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IDK man, the last POTUS didn't seem so anti-authoritarian to me, but that might again be an outside position.

by iSnow 6y ago

throwaway0a5e 6y ago
I'm a big believer in the life experience determining the politics and Trump, Bloomberg, Biden, Pelosi, and all those other "in the urban neoliberal ruling class, spent their early careers in the urban ruling class" seem to want to solve problems using the jackboot. If you look at actual policy Bernie, AOC, Warren, etc push (i.e. not the twitter crap they pile on to for virtue points) much less authoritarians stuff despite being "further" left because they all cut their teeth serving the interests of different demographics.
- dfgjklj4 6y ago
  >...less authoritarian... "Green New Deal" harks back to a time when our government was literally being run by a single man. >The president stayed in charge of his administration...by drawing fully on his formal and informal powers as Chief Executive; by raising goals, creating momentum, inspiring a personal loyalty, getting the best out of people...by deliberately fostering among his aides a sense of competition and a clash of wills that led to disarray, heartbreak, and anger but also set off pulses of executive energy and sparks of creativity...by handing out one job to several men and several jobs to one man, thus strengthening his own position as a court of appeals, as a depository of information, and as a tool of co-ordination; by ignoring or bypassing collective decision-making agencies, such as the Cabinet...and always by persuading, flattering, juggling, improvising, reshuffling, harmonizing, conciliating, manipulating.[149] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franklin_D._Roosevelt#Presidency_(1933%E2%80%931945) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franklin_D._Roosevelt#Presiden...
Proziam 6y ago
I personally have very mixed feelings about Trump as a whole. On the one hand, I didn't vote for him. I see him as divisive and as an obstacle for progress on real issues that I personally care about. However, he has done a few things that I have sincere appreciation for. Primarily, we made significant gains towards peace in the middle east by negotiating treaties in the region. Another point in the win column (leading up the covid) was the economy. And the last major thing I cared about was reducing the US dependence on Chinese goods and labor (which are made so affordable due to inhumane practices). Regarding authoritarianism, he has a mixed track record. He had a thing for executive orders, but he also let the states largely handle the civil unrest and covid in the manner they saw fit. With that having been said, Trump was a Democrat for a long time, and was certainly not a typical political establishment individual. I find it difficult to attribute him to either party.
- maxerickson 6y ago
  His rhetoric against TPP did more harm to US China dependence than any good he did. "The Internet" was all in A Tizzy because the treaty spelled out some legal procedures (that withdrawing from the treaty would end), and forgot that it was aimed squarely at China.
  - Proziam 6y ago
    > His rhetoric against TPP did more harm to US China dependence than any good he did. I strongly agree. His rhetoric was one of the biggest, if not the biggest, issues with Trump as president overall. On that point, he failed miserably.
  - AzzieElbab 6y ago
    This is actually a good example of not recognizing bi-partisan positions due to lack of media coverage. Bernie Sanders Sep 14, 2016 Our free trade agreements have been a disaster. The Trans-Pacific Partnership is more of the same, but even worse. https://twitter.com/BernieSanders/status/776111579058364420 https://twitter.com/BernieSanders/status/776111579058364420
- AzzieElbab 6y ago
  I liked how Eric Weinstein described Trump as "existential threat". The idea was that while Trump is asking the right questions and does his best to follow up with the right policies, in the process of doing so he makes these issues "ugly" and tamed with "Trumpisism" assuring that no one ever will come back to these issues. Example: most American want stronger border, most Americans wont be caught dead screaming "... Go Home!" to anyone, but a Trump supporter is more likely to do so than most. Therefore the issue of "stronger border" is a taboo unless Trump gets re-elected
  - xupybd 6y ago
    Yes that is getting insane. Sections of the border wall are unfinished and now getting extra border patrol agents to police the unfinished sections. You can be police the border but you can't build a wall. All because a wall is now connected to Trump. Yet it does the same job as border patrol agents but with less risk of people getting shot.

