if you are never exposed to a particular state of being (e.g. public nudity) while growing up, it will probably be uncomfortable as an adult if you only have a normal level of openness to new experiences. I don’t think fear of nudity is much different from fear of flying or fear of fear of public speaking or whatever. At least among my friend group, public nudity has never actually been a problem in culturally appropriate circumstances (eg at a public bathhouse or sauna while traveling through Japan or Scandinavia).
- ZephyrBlu 6y ago
  I meant more from a cultural perspective than a purely behavioural one. Just curious if there are some obvious cultural differences which contribute to being brought up with nudity being more normalized.
  - Sebb767 6y ago
    I can only speak for Germany, but nudity is not seen as much of a big deal. Gyms in schools usually have communal changing rooms and it's not unusual to see naked people in movies, even in non-sexual manners. I guess it just never established as a big deal and the relative prevalence of nudity just carries on to the next generation.
  - dalys 6y ago
    For Scandinavia, some things come to mind. Most TV shows and movies have sex scenes. The people having sex are always very average looking. Sex scenes are usually not sexy or romantic but just chaotic and awkward, and very every-day-lifey. Like a middle aged couple having sex in the bedroom and their 5 year old kid opens the door and one of them is chocked and falls out of the bed and breaks a finger. They have to drive to the emergency room and so on, and next scene they enjoy a meal together at home in complete and awkward silence. And a finger in a cast is there as a reminder of the incident. This could be a scene in any TV show airing at 20.00 on public service TV. There's also a lot of nudity without it being sexualized. Like people in saunas or women breastfeeding. Normal every day stuff. For examples check out Love & Anarchy on Netflix, great show with only one short season. Or Bonus Family also on Netflix. Sex education is also a thing. You are taught that of course you should have sex because it's great and fun etc. and here's how to do it safely. Oh and now class, we are going to watch a 1 hour long sex tape with two normal people having sex in a loving way. That was an awkward class to attend. And next class, practicing putting on condoms on dildos, so we all know how to do it. Imagine being 13 and sitting next to some cute girl in your class and having to practice putting on condoms! Compared to other parts of the world where sex and nudity is banned and censored, which is of course ridiculous if you want sexually healthy citizens. If you can only see sex through porn, with smoking hot models, I'm sure it messes with your young mind.
aksss 6y ago
That may get better with age. At some point in my life I stopped having the cycles to care as much about such things. Plenty of people look weird in life, many weirder than you, your value as a person is far higher than how your physique compares to a model. Shared facilities are just functional tools, get in, do ur thing, get out, done.
- Sebb767 6y ago
  I think this is also simply a thing of familiarization. It seems daunting at first, but at the end of the day the others are humans as well, have their flaws and don't have anything on either. Once you're used to communal showers or saunas it ceases to be a big deal, or at least it was for me.
prox 6y ago
Some parts of Europe have a sauna culture, and not uncommon to go with friends (m/f)
- fogihujy 6y ago
  It's probably a part of it. People rarely associate nudity with sex when in a sauna -- it's simply too hot. :D
  - mpfundstein 6y ago
    60 degs sauna are perfect for some hot games ;-)
    - cycomanic 6y ago
      60 deg is not a sauna, it's a mildly warm room. I was actually surprised when moving to Sweden that saunas are typically no more that 65-70 deg and that everyone wears swimwear. Completely different to e.g. Germany.
Kosirich 6y ago
The openness towards nudity amongst Europeans has changed and has been changing significantly. The most noticeable is through the closings or re-brandings of nudist camps as numbers have been falling for years now. There are articles discussing why, but essentially this generation is way more ashamed of their bodies than the previous one. This is mostly apparent among the Germans, French and Scandinavian who were the most open about it.
imbnwa 6y ago
If you've ever been on a wrestling team in America you've showered with other males

minxomat 6y ago

I mean for one, a nude shower is the standard at pretty much all pools. Gender-separated most of the time, but still. From elementary school swimming lessons (which to be fair happen before pools open to the general public), to attending them as an adult, you drop all clothes when you enter and shower in one big room. Sure there might be partial walls for the extra shy, but most just don't care. Same goes for gym showers. Maybe not the commercial ones, but def sport clubs or similar. As a European (German), not sure what would be uncomfortable about that. The enormous gaps in US toilet stalls are far more terrifying ;-)

