3 ms·

You propose to eliminate the concept of status? Impossible. Even monkeys have it.

Lammy 6y ago
You're on the right track with that comparison but need to connect the dots. Humanity's next stage of evolution is to Oneness imo.
- mcphage 6y ago
  Isn't that the Human Instrumentality Project that Seele was after?
  - Lammy 6y ago
    Sorry if this is meant to be a joke and I'm taking you seriously, but yeah, kinda? Just based on a read of the relevant wiki page anyway since I'm not the biggest Eva fan. It seems to portray trading individuality for oneness, though, and that doesn't fit with my beliefs. I view it more like: the thing that differentiates us from the other animals is our ability to create and exchange ideas quickly (latency) and thoroughly (bandwidth), and those ideas are a state of matter that seem totally dissimilar to our animal bodies. We talk about matter not being created or destroyed, so what is a new idea? What are ideas made of, and where do they exist? I don't know, but I believe my individual dense collection of ideas is my real "human" individual self if that makes any sense. All of humanity's various -ists and -phobias, on the other hand, seem to be about protecting our animal bodies, the food they need to eat, and the spaces they want to occupy. How much racism has historically stemmed from fear of a group of people in worse financial condition than one's own, coming in willing to work for lower wages thus threatening one's own stability in jobs, housing, food, and so on? How much homophobia (especially towards men) stems from fear of a gay son threatening generational wealth that could historically only be passed to male heirs? If humanity could collectively lose the need for all of that hate we can still have the "individual", and in fact many individuals at any level you could slice the One. The highest-bandwidth and lowest-latency links are (for now) obviously between the ideas in one's own brain, but similar densities form between people in committed relationships, between close-knit groups of friends, and so on. I just don't see any other path forward now that we humans have spread across the entire Earth and can communicate with any other person in realtime. So much land is "private" now. Where are people going to live? Depopulation should not be the answer, because that's like giving the One a lobotomy. We are all already neurons in a giant brain, like it or not, so I prefer trying to like it :)
imbnwa 6y ago
Yeah, chimps, bonobos (contrary to the popular conception), and humans all practice scapegoating, applying collective frustration/anxiety to a vulnerable member of the group). In the case of bonobos, there's an Attenborough doc where he literally narrates a scene of a young Bonobo after being mobbed on though I understand it appears fallacious since I can't recall which. But yeah, social hierarchy is endemic to, at the least, great apes like us, the difference just lies in how we deal with it. The most sexually successful Gorilla males appear to have figured out that you also have to show females that you're willing to give attention to kids even when they're not yours to demostrate real value as a mate, so our part of the animal family tree isn't without its improvements.

You're on the right track with that comparison but need to connect the dots. Humanity's next stage of evolution is to Oneness imo.

mcphage 6y ago
Isn't that the Human Instrumentality Project that Seele was after?
- Lammy 6y ago
  Sorry if this is meant to be a joke and I'm taking you seriously, but yeah, kinda? Just based on a read of the relevant wiki page anyway since I'm not the biggest Eva fan. It seems to portray trading individuality for oneness, though, and that doesn't fit with my beliefs. I view it more like: the thing that differentiates us from the other animals is our ability to create and exchange ideas quickly (latency) and thoroughly (bandwidth), and those ideas are a state of matter that seem totally dissimilar to our animal bodies. We talk about matter not being created or destroyed, so what is a new idea? What are ideas made of, and where do they exist? I don't know, but I believe my individual dense collection of ideas is my real "human" individual self if that makes any sense. All of humanity's various -ists and -phobias, on the other hand, seem to be about protecting our animal bodies, the food they need to eat, and the spaces they want to occupy. How much racism has historically stemmed from fear of a group of people in worse financial condition than one's own, coming in willing to work for lower wages thus threatening one's own stability in jobs, housing, food, and so on? How much homophobia (especially towards men) stems from fear of a gay son threatening generational wealth that could historically only be passed to male heirs? If humanity could collectively lose the need for all of that hate we can still have the "individual", and in fact many individuals at any level you could slice the One. The highest-bandwidth and lowest-latency links are (for now) obviously between the ideas in one's own brain, but similar densities form between people in committed relationships, between close-knit groups of friends, and so on. I just don't see any other path forward now that we humans have spread across the entire Earth and can communicate with any other person in realtime. So much land is "private" now. Where are people going to live? Depopulation should not be the answer, because that's like giving the One a lobotomy. We are all already neurons in a giant brain, like it or not, so I prefer trying to like it :)

imbnwa 6y ago

Yeah, chimps, bonobos (contrary to the popular conception), and humans all practice scapegoating, applying collective frustration/anxiety to a vulnerable member of the group). In the case of bonobos, there's an Attenborough doc where he literally narrates a scene of a young Bonobo after being mobbed on though I understand it appears fallacious since I can't recall which. But yeah, social hierarchy is endemic to, at the least, great apes like us, the difference just lies in how we deal with it. The most sexually successful Gorilla males appear to have figured out that you also have to show females that you're willing to give attention to kids even when they're not yours to demostrate real value as a mate, so our part of the animal family tree isn't without its improvements.