4 ms·

Anyone have any idea when intel's 10nm will hit desktop? Are they making any progress at all? Are they just planning on skipping straight to 7 at this point?

dogma1138 6y ago
In 6 months for the past 5 years.. Realistically now probably mid 2022 we’ll see something, but probably not a full lineup until 2023.
wmf 6y ago
Alder Lake-S is rumored for December 2021. The delays have cascaded so 7nm is still pretty far away.
AtlasBarfed 6y ago
This is half- to full- snark: When they outsource to TSMC. At some point Intel will get their act together and only be one step behind rather than... christ, are they three steps behind? They just have way too much money. But it does look like with the management purges, re-hires of old guard, and other changes it'll be a while before they right ship. There's probably pride to overcome, since a lot of process choices probably are "stake my career" things and now those careers may be coming to an end. The interesting thing may be that Intel now not only must close a gap in process technology, they may also need to change instruction set and make an ARM offering.
- toast0 6y ago
  > At some point Intel will get their act together and only be one step behind rather than... christ, are they three steps behind? They're not really three steps behind. At some point, node measurements became more useless as Intel and TSMC differ on what part of the thing they're measuring. Intel's 14 nm is roughly the same as TSMCs 10, and i10 ~= t7, i7 ~= t5. TSMC is shipping their 5nm chips, and intel is halfway shipping their 10nm chips, so that's somewhere between 1.5 and 2 steps behind.
  - AtlasBarfed 6y ago
    Agreed on the process measurements, and so you're technically (the best kind!) right, and I remember the days when Intel was on "nm" parity with other fabs and their stuff was better at TDP and other things. But then... With the code of processes and half-nodes / node+ tiers which easily cost as much as full node shrinks before, well, financially it may be three steps. Plus the fact you don't chase what's in the marketplace if you're behind, you have to chase where the ball is rolling to.
RachelF 6y ago
a few months after the first fusion reactor starts producing power for the grid /s
glangdale 6y ago
Very theoretically, ADL-S is meant to be released in September. This seems a bit surprising, given that people won't typically by buying systems with RKL until April - a very tight window. RKL might turn out to have been a stop-gap measure that was only semi-needed. A lot of the hyperventilating about how much trouble Intel is in here (which is, frankly, moderately justified) ignores the fact that the desktop segment just isn't that important. I mean, it's important to me. I've been waiting for a new desktop for a while (and, despite being ex-Intel, may go Team Red). But the money is in laptops and servers. Desktop is clearly not high in the queue. It's at the point where I'll either go Team Red (and probably buy a TGL NUC for AVX-512 experimentation) or buy an 8-core TGL "desktop replacement laptop". The power consumption is ridiculous. A lot of my argument for wanting a desktop is not having laptop-style power management wobbles while trying to do fine-grain performance benchmarking, but what kind of wobbles am I going to have on a system like RKL? 291W? 104C? Yeesh. Supposedly the issues are fixed with 10nm in 10++ or whatever it's called (SuperFin?). We're not going to learn about that until September or whenever ADL tips up.

dogma1138 6y ago

In 6 months for the past 5 years.. Realistically now probably mid 2022 we’ll see something, but probably not a full lineup until 2023.

wmf 6y ago

Alder Lake-S is rumored for December 2021. The delays have cascaded so 7nm is still pretty far away.

AtlasBarfed 6y ago

This is half- to full- snark: When they outsource to TSMC. At some point Intel will get their act together and only be one step behind rather than... christ, are they three steps behind? They just have way too much money. But it does look like with the management purges, re-hires of old guard, and other changes it'll be a while before they right ship. There's probably pride to overcome, since a lot of process choices probably are "stake my career" things and now those careers may be coming to an end. The interesting thing may be that Intel now not only must close a gap in process technology, they may also need to change instruction set and make an ARM offering.

toast0 6y ago
> At some point Intel will get their act together and only be one step behind rather than... christ, are they three steps behind? They're not really three steps behind. At some point, node measurements became more useless as Intel and TSMC differ on what part of the thing they're measuring. Intel's 14 nm is roughly the same as TSMCs 10, and i10 ~= t7, i7 ~= t5. TSMC is shipping their 5nm chips, and intel is halfway shipping their 10nm chips, so that's somewhere between 1.5 and 2 steps behind.
- AtlasBarfed 6y ago
  Agreed on the process measurements, and so you're technically (the best kind!) right, and I remember the days when Intel was on "nm" parity with other fabs and their stuff was better at TDP and other things. But then... With the code of processes and half-nodes / node+ tiers which easily cost as much as full node shrinks before, well, financially it may be three steps. Plus the fact you don't chase what's in the marketplace if you're behind, you have to chase where the ball is rolling to.

RachelF 6y ago

a few months after the first fusion reactor starts producing power for the grid /s

glangdale 6y ago

Very theoretically, ADL-S is meant to be released in September. This seems a bit surprising, given that people won't typically by buying systems with RKL until April - a very tight window. RKL might turn out to have been a stop-gap measure that was only semi-needed. A lot of the hyperventilating about how much trouble Intel is in here (which is, frankly, moderately justified) ignores the fact that the desktop segment just isn't that important. I mean, it's important to me. I've been waiting for a new desktop for a while (and, despite being ex-Intel, may go Team Red). But the money is in laptops and servers. Desktop is clearly not high in the queue. It's at the point where I'll either go Team Red (and probably buy a TGL NUC for AVX-512 experimentation) or buy an 8-core TGL "desktop replacement laptop". The power consumption is ridiculous. A lot of my argument for wanting a desktop is not having laptop-style power management wobbles while trying to do fine-grain performance benchmarking, but what kind of wobbles am I going to have on a system like RKL? 291W? 104C? Yeesh. Supposedly the issues are fixed with 10nm in 10++ or whatever it's called (SuperFin?). We're not going to learn about that until September or whenever ADL tips up.