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The best one is the Googler article linked in a sibling: https://medium.com/@steve.yegge/dear-google-cloud-your-deprecation-policy-is-killing-you-ee7525dc05dc h

The best one is the Googler article linked in a sibling: https://medium.com/@steve.yegge/dear-google-cloud-your-deprecation-policy-is-killing-you-ee7525dc05dc https://medium.com/@steve.yegge/dear-google-cloud-your-depre... That alone is more than enough to substantiate what I'm saying, but if you need more examples than just search or read HN a bit, due diligence, etc. I was personally lucky in that I got burned in the planning stages and didn't have to get burned in production, but I still wasted all that planning time and ended up having to use AWS instead.

amscanne 6y ago
I understand the problem you’re talking about, but the way you said “available evidence” made me think you had something more data-oriented than Steve Yegge’s blog post and HN comments.
- john-shaffer 6y ago
  Since you work at Google, you should be well aware of the deprecations. You don't need evidence of their existence, you just don't see it as a problem. Which you are free to do, since it's not a problem for you, it's just a problem for GCP clients, many of whose complaints you seem to be dismissing as not being "data". GCP doesn't seem to provide a full list of deprecations, but the list for just one service[1] is pretty terrifying when you consider that your app might depend on two or three dozen services, and a deprecation in just one of them forces you to rewrite perfectly good code. A cursory search reveals a number of reports of being repeatedly bitten by deprecations[2][3][4], so no one should be mislead by the dismissals here. [2] has a good cautionary tale of a forced "upgrade" leading to potentially much greater cost. [1] https://cloud.google.com/appengine/docs/deprecations https://cloud.google.com/appengine/docs/deprecations [2] https://nilsnh.no/2019/11/09/managing-the-google-cloud-platform-on-deprecation-notices-and-pricing-policies/ https://nilsnh.no/2019/11/09/managing-the-google-cloud-platf... [3] https://www.slideshare.net/async_io/lessons-learned-from-building-a-rest-api-on-google-app-engine https://www.slideshare.net/async_io/lessons-learned-from-bui... [4] https://www.lastweekinaws.com/podcast/aws-morning-brief/whiteboard-confessional-google-s-deprecation-policy/ https://www.lastweekinaws.com/podcast/aws-morning-brief/whit...
  - amscanne 6y ago
    I do work at Google: I’m not trying to dismiss the concerns and I understand that deprecations are a legitimate concern and carry a significant business cost. It sucks that you got burned a few years ago, and I totally get the why you lost trust in GCP. I do think Google Cloud is trying to do better and the few deprecations I’ve seen personally have been heavily scrutinized and considered, with a clear migration path for users. I was only asking for data to objectively understand the problem as it stands today, and not to minimize your own experience. I know there are experiences similar to yours, but hopefully there are far fewer in recent years (but its always hard to tell without data).
    - john-shaffer 6y ago
      That is encouraging, but it will take years to regain trust. Perhaps GCP will eventually exceed expectations and turn out to be a great platform.

amscanne 6y ago

I understand the problem you’re talking about, but the way you said “available evidence” made me think you had something more data-oriented than Steve Yegge’s blog post and HN comments.

john-shaffer 6y ago
Since you work at Google, you should be well aware of the deprecations. You don't need evidence of their existence, you just don't see it as a problem. Which you are free to do, since it's not a problem for you, it's just a problem for GCP clients, many of whose complaints you seem to be dismissing as not being "data". GCP doesn't seem to provide a full list of deprecations, but the list for just one service[1] is pretty terrifying when you consider that your app might depend on two or three dozen services, and a deprecation in just one of them forces you to rewrite perfectly good code. A cursory search reveals a number of reports of being repeatedly bitten by deprecations[2][3][4], so no one should be mislead by the dismissals here. [2] has a good cautionary tale of a forced "upgrade" leading to potentially much greater cost. [1] https://cloud.google.com/appengine/docs/deprecations https://cloud.google.com/appengine/docs/deprecations [2] https://nilsnh.no/2019/11/09/managing-the-google-cloud-platform-on-deprecation-notices-and-pricing-policies/ https://nilsnh.no/2019/11/09/managing-the-google-cloud-platf... [3] https://www.slideshare.net/async_io/lessons-learned-from-building-a-rest-api-on-google-app-engine https://www.slideshare.net/async_io/lessons-learned-from-bui... [4] https://www.lastweekinaws.com/podcast/aws-morning-brief/whiteboard-confessional-google-s-deprecation-policy/ https://www.lastweekinaws.com/podcast/aws-morning-brief/whit...
- amscanne 6y ago
  I do work at Google: I’m not trying to dismiss the concerns and I understand that deprecations are a legitimate concern and carry a significant business cost. It sucks that you got burned a few years ago, and I totally get the why you lost trust in GCP. I do think Google Cloud is trying to do better and the few deprecations I’ve seen personally have been heavily scrutinized and considered, with a clear migration path for users. I was only asking for data to objectively understand the problem as it stands today, and not to minimize your own experience. I know there are experiences similar to yours, but hopefully there are far fewer in recent years (but its always hard to tell without data).
  - john-shaffer 6y ago
    That is encouraging, but it will take years to regain trust. Perhaps GCP will eventually exceed expectations and turn out to be a great platform.