5 ms·

Why is it not ethical? I would just sign it knowing that the law has you covered in case they (attempt to) take legal action against you in the future. These c

by akarma 6y ago

Why is it not ethical? I would just sign it knowing that the law has you covered in case they (attempt to) take legal action against you in the future. These companies don't care if some of their contract is enforceable -- they want you to believe it is. They almost certainly know the law and know that it isn't enforceable, but it's still there for a reason.

WalterBright 6y ago
> Why is it not ethical? Agreeing to something you have no intention of following through with is unethical. > These companies don't care It's about your ethics, not the company's. If you think the company is unethical, don't work for them.
- stale2002 6y ago
  > If you think the company is unethical, don't work for them Why would I do that? My ethics are that companies that do unethical things deserve to have other people harm the company in some way. That sounds like a way better way to retaliate against unethical companies. They deserve it, and it is a good thing to cause harm to groups that are doing bad things to others.
  - WalterBright 6y ago
    I don't choose to be a person like that.
    - stale2002 6y ago
      Ok, and because of that, your action will cause a huge amount of harm in the world because you let bad actors get away with bad things. My actions make the world a better place, and your actions make the world worse.
      - WalterBright 6y ago
        > My actions make the world a better place Reneging on your agreement only benefits you, and only in the short term. In the long term, you'll acquire a reputation that you don't keep your word, and fewer and fewer people will want to do business with you. Even worse, they won't tell you why, and you'll be wondering why you've been shut out. More bluntly, my father told me that what separates men from animals is men have honor. Each of us gets to choose what we are.
        eesmith 6y ago
        Many people buy property with racially restrictive covenants still attached to them, never intending to follow them, and knowing that those racist covenants have been unenforceable since the 1940s. Effectively none of these people have acquired a reputation that they are not keeping their word. (Indeed, voluntarily keeping their word would be illegal under the Fair Housing Act.) Just like I don't think anyone who has signed a contract with terms that aren't legally enforceable in CA has gotten a reputation for not keeping their word. (A rare handful of people will back out once they find such restrictions exist, or exercise the recent right in some jurisdictions to disclaim those covenants.) It's certainly true that covenants are much harder to change than an employment contract! But so far your argument hasn't been that simply signing a contract with an unenforceable term, where you know it's unenforceable, is unethical. You haven't placed a weight on the difficulty in making a change. Going back to your original statement: > say it's not valid in California so why have it in the contract People move. I always thought that if I moved from CA to TX then such clause would be binding. 'Course, I am not a lawyer. But if most people hold my opinion then again, there's no chance of reputation loss here.
        WalterBright 6y ago
        The racist covenant is a different situation as it is not only unenforceable, it is illegal for the owner to comply with it. It is not illegal for the employee to adhere to the non-compete agreement.
        6y ago

by akarma 6y ago

WalterBright 6y ago

> Why is it not ethical? Agreeing to something you have no intention of following through with is unethical. > These companies don't care It's about your ethics, not the company's. If you think the company is unethical, don't work for them.

stale2002 6y ago
> If you think the company is unethical, don't work for them Why would I do that? My ethics are that companies that do unethical things deserve to have other people harm the company in some way. That sounds like a way better way to retaliate against unethical companies. They deserve it, and it is a good thing to cause harm to groups that are doing bad things to others.
- WalterBright 6y ago
  I don't choose to be a person like that.
  - stale2002 6y ago
    Ok, and because of that, your action will cause a huge amount of harm in the world because you let bad actors get away with bad things. My actions make the world a better place, and your actions make the world worse.
    - WalterBright 6y ago
      > My actions make the world a better place Reneging on your agreement only benefits you, and only in the short term. In the long term, you'll acquire a reputation that you don't keep your word, and fewer and fewer people will want to do business with you. Even worse, they won't tell you why, and you'll be wondering why you've been shut out. More bluntly, my father told me that what separates men from animals is men have honor. Each of us gets to choose what we are.
      - eesmith 6y ago
        Many people buy property with racially restrictive covenants still attached to them, never intending to follow them, and knowing that those racist covenants have been unenforceable since the 1940s. Effectively none of these people have acquired a reputation that they are not keeping their word. (Indeed, voluntarily keeping their word would be illegal under the Fair Housing Act.) Just like I don't think anyone who has signed a contract with terms that aren't legally enforceable in CA has gotten a reputation for not keeping their word. (A rare handful of people will back out once they find such restrictions exist, or exercise the recent right in some jurisdictions to disclaim those covenants.) It's certainly true that covenants are much harder to change than an employment contract! But so far your argument hasn't been that simply signing a contract with an unenforceable term, where you know it's unenforceable, is unethical. You haven't placed a weight on the difficulty in making a change. Going back to your original statement: > say it's not valid in California so why have it in the contract People move. I always thought that if I moved from CA to TX then such clause would be binding. 'Course, I am not a lawyer. But if most people hold my opinion then again, there's no chance of reputation loss here.
        WalterBright 6y ago
        The racist covenant is a different situation as it is not only unenforceable, it is illegal for the owner to comply with it. It is not illegal for the employee to adhere to the non-compete agreement.
        6y ago