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Melvin capital and several other hedge funds engaged in naked short selling, and many backbone clearing houses enabled it via share counter fitting. (naked shor

Melvin capital and several other hedge funds engaged in naked short selling, and many backbone clearing houses enabled it via share counter fitting. (naked short selling is illegal) The deeper issue is the SEC not cracking down on the fail to delivers and naked short selling. I think Robinhood and other brokerages are the scape goats here. Their hands where tied when the companies that processed their orders refused to process trades for those stocks. The whole debacle has exposed a lot of corrupt, fraud and other nasties while showing the SEC is completely unwilling to do their job.

penagwin 6y ago
Is there a source for this? I watched their testimony to congress and they said they aren't even able to place naked shorts/calls. You can still get a short interest above 100% without selling naked calls/shorts.
- nrmitchi 6y ago
  This whole "illegal naked short sales" story recently is a conspiracy theory, not a valid theory, so you're not going to get a source. The main difference between a conspiracy theory and a valid theory is that a conspiracy theory is non-falsifiable; any evidence to the contrary is dismissed as "fake news" or "the deep state is hiding the evidence". In your example here of "they testified to Congress under penalty of perjury", the response will be "Ya, they lied, because they knew the whole system would back them. They faked all of the records that show that they didn't actually do it!". Now this isn't to say that a conspiracy theory can't be right in the end, but that still doesn't make it a valid theory.
  - fractionalhare 6y ago
    > The main difference between a conspiracy theory and a valid theory is that a conspiracy theory is non-falsifiable; any evidence to the contrary is dismissed as "fake news" or "the deep state is hiding the evidence". Likewise: if you're debating a claim with someone who is being intellectually honest, they'll receive your evidence and consider it critically on the merits. If you debate a claim with a conspiracy theorist, they will use any evidence you provide them to support the idea that the conspiracy theory is even bigger than they could have imagined - more parties are corrupt, more people are in on it, etc. It's exhausting.
fractionalhare 6y ago
> Melvin capital and several other hedge funds engaged in naked short selling, and many backbone clearing houses enabled it via share counter fitting. (naked short selling is illegal) No they didn't. Naked short selling is different from short selling while the short interest is high.
- dangerbird2 6y ago
  To clarify, People incorrectly assumed that because the short interest to float percentage was over 100%, the hedge funds had to be naked shorting. This is not true at all: because of how short selling works, there can be more than one short sale tied to a single share. Seller A borrows a share, sells it to buyer B. Buyer B then leases the share to Seller C, who then short sells it. This is not a naked short, but a plain ol' short sale. A naked short would be where Seller A doesn't own a share, but sells one to Buyer B anyway, with a contract stipulating the time the seller must buy and deliver the share. With the exception of market makers, this is illegal but ridiculously easy to detect, since Seller A's sales exceed the number of shares purchased. There is zero evidence any of the hedge funds were short selling.
  - nix0n 6y ago
    > With the exception of market makers, this is illegal Do you mean, this is legal for market makers? Is there any other way that the number of shares being shorted, could be greater than the number of shares in existence?
    - notyourday 6y ago
      > Do you mean, this is legal for market makers? Yes, market makers are allowed to sell short without having a locate. It should be noted that the market makers will attempt to zero out their total exposure by the end of the trading session.
      - mlrtime 6y ago
        That should be DMM or PMM or the equivalent designation by the exchange. These are special appointments, you can't just call yourself a market maker and sell short.

penagwin 6y ago

Is there a source for this? I watched their testimony to congress and they said they aren't even able to place naked shorts/calls. You can still get a short interest above 100% without selling naked calls/shorts.

nrmitchi 6y ago
This whole "illegal naked short sales" story recently is a conspiracy theory, not a valid theory, so you're not going to get a source. The main difference between a conspiracy theory and a valid theory is that a conspiracy theory is non-falsifiable; any evidence to the contrary is dismissed as "fake news" or "the deep state is hiding the evidence". In your example here of "they testified to Congress under penalty of perjury", the response will be "Ya, they lied, because they knew the whole system would back them. They faked all of the records that show that they didn't actually do it!". Now this isn't to say that a conspiracy theory can't be right in the end, but that still doesn't make it a valid theory.
- fractionalhare 6y ago
  > The main difference between a conspiracy theory and a valid theory is that a conspiracy theory is non-falsifiable; any evidence to the contrary is dismissed as "fake news" or "the deep state is hiding the evidence". Likewise: if you're debating a claim with someone who is being intellectually honest, they'll receive your evidence and consider it critically on the merits. If you debate a claim with a conspiracy theorist, they will use any evidence you provide them to support the idea that the conspiracy theory is even bigger than they could have imagined - more parties are corrupt, more people are in on it, etc. It's exhausting.

fractionalhare 6y ago

> Melvin capital and several other hedge funds engaged in naked short selling, and many backbone clearing houses enabled it via share counter fitting. (naked short selling is illegal) No they didn't. Naked short selling is different from short selling while the short interest is high.

dangerbird2 6y ago
To clarify, People incorrectly assumed that because the short interest to float percentage was over 100%, the hedge funds had to be naked shorting. This is not true at all: because of how short selling works, there can be more than one short sale tied to a single share. Seller A borrows a share, sells it to buyer B. Buyer B then leases the share to Seller C, who then short sells it. This is not a naked short, but a plain ol' short sale. A naked short would be where Seller A doesn't own a share, but sells one to Buyer B anyway, with a contract stipulating the time the seller must buy and deliver the share. With the exception of market makers, this is illegal but ridiculously easy to detect, since Seller A's sales exceed the number of shares purchased. There is zero evidence any of the hedge funds were short selling.
- nix0n 6y ago
  > With the exception of market makers, this is illegal Do you mean, this is legal for market makers? Is there any other way that the number of shares being shorted, could be greater than the number of shares in existence?
  - notyourday 6y ago
    > Do you mean, this is legal for market makers? Yes, market makers are allowed to sell short without having a locate. It should be noted that the market makers will attempt to zero out their total exposure by the end of the trading session.
    - mlrtime 6y ago
      That should be DMM or PMM or the equivalent designation by the exchange. These are special appointments, you can't just call yourself a market maker and sell short.