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> the people on Gab are there because they feel like they are under sustained political attack I mean aren't they? I don't see another intellectually honest w

> the people on Gab are there because they feel like they are under sustained political attack I mean aren't they? I don't see another intellectually honest way of framing this. And yes, I'm aware: Popper's paradox, fighting fascism, etc., etc.

quantified 6y ago
Thanks for mentioning Popper’s paradox, I looked it up just now and its scenario has been on my mind for a long time. Now I can just refer to it, in a fashion like Dunning-Kruger.
- leereeves 6y ago
  Popper is often misunderstood. He was a passionate advocate of free speech and rational argument; when he said "intolerance" he was referring to people who would use violence to suppress free speech: > for it may easily turn out that they are not prepared to meet us on the level of rational argument, but begin by denouncing all argument; they may forbid their followers to listen to rational argument, because it is deceptive, and teach them to answer arguments by the use of their fists or pistols. And even while explaining the paradox, he expressed his opposition to censorship in general: > I do not imply, for instance, that we should always suppress the utterance of intolerant philosophies; as long as we can counter them by rational argument and keep them in check by public opinion, suppression would certainly be most unwise. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance#Discussions https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance#Discussio...
  - quantified 6y ago
    Just mentioning his name got me downvotes. HN has an interesting ecosystem.
    - crocodiletears 6y ago
      Popper has a point, but that particular quote has become an albatross around the neck of any discussion concerning censorship and cancel culture, to the point that it could very well be its own internet 'law'. GP's point of mentioning it was a preemption of the inevitable citation that someone might trot out as a cudgel against further dialogue.
      - quantified 6y ago
        “Being intolerant of intolerance” is one of those funny social paradoxes we grapple with somewhere around sixth grade. And yet we need to. No way I just tolerate your 6th grade BS directed towards me, for example. Actually formulating and calibrating the behaviors and responses that allow a suitably tolerant society (and tolerant of what exactly) is intriguing and seemingly worthy. Getting people to agree to taboos is one part of the negotiation. There’s a fairly well-reasoned article out there on how the less-tolerant and highly motivated end up steering society. The motivation and vigor of the intolerance matters a lot.
        crocodiletears 6y ago
        > No way I just tolerate your 6th grade BS directed towards me, for example. I didn't downvote you, and I generally avoid the downvote feature. I was providing an explanation as to why you might have been downvoted. I'm not sure how I came across as immature, or unreasoned to you. Pretty sure I've read the article you're referencing (topped HN at some point in the past few months, I think). Was it this? https://medium.com/incerto/the-most-intolerant-wins-the-dictatorship-of-the-small-minority-3f1f83ce4e15 https://medium.com/incerto/the-most-intolerant-wins-the-dict...
deleted 6y ago
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quantified 6y ago

Thanks for mentioning Popper’s paradox, I looked it up just now and its scenario has been on my mind for a long time. Now I can just refer to it, in a fashion like Dunning-Kruger.

leereeves 6y ago
Popper is often misunderstood. He was a passionate advocate of free speech and rational argument; when he said "intolerance" he was referring to people who would use violence to suppress free speech: > for it may easily turn out that they are not prepared to meet us on the level of rational argument, but begin by denouncing all argument; they may forbid their followers to listen to rational argument, because it is deceptive, and teach them to answer arguments by the use of their fists or pistols. And even while explaining the paradox, he expressed his opposition to censorship in general: > I do not imply, for instance, that we should always suppress the utterance of intolerant philosophies; as long as we can counter them by rational argument and keep them in check by public opinion, suppression would certainly be most unwise. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance#Discussions https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance#Discussio...
- quantified 6y ago
  Just mentioning his name got me downvotes. HN has an interesting ecosystem.
  - crocodiletears 6y ago
    Popper has a point, but that particular quote has become an albatross around the neck of any discussion concerning censorship and cancel culture, to the point that it could very well be its own internet 'law'. GP's point of mentioning it was a preemption of the inevitable citation that someone might trot out as a cudgel against further dialogue.
    - quantified 6y ago
      “Being intolerant of intolerance” is one of those funny social paradoxes we grapple with somewhere around sixth grade. And yet we need to. No way I just tolerate your 6th grade BS directed towards me, for example. Actually formulating and calibrating the behaviors and responses that allow a suitably tolerant society (and tolerant of what exactly) is intriguing and seemingly worthy. Getting people to agree to taboos is one part of the negotiation. There’s a fairly well-reasoned article out there on how the less-tolerant and highly motivated end up steering society. The motivation and vigor of the intolerance matters a lot.
      - crocodiletears 6y ago
        > No way I just tolerate your 6th grade BS directed towards me, for example. I didn't downvote you, and I generally avoid the downvote feature. I was providing an explanation as to why you might have been downvoted. I'm not sure how I came across as immature, or unreasoned to you. Pretty sure I've read the article you're referencing (topped HN at some point in the past few months, I think). Was it this? https://medium.com/incerto/the-most-intolerant-wins-the-dictatorship-of-the-small-minority-3f1f83ce4e15 https://medium.com/incerto/the-most-intolerant-wins-the-dict...

deleted 6y ago

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