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> The idea that Google can fix "racial diversity in tech" is absurd at best. These are deeply rooted systemic issues that need to be addressed from the ground u

> The idea that Google can fix "racial diversity in tech" is absurd at best. These are deeply rooted systemic issues that need to be addressed from the ground up. I don't disagree with the substance of your comment, but it's worth pointing out that Alphabet is a company with a $1,416,000,000,000 market cap. If any non-governmental entity could be said to have the resources to address "systemic issues" at the root, it would be these giant multinationals. If Google wanted to, it could fund CS education in primary and secondary schools in black neighbourhoods, it could launch a finance wing to offer mortgages to families disadvantaged by a history of red-lining, it could endow scholarships at HBCUs, it could invest directly in infrastructure projects in majority-black cities... Obviously there's no obligation for them to do these things, but if they cared to really make a dent in America's racial issues (instead of just making white folks feel more positively about Google) they are not lacking the capital to take a stab at it. They certainly don't mind pissing away millions on internet balloons.

bko 6y ago
Do you really want a giant multinationals addressing issues normally handled by the state? Do you really want google to be so involved in education and housing? Is that's whats wrong with our politics, not enough corporate influence? I just want google to provide me reasonable search results, respect my privacy and follow all applicable laws.
- ForHackernews 6y ago
  Not necessarily. Reading this article I actually find it quite obnoxious that Google would come in and tell HBCU computer science departments to redesign their curricula to focus less on "theoretical" concerns and more on like, Python scripting that G needs from its junior engineers. But it's also worth noting what a dishonest dodge it is for these huge companies posturing like "oh we care so deeply about this issue, but it's a pipeline problem we can't fix!" - as though they can't build whatever pipeline they want to get the candidates they want to get.
  - bko 6y ago
    > But it's also worth noting what a dishonest dodge it is for these huge companies posturing like "oh we care so deeply about this issue, They have to say this. The executives of these large internet companies get dragged in front of congress regularly and some politicians built their entire careers on passing punitive targeted legislation against said companies. > as though they can't build whatever pipeline they want to get the candidates they want to get. That's what they're doing when they're trying to influence the curriculum of computer science departments. As an aside, I remember flipping through AP (high school level) computer science tests and got a kick out of how the state education board tested students. Here's an example Consider the following code segment. List<String> animals = new ArrayList<String>(); animals.add("dog"); animals.add("cat"); animals.add("snake"); animals.set(2, "lizard"); animals.set(3, "fish"); animals.remove(3); System.out.println(animals); What is printed as a result of executing the code segment? (a) [dog, fish, cat] (b) [dog, fish, lizard] (c) [dog, lizard, fish] (d) [fish, dog, cat] (e) The code throws an ArrayIndexOutOfBoundsException exception. https://www.apcsaexam.org/uploads/1/0/7/7/107712547/ap_sample_questions_from_college_board.pdf https://www.apcsaexam.org/uploads/1/0/7/7/107712547/ap_sampl...
- devwastaken 6y ago
  The private market is exactly who should be funding higher education. Federal government funding has resulted in significant inflation of costs and poor quality of administration and instructors. Education that does not meet the market should fail and be replaced.
- ttz 6y ago
  Yes, if they said they were going to. > whats wrong with our politics Lobbyists, the need for fundraising by officials putting them in the pockets and interests of corporations and entities... do we really want to go there? Corporations and entities have incredible influence in politics; to not acknowledge this would be disingenuous. Politics is driven by money, idealism be damned, and Alphabet has a lot of this. Why shouldn't one expect them (well, their subsidiary, Google) to back up what they said? To be fair, I also understand where you're coming from. I'm from a privileged socioeconomic class, from a tech industry perspective. So it's easy for me to say "I don't want to get into the politics because it doesn't affect me; all I want is reasonable search results and for them to leave me alone". We have (or were able to earn because we had the resources) the baseline privileges and advantages in life that enable us to have this attitude. But some groups still don't, and it's my belief (and hopefully, society's someday) that we should effectively (not just rhetorically or trivially) give them the pathways to level the playing field.
MeinBlutIstBlau 6y ago
I think the number one detractor to black neighborhoods from engaging in CS is more of a cultural thing. The same reason why women in tech is still pretty low is also the same reason black people in tech is low. The culture tied to their race/sex in the immediate area tends to sway their futures. If dealing drugs or just dropping out is the norm among your friends, it's gonna be very hard for one to just pick up CS at a high school or early college level for men. Even if it's free.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- runawaybottle 6y ago
  Or that it’s a hard major. This isn’t particularly unique to black people. Most students avoid the hard majors in college (even white people, there’s a reason why every bootcamper majored in like the Trombone or Classics in college, because, well, shockingly, they also avoided the hard majors.) The reason Asian kids don’t avoid it is because of how seriously their parents take their education. You guys want to fix the pipeline problem, talk to Asian fucking parents and learn something.

