7 ms·

https://images.indianexpress.com/2021/03/dr-seuss.jpg https://images.indianexpress.com/2021/03/dr-seuss.jpg Maybe I'm old fashioned but all I see is a smiling

by dTal 6y ago

https://images.indianexpress.com/2021/03/dr-seuss.jpg https://images.indianexpress.com/2021/03/dr-seuss.jpg Maybe I'm old fashioned but all I see is a smiling boy, in traditional Chinese dress, eating what appears to be rice out of a bowl with chopsticks. Are there actually Chinese people who find this offensive? Why?

hntrader 6y ago
As someone with an Asian background, it's not offensive at all, and I can't think of an Asian person who would find it offensive. This is just cancel culture playing out. Weak, risk-averse executives cowardly bending the knee to a small group of malicious, narcissistic activists. This reminds me of the "What is the problem with Apu?" fiasco. No Indian I knew cared, but a small number of sociopathic activists forced the hands of the cowards in charge.
- refurb 6y ago
  It’s clear as an Asian person you need the insights of white people to determine what you should/shouldn’t be offended about in the depiction of your own race.
- VRay 6y ago
  As someone with an Asian background, you should go read some of Seuss' newspaper comics where he argues for Japanese internment, and then look at that picture again in that context
  - hntrader 6y ago
    That seems like confirmation bias. The book was published before WW2, and the white people in that picture look just as ridiculous and caricatured as the Asian, with dots for eyes and absurd costumes and postures.
- kart23 6y ago
  I care. Nearly every kid in middle school watched simpsons except me (my parents said it was bad, I had no idea why at the time), and every day I would have to deal with the same Apu jokes and stale imitated accents. At the time, I didn't even know what it was a reference to, and I just took it as kids being kids. But when I grew up, I realized that all that bullshit was pretty much just because of this one character. And I don't want any Indian-American kid to ever have to deal with that stuff again. Its about education and making sure there are real depictions of Indians on screen (not played by other races), not just outright banning media. > forced the hands of the cowards in charge So you support a white actor voicing an Indian character, and don't want some Indian-Americans added to the show? Change is good when something is messed up. Our problem wasn't with the show itself, its how the show influences the behavior of society negatively, and the fact that there was simply no other representation of Indian-Americans in media at the time.
  - hntrader 6y ago
    The problem here are the bullies, not the show. South Park, Simpsons, Family Guy and all the greats are packed full of racially-adventurous humour and that's part of what makes these shows great. Scottish, British, Indian, Japanese, Jewish, Muslim and virtually everyone is picked on. They're equal opportunity offenders. If you don't like it, that's your prerogative, but don't force your preferences on the rest of us.
    - kart23 6y ago
      I don’t support hank azaria voicing the character, and i believe an indian writer should be deciding what apu says. I’m not saying things should be cancelled, we just want representation. You can make fun of cultures and people, but just recognize when jokes are having a negative impact on their targets in the real world. it’s incredibly disheartening that so many other problematic representations and things like yellowface are being addressed, but apparently nobody cares about this.
      - allturtles 6y ago
        > and i believe an indian writer should be deciding what apu says This seems to belie the entire concept of fiction writing. Must that writer also be a straight married male with children and own a convenience store? Can a male writer write a book with female characters, or vice versa?
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
jfengel 6y ago
None of the white people are presented in exaggerated, outdated costumes. It exaggerates the slanted eyes, the queue, and (in some editions) the bright yellow color. Compare it to some of the deliberately-racist cartoons that Giesel drew during World War II: https://reimaginingmigration.org/dr-seuss-political-cartoons/ https://reimaginingmigration.org/dr-seuss-political-cartoons... This wasn't intended to offend, and I don't know how many people were offended by it. But if I were the publisher the similarities would distress me.
- rufus_foreman 6y ago
  >> None of the white people are presented in exaggerated, outdated costumes There was a white person presented in an exaggerated, outdated costume in that very same drawing.
  - tyingq 6y ago
    The whole image: https://smartcdn.prod.postmedia.digital/nationalpost/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/9729098_orig.png https://smartcdn.prod.postmedia.digital/nationalpost/wp-cont...
- refenestrator 6y ago
  But it's all white people getting offended at it, and specifically it's white people who never give a shit about Chinese in any of their other culture wars. Discriminated against in college admissions? Erased in discussions of diversity in tech? Who cares. Call me back when we can use you to get mad at a children's book.
- Alupis 6y ago
  > None of the white people are presented in exaggerated, outdated costumes. Outdated? These cartoons were drawn in the 1930's and 40's... 90+ years ago. They were not outdated at the time. Regardless if we find some of these drawings racist by today's standards - they are historical and should be preserved as such. 1984 becomes more real by the day...
  - 6y ago
offby37years 6y ago
No. The Chinese have a term for these privileged westerners who exhibit faux-outrage: 圣母婊, 聖母婊 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baizuo https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baizuo
- cambalache 6y ago
  Why did you copy-paste a related term(Shengmu-Biao ) in both traditional and simplified hanzi?
ThrowawayR2 6y ago
I'm of Chinese descent. I'm much, more more offended by progressives clamoring to take away educational and job opportunities away from Asians because we're "overrepresented minorities" (as if we hadn't earned our place through hard work and education) and then making a mountain out of a molehill like this to pretend that they are actually concerned about Asians as minorities. Compared to two-facedness of that degree, Dr. Seuss's little cartoon doesn't register at all.