IDK man, the last POTUS didn't seem so anti-authoritarian to me, but that might again be an outside position.

by iSnow 6y ago

IDK man, the last POTUS didn't seem so anti-authoritarian to me, but that might again be an outside position.

I'm a big believer in the life experience determining the politics and Trump, Bloomberg, Biden, Pelosi, and all those other "in the urban neoliberal ruling class, spent their early careers in the urban ruling class" seem to want to solve problems using the jackboot. If you look at actual policy Bernie, AOC, Warren, etc push (i.e. not the twitter crap they pile on to for virtue points) much less authoritarians stuff despite being "further" left because they all cut their teeth serving the interests of different demographics.

dfgjklj4 6y ago
>...less authoritarian... "Green New Deal" harks back to a time when our government was literally being run by a single man. >The president stayed in charge of his administration...by drawing fully on his formal and informal powers as Chief Executive; by raising goals, creating momentum, inspiring a personal loyalty, getting the best out of people...by deliberately fostering among his aides a sense of competition and a clash of wills that led to disarray, heartbreak, and anger but also set off pulses of executive energy and sparks of creativity...by handing out one job to several men and several jobs to one man, thus strengthening his own position as a court of appeals, as a depository of information, and as a tool of co-ordination; by ignoring or bypassing collective decision-making agencies, such as the Cabinet...and always by persuading, flattering, juggling, improvising, reshuffling, harmonizing, conciliating, manipulating.[149] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franklin_D._Roosevelt#Presidency_(1933%E2%80%931945) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franklin_D._Roosevelt#Presiden...

Proziam 6y ago

I personally have very mixed feelings about Trump as a whole. On the one hand, I didn't vote for him. I see him as divisive and as an obstacle for progress on real issues that I personally care about. However, he has done a few things that I have sincere appreciation for. Primarily, we made significant gains towards peace in the middle east by negotiating treaties in the region. Another point in the win column (leading up the covid) was the economy. And the last major thing I cared about was reducing the US dependence on Chinese goods and labor (which are made so affordable due to inhumane practices). Regarding authoritarianism, he has a mixed track record. He had a thing for executive orders, but he also let the states largely handle the civil unrest and covid in the manner they saw fit. With that having been said, Trump was a Democrat for a long time, and was certainly not a typical political establishment individual. I find it difficult to attribute him to either party.

maxerickson 6y ago
His rhetoric against TPP did more harm to US China dependence than any good he did. "The Internet" was all in A Tizzy because the treaty spelled out some legal procedures (that withdrawing from the treaty would end), and forgot that it was aimed squarely at China.
- Proziam 6y ago
  > His rhetoric against TPP did more harm to US China dependence than any good he did. I strongly agree. His rhetoric was one of the biggest, if not the biggest, issues with Trump as president overall. On that point, he failed miserably.
- AzzieElbab 6y ago
  This is actually a good example of not recognizing bi-partisan positions due to lack of media coverage. Bernie Sanders Sep 14, 2016 Our free trade agreements have been a disaster. The Trans-Pacific Partnership is more of the same, but even worse. https://twitter.com/BernieSanders/status/776111579058364420 https://twitter.com/BernieSanders/status/776111579058364420
AzzieElbab 6y ago
I liked how Eric Weinstein described Trump as "existential threat". The idea was that while Trump is asking the right questions and does his best to follow up with the right policies, in the process of doing so he makes these issues "ugly" and tamed with "Trumpisism" assuring that no one ever will come back to these issues. Example: most American want stronger border, most Americans wont be caught dead screaming "... Go Home!" to anyone, but a Trump supporter is more likely to do so than most. Therefore the issue of "stronger border" is a taboo unless Trump gets re-elected
- xupybd 6y ago
  Yes that is getting insane. Sections of the border wall are unfinished and now getting extra border patrol agents to police the unfinished sections. You can be police the border but you can't build a wall. All because a wall is now connected to Trump. Yet it does the same job as border patrol agents but with less risk of people getting shot.