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https://www.tesladeaths.com/ https://www.tesladeaths.com/

vletal 6y ago
Have you mentioned how sparse the autopilot claimed column is? And how even sparser the verified autopilot is? Seems like the authors are trying to inflate the total numbers very hard.
- madamelic 6y ago
  Not to mention the spreadsheet admits Autopilot was released in 2015 but they are still including deaths from 2013. This can't be more blatant.
  - FireBeyond 6y ago
    Autopilot might not be around, but up until very recently Tesla refused to participate in a lot of auto safety testing saying that they believed the testing regime was "flawed". I have no issue with keeping track of auto deaths from a company who is claiming that their vehicles are safe while preventing anything but the legal minimum necessary tests from occurring.
spullara 6y ago
Ok, reduce that to where autopilot is engaged.
ggreer 6y ago
It should be noted that that site is run by a group of pseudonymous people who do not hide the fact that they have been shorting Tesla for years. They count every death involving a Tesla. If someone jumps in front of a manually piloted Tesla and is run over before the driver can react, it is added to the spreadsheet. They’re holding the company to an impossible standard. Moreover, they don't actually care about reducing deaths involving Tesla vehicles. They want Tesla to fail so that they can profit. It’s a purely selfish act. The most prominent member of the TSLAQ people and (IIRC) the first to publicize a spreadsheet of Tesla deaths is Elon Bachman (a pseudonym). He has also been a charlatan on COVID. A year ago he said, “After 4 months of white hot Coronavirus panic, the disaster is visible everywhere except in the data. Total deaths, rounded to the nearest percent, remain 0% of annual flu deaths, and serious cases are falling”[1] I tried to bet him up to $1,000 that US COVID deaths would exceed 25,000 by the end of 2020.[2] He ignored me and continued to deny the harm caused by the disease. One simply cannot trust anything he’s involved in. 1. https://twitter.com/ElonBachman/status/1237030292340314112 https://twitter.com/ElonBachman/status/1237030292340314112 2. https://twitter.com/ggreer/status/1237164317142736896 https://twitter.com/ggreer/status/1237164317142736896
- Pyramus 6y ago
  > They want Tesla to fail so that they can profit. A more realistic take is: They think Tesla is massively overvalued and should be held accountable for fraudulent corporate behaviour. > He has also been a charlatan on COVID. Kind of ironic given that Elon himself was (is?) one of the first vocal Covid deniers. Check out TC's Chartcast [1] in case you are interested in TSLAQ, beware it's a deep rabbit hole. I've previously tried to sum up Tesla's red flags here [2]. [1] https://www.buzzsprout.com/758369 https://www.buzzsprout.com/758369 [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26065075 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26065075
  - dheera 6y ago
    > They think Tesla is massively overvalued > fraudulent corporate behaviour. These two things have nothing to do with each other. > and should be held accountable for Holding a company accountable should go through the courts, not personal profit. I'd be happy if short selling weren't an option. If you believe something is overvalued, stay out. You're not wanted. If you believe a company did something wrong, file a lawsuit.
    - alisonkisk 6y ago
      You haven't made an argument against short selling.
      - dheera 6y ago
        Pessimism is counterproductive to the long-term development of humanity and rapid deployment of electric vehicles and clean energy. Armchair pessimists don't deserve a place in the stock market. If you think Tesla is doing something wrong, either (a) go work there and fix it or (b) start your own Tesla competitor. Short selling isn't constructive.
    - mercurysmessage 6y ago
      What's wrong with short selling? The only reason why people like Elon Musk don't like short selling is because they know that their companies are massively overvalued.
kwhitefoot 6y ago
That's an interesting table. I would say that it reinforces the case that Autopilot (actually labelled Autosteer in the UI of my 2015 Model S) is actually not dangerous. I presume that the aim of the site is the opposite though.

Have you mentioned how sparse the autopilot claimed column is? And how even sparser the verified autopilot is? Seems like the authors are trying to inflate the total numbers very hard.

madamelic 6y ago
Not to mention the spreadsheet admits Autopilot was released in 2015 but they are still including deaths from 2013. This can't be more blatant.
- FireBeyond 6y ago
  Autopilot might not be around, but up until very recently Tesla refused to participate in a lot of auto safety testing saying that they believed the testing regime was "flawed". I have no issue with keeping track of auto deaths from a company who is claiming that their vehicles are safe while preventing anything but the legal minimum necessary tests from occurring.

spullara 6y ago

Ok, reduce that to where autopilot is engaged.

ggreer 6y ago

It should be noted that that site is run by a group of pseudonymous people who do not hide the fact that they have been shorting Tesla for years. They count every death involving a Tesla. If someone jumps in front of a manually piloted Tesla and is run over before the driver can react, it is added to the spreadsheet. They’re holding the company to an impossible standard. Moreover, they don't actually care about reducing deaths involving Tesla vehicles. They want Tesla to fail so that they can profit. It’s a purely selfish act. The most prominent member of the TSLAQ people and (IIRC) the first to publicize a spreadsheet of Tesla deaths is Elon Bachman (a pseudonym). He has also been a charlatan on COVID. A year ago he said, “After 4 months of white hot Coronavirus panic, the disaster is visible everywhere except in the data. Total deaths, rounded to the nearest percent, remain 0% of annual flu deaths, and serious cases are falling”[1] I tried to bet him up to $1,000 that US COVID deaths would exceed 25,000 by the end of 2020.[2] He ignored me and continued to deny the harm caused by the disease. One simply cannot trust anything he’s involved in. 1. https://twitter.com/ElonBachman/status/1237030292340314112 https://twitter.com/ElonBachman/status/1237030292340314112 2. https://twitter.com/ggreer/status/1237164317142736896 https://twitter.com/ggreer/status/1237164317142736896

Pyramus 6y ago
> They want Tesla to fail so that they can profit. A more realistic take is: They think Tesla is massively overvalued and should be held accountable for fraudulent corporate behaviour. > He has also been a charlatan on COVID. Kind of ironic given that Elon himself was (is?) one of the first vocal Covid deniers. Check out TC's Chartcast [1] in case you are interested in TSLAQ, beware it's a deep rabbit hole. I've previously tried to sum up Tesla's red flags here [2]. [1] https://www.buzzsprout.com/758369 https://www.buzzsprout.com/758369 [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26065075 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26065075
- dheera 6y ago
  > They think Tesla is massively overvalued > fraudulent corporate behaviour. These two things have nothing to do with each other. > and should be held accountable for Holding a company accountable should go through the courts, not personal profit. I'd be happy if short selling weren't an option. If you believe something is overvalued, stay out. You're not wanted. If you believe a company did something wrong, file a lawsuit.
  - alisonkisk 6y ago
    You haven't made an argument against short selling.
    - dheera 6y ago
      Pessimism is counterproductive to the long-term development of humanity and rapid deployment of electric vehicles and clean energy. Armchair pessimists don't deserve a place in the stock market. If you think Tesla is doing something wrong, either (a) go work there and fix it or (b) start your own Tesla competitor. Short selling isn't constructive.
  - mercurysmessage 6y ago
    What's wrong with short selling? The only reason why people like Elon Musk don't like short selling is because they know that their companies are massively overvalued.

kwhitefoot 6y ago

That's an interesting table. I would say that it reinforces the case that Autopilot (actually labelled Autosteer in the UI of my 2015 Model S) is actually not dangerous. I presume that the aim of the site is the opposite though.