bko 6y ago

Do you really want a giant multinationals addressing issues normally handled by the state? Do you really want google to be so involved in education and housing? Is that's whats wrong with our politics, not enough corporate influence? I just want google to provide me reasonable search results, respect my privacy and follow all applicable laws.

ForHackernews 6y ago
Not necessarily. Reading this article I actually find it quite obnoxious that Google would come in and tell HBCU computer science departments to redesign their curricula to focus less on "theoretical" concerns and more on like, Python scripting that G needs from its junior engineers. But it's also worth noting what a dishonest dodge it is for these huge companies posturing like "oh we care so deeply about this issue, but it's a pipeline problem we can't fix!" - as though they can't build whatever pipeline they want to get the candidates they want to get.
- bko 6y ago
  > But it's also worth noting what a dishonest dodge it is for these huge companies posturing like "oh we care so deeply about this issue, They have to say this. The executives of these large internet companies get dragged in front of congress regularly and some politicians built their entire careers on passing punitive targeted legislation against said companies. > as though they can't build whatever pipeline they want to get the candidates they want to get. That's what they're doing when they're trying to influence the curriculum of computer science departments. As an aside, I remember flipping through AP (high school level) computer science tests and got a kick out of how the state education board tested students. Here's an example Consider the following code segment. List<String> animals = new ArrayList<String>(); animals.add("dog"); animals.add("cat"); animals.add("snake"); animals.set(2, "lizard"); animals.set(3, "fish"); animals.remove(3); System.out.println(animals); What is printed as a result of executing the code segment? (a) [dog, fish, cat] (b) [dog, fish, lizard] (c) [dog, lizard, fish] (d) [fish, dog, cat] (e) The code throws an ArrayIndexOutOfBoundsException exception. https://www.apcsaexam.org/uploads/1/0/7/7/107712547/ap_sample_questions_from_college_board.pdf https://www.apcsaexam.org/uploads/1/0/7/7/107712547/ap_sampl...
devwastaken 6y ago
The private market is exactly who should be funding higher education. Federal government funding has resulted in significant inflation of costs and poor quality of administration and instructors. Education that does not meet the market should fail and be replaced.
ttz 6y ago
Yes, if they said they were going to. > whats wrong with our politics Lobbyists, the need for fundraising by officials putting them in the pockets and interests of corporations and entities... do we really want to go there? Corporations and entities have incredible influence in politics; to not acknowledge this would be disingenuous. Politics is driven by money, idealism be damned, and Alphabet has a lot of this. Why shouldn't one expect them (well, their subsidiary, Google) to back up what they said? To be fair, I also understand where you're coming from. I'm from a privileged socioeconomic class, from a tech industry perspective. So it's easy for me to say "I don't want to get into the politics because it doesn't affect me; all I want is reasonable search results and for them to leave me alone". We have (or were able to earn because we had the resources) the baseline privileges and advantages in life that enable us to have this attitude. But some groups still don't, and it's my belief (and hopefully, society's someday) that we should effectively (not just rhetorically or trivially) give them the pathways to level the playing field.

MeinBlutIstBlau 6y ago

I think the number one detractor to black neighborhoods from engaging in CS is more of a cultural thing. The same reason why women in tech is still pretty low is also the same reason black people in tech is low. The culture tied to their race/sex in the immediate area tends to sway their futures. If dealing drugs or just dropping out is the norm among your friends, it's gonna be very hard for one to just pick up CS at a high school or early college level for men. Even if it's free.

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
runawaybottle 6y ago
Or that it’s a hard major. This isn’t particularly unique to black people. Most students avoid the hard majors in college (even white people, there’s a reason why every bootcamper majored in like the Trombone or Classics in college, because, well, shockingly, they also avoided the hard majors.) The reason Asian kids don’t avoid it is because of how seriously their parents take their education. You guys want to fix the pipeline problem, talk to Asian fucking parents and learn something.