ZephyrBlu 6y ago
> As a European (German), not sure what would be uncomfortable about that I don't have a rational reason for feeling uncomfortable, nudity just feels very personal to me.
aksss 6y ago
> The enormous gaps in US toilet stalls are far more terrifying ADA compliance?
- souprock 6y ago
  I think he refers to the 1-inch gaps between the stall and the wall, and on the hinge side of the door. He might also refer to the 1-foot gap below the door or the half-inch gap by the door latch. American stalls are also short, so tall people can look right over the top. With gaps so big, why do we bother?
  - aksss 6y ago
    Ohh I see. Yeah, that is a little weird but it’s hard to look in the gaps casually when you’re walking by without being obviously creepy (a friend tells me). Like it seems more visible from the inside where you’re stationary than from the outside in motion.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
edgyquant 6y ago
I’m American and the public pools I’ve been to are mostly not like this. They have individuals “cubicles” that you go into and then you can take close off and shower.
- refurb 6y ago
  Huh. I’m American and we had a change room at work and all the guys would walk around nude and nobody thought anything of it.
  - edgyquant 6y ago
    You can definitely walk around naked in the pool locker rooms I’ve been to, but they have cubicles so you don’t have to

centimeter 6y ago

I don’t think there’s any complicated explanation; if you are never exposed to a particular state of being (e.g. public nudity) while growing up, it will probably be uncomfortable as an adult if you only have a normal level of openness to new experiences. I don’t think fear of nudity is much different from fear of flying or fear of fear of public speaking or whatever. At least among my friend group, public nudity has never actually been a problem in culturally appropriate circumstances (eg at a public bathhouse or sauna while traveling through Japan or Scandinavia).

ZephyrBlu 6y ago
I meant more from a cultural perspective than a purely behavioural one. Just curious if there are some obvious cultural differences which contribute to being brought up with nudity being more normalized.
- Sebb767 6y ago
  I can only speak for Germany, but nudity is not seen as much of a big deal. Gyms in schools usually have communal changing rooms and it's not unusual to see naked people in movies, even in non-sexual manners. I guess it just never established as a big deal and the relative prevalence of nudity just carries on to the next generation.
- dalys 6y ago
  For Scandinavia, some things come to mind. Most TV shows and movies have sex scenes. The people having sex are always very average looking. Sex scenes are usually not sexy or romantic but just chaotic and awkward, and very every-day-lifey. Like a middle aged couple having sex in the bedroom and their 5 year old kid opens the door and one of them is chocked and falls out of the bed and breaks a finger. They have to drive to the emergency room and so on, and next scene they enjoy a meal together at home in complete and awkward silence. And a finger in a cast is there as a reminder of the incident. This could be a scene in any TV show airing at 20.00 on public service TV. There's also a lot of nudity without it being sexualized. Like people in saunas or women breastfeeding. Normal every day stuff. For examples check out Love & Anarchy on Netflix, great show with only one short season. Or Bonus Family also on Netflix. Sex education is also a thing. You are taught that of course you should have sex because it's great and fun etc. and here's how to do it safely. Oh and now class, we are going to watch a 1 hour long sex tape with two normal people having sex in a loving way. That was an awkward class to attend. And next class, practicing putting on condoms on dildos, so we all know how to do it. Imagine being 13 and sitting next to some cute girl in your class and having to practice putting on condoms! Compared to other parts of the world where sex and nudity is banned and censored, which is of course ridiculous if you want sexually healthy citizens. If you can only see sex through porn, with smoking hot models, I'm sure it messes with your young mind.

aksss 6y ago

That may get better with age. At some point in my life I stopped having the cycles to care as much about such things. Plenty of people look weird in life, many weirder than you, your value as a person is far higher than how your physique compares to a model. Shared facilities are just functional tools, get in, do ur thing, get out, done.

Sebb767 6y ago
I think this is also simply a thing of familiarization. It seems daunting at first, but at the end of the day the others are humans as well, have their flaws and don't have anything on either. Once you're used to communal showers or saunas it ceases to be a big deal, or at least it was for me.

prox 6y ago

Some parts of Europe have a sauna culture, and not uncommon to go with friends (m/f)

fogihujy 6y ago
It's probably a part of it. People rarely associate nudity with sex when in a sauna -- it's simply too hot. :D
- mpfundstein 6y ago
  60 degs sauna are perfect for some hot games ;-)
  - cycomanic 6y ago
    60 deg is not a sauna, it's a mildly warm room. I was actually surprised when moving to Sweden that saunas are typically no more that 65-70 deg and that everyone wears swimwear. Completely different to e.g. Germany.

Kosirich 6y ago

The openness towards nudity amongst Europeans has changed and has been changing significantly. The most noticeable is through the closings or re-brandings of nudist camps as numbers have been falling for years now. There are articles discussing why, but essentially this generation is way more ashamed of their bodies than the previous one. This is mostly apparent among the Germans, French and Scandinavian who were the most open about it.

imbnwa 6y ago

If you've ever been on a wrestling team in America you've showered with other males