4 ms·

Out of curiosity, what are you afraid of?

xupybd 6y ago
When you attempt to build something from scratch you run the risk of creating something worse than the thing you were replacing.
- solosoyokaze 6y ago
  The police/prison industrial complex in the US is the worst in the world. It would be impossible to make it worse especially since its foundation is firmly rooted in racism (policy and history). We only gain from starting from scratch.
  - dragonwriter 6y ago
    > The police/prison industrial complex in the US is the worst in the world. It would be impossible to make it worse No, it wouldn't. It's not even, right now, the worst it's been in the US. (It may be the most controversial it's ever been, but that's because standards have evolved faster than it has, not because it has gotten worse.) It may be (but probably
    - solosoyokaze 6y ago
      We have the world's largest imprisoned population, both by total number and per capita: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarceration_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarcera... We have known issues with police violence and racism. We have insane police budgets and a militarized police force. We have a highly ineffective "war on drugs" that has destroyed wide swaths of our country. I don't think it's controversial to say that the US has the worst police force and prison industry on earth.
      - dragonwriter 6y ago
        > We have the world's largest imprisoned population, both by total number and per capita Perhaps; we certainly have the largest reported imprisoned population by those standards, but we also know that there are several countries whose numbers really, really can't be trusted. But, I didn't take issue with “the US police and prison industrial complex is the worst in the world” [0], I took issue with “it would be impossible to make it worse”, since it manifestly has been worse in terms of both abuses within the system and unjust motivations for getting people into the system. [0] which is not to say I agree, even setting aside potential issues with reporting of incarceration rates, because I'm not sure you've weighted situations where the “police” (and often the prison system, military, and other institutions) are heavily in league with organized crime, such as drug cartels, and directly involved in carrying out and covering up large scale murder on their behalf properly against incarceration rates.
        solosoyokaze 6y ago
        I'm interested in some concrete examples of how we could make it worse. Do you mean we'll spend even more money? It seems that rebuilding the police force with demilitarization as one of the driving principles would make that outcome unlikely.

When you attempt to build something from scratch you run the risk of creating something worse than the thing you were replacing.

solosoyokaze 6y ago
The police/prison industrial complex in the US is the worst in the world. It would be impossible to make it worse especially since its foundation is firmly rooted in racism (policy and history). We only gain from starting from scratch.
- dragonwriter 6y ago
  > The police/prison industrial complex in the US is the worst in the world. It would be impossible to make it worse No, it wouldn't. It's not even, right now, the worst it's been in the US. (It may be the most controversial it's ever been, but that's because standards have evolved faster than it has, not because it has gotten worse.) It may be (but probably
  - solosoyokaze 6y ago
    We have the world's largest imprisoned population, both by total number and per capita: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarceration_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarcera... We have known issues with police violence and racism. We have insane police budgets and a militarized police force. We have a highly ineffective "war on drugs" that has destroyed wide swaths of our country. I don't think it's controversial to say that the US has the worst police force and prison industry on earth.
    - dragonwriter 6y ago
      > We have the world's largest imprisoned population, both by total number and per capita Perhaps; we certainly have the largest reported imprisoned population by those standards, but we also know that there are several countries whose numbers really, really can't be trusted. But, I didn't take issue with “the US police and prison industrial complex is the worst in the world” [0], I took issue with “it would be impossible to make it worse”, since it manifestly has been worse in terms of both abuses within the system and unjust motivations for getting people into the system. [0] which is not to say I agree, even setting aside potential issues with reporting of incarceration rates, because I'm not sure you've weighted situations where the “police” (and often the prison system, military, and other institutions) are heavily in league with organized crime, such as drug cartels, and directly involved in carrying out and covering up large scale murder on their behalf properly against incarceration rates.
      - solosoyokaze 6y ago
        I'm interested in some concrete examples of how we could make it worse. Do you mean we'll spend even more money? It seems that rebuilding the police force with demilitarization as one of the driving principles would make that outcome unlikely.