by dTal 6y ago

hntrader 6y ago

As someone with an Asian background, it's not offensive at all, and I can't think of an Asian person who would find it offensive. This is just cancel culture playing out. Weak, risk-averse executives cowardly bending the knee to a small group of malicious, narcissistic activists. This reminds me of the "What is the problem with Apu?" fiasco. No Indian I knew cared, but a small number of sociopathic activists forced the hands of the cowards in charge.

refurb 6y ago
It’s clear as an Asian person you need the insights of white people to determine what you should/shouldn’t be offended about in the depiction of your own race.
VRay 6y ago
As someone with an Asian background, you should go read some of Seuss' newspaper comics where he argues for Japanese internment, and then look at that picture again in that context
- hntrader 6y ago
  That seems like confirmation bias. The book was published before WW2, and the white people in that picture look just as ridiculous and caricatured as the Asian, with dots for eyes and absurd costumes and postures.
kart23 6y ago
I care. Nearly every kid in middle school watched simpsons except me (my parents said it was bad, I had no idea why at the time), and every day I would have to deal with the same Apu jokes and stale imitated accents. At the time, I didn't even know what it was a reference to, and I just took it as kids being kids. But when I grew up, I realized that all that bullshit was pretty much just because of this one character. And I don't want any Indian-American kid to ever have to deal with that stuff again. Its about education and making sure there are real depictions of Indians on screen (not played by other races), not just outright banning media. > forced the hands of the cowards in charge So you support a white actor voicing an Indian character, and don't want some Indian-Americans added to the show? Change is good when something is messed up. Our problem wasn't with the show itself, its how the show influences the behavior of society negatively, and the fact that there was simply no other representation of Indian-Americans in media at the time.
- hntrader 6y ago
  The problem here are the bullies, not the show. South Park, Simpsons, Family Guy and all the greats are packed full of racially-adventurous humour and that's part of what makes these shows great. Scottish, British, Indian, Japanese, Jewish, Muslim and virtually everyone is picked on. They're equal opportunity offenders. If you don't like it, that's your prerogative, but don't force your preferences on the rest of us.
  - kart23 6y ago
    I don’t support hank azaria voicing the character, and i believe an indian writer should be deciding what apu says. I’m not saying things should be cancelled, we just want representation. You can make fun of cultures and people, but just recognize when jokes are having a negative impact on their targets in the real world. it’s incredibly disheartening that so many other problematic representations and things like yellowface are being addressed, but apparently nobody cares about this.
    - allturtles 6y ago
      > and i believe an indian writer should be deciding what apu says This seems to belie the entire concept of fiction writing. Must that writer also be a straight married male with children and own a convenience store? Can a male writer write a book with female characters, or vice versa?
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]

jfengel 6y ago

None of the white people are presented in exaggerated, outdated costumes. It exaggerates the slanted eyes, the queue, and (in some editions) the bright yellow color. Compare it to some of the deliberately-racist cartoons that Giesel drew during World War II: https://reimaginingmigration.org/dr-seuss-political-cartoons/ https://reimaginingmigration.org/dr-seuss-political-cartoons... This wasn't intended to offend, and I don't know how many people were offended by it. But if I were the publisher the similarities would distress me.

rufus_foreman 6y ago
>> None of the white people are presented in exaggerated, outdated costumes There was a white person presented in an exaggerated, outdated costume in that very same drawing.
- tyingq 6y ago
  The whole image: https://smartcdn.prod.postmedia.digital/nationalpost/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/9729098_orig.png https://smartcdn.prod.postmedia.digital/nationalpost/wp-cont...
refenestrator 6y ago
But it's all white people getting offended at it, and specifically it's white people who never give a shit about Chinese in any of their other culture wars. Discriminated against in college admissions? Erased in discussions of diversity in tech? Who cares. Call me back when we can use you to get mad at a children's book.
Alupis 6y ago
> None of the white people are presented in exaggerated, outdated costumes. Outdated? These cartoons were drawn in the 1930's and 40's... 90+ years ago. They were not outdated at the time. Regardless if we find some of these drawings racist by today's standards - they are historical and should be preserved as such. 1984 becomes more real by the day...
- 6y ago

offby37years 6y ago

No. The Chinese have a term for these privileged westerners who exhibit faux-outrage: 圣母婊, 聖母婊 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baizuo https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baizuo

cambalache 6y ago
Why did you copy-paste a related term(Shengmu-Biao ) in both traditional and simplified hanzi?

ThrowawayR2 6y ago

I'm of Chinese descent. I'm much, more more offended by progressives clamoring to take away educational and job opportunities away from Asians because we're "overrepresented minorities" (as if we hadn't earned our place through hard work and education) and then making a mountain out of a molehill like this to pretend that they are actually concerned about Asians as minorities. Compared to two-facedness of that degree, Dr. Seuss's little cartoon doesn't register at all.