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"clearly you're not a fan of touchscreens" "no, I hate the things, I mean in a fast car, actually they shouldn't be allowed in a fast car, they really shouldn'

"clearly you're not a fan of touchscreens" "no, I hate the things, I mean in a fast car, actually they shouldn't be allowed in a fast car, they really shouldn't" legendary f1/car designer Gordon Murray, approximately 30:05, but the complete video is gold : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4EIYQ6fkG4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4EIYQ6fkG4 anyone interested in cars, engineering or design (or a combination) should watch it. there's also a great podcast episode featuring him https://collectingcars.com/podcasts/ https://collectingcars.com/podcasts/ (episode 21). sorry since I don't have much to say about the article itself, wanted to share this though. I dislike almost everything about modern cars (touch is the least of my problems) ; usability, 'repairability', electronic assistance, cameras, trend towards SUVs (even if only for driving children to school), weight and size increase, technical gizmos, et cetera ... don't want to write that rant in full right now.

andrepd 6y ago
>electronic assistances and cameras That's a good thing, no? Plus safety improvements of course.
- Wxc2jjJmST9XWWL 6y ago
  - even in fast cars you often can't turn off the esc (electronic stability control) - it might actually not allow you to make unusual maneuvers (handbrake turns, etc) ; this actually can trigger the automatic emergency hotline call (been a witness) - it beeps at you for not wearing your seat belt (even while driving across an empty parking lot going 10 mph, or being on private property) - it has distance sensors (car beeps at you when driving out of a narrow parking garage constantly) - it warns you when it's cold, wet, you drive too fast ... - you can't set height of headlamps manually anymore (good for xeon which burn out everyone else's eyes even with default height settings...) - it might check whether you are in lane and warn when you go outside of it you might not agree, but all of that frustrates me (and does, whenever I have a rental), and makes me feel less in control and being treated like a child. -> add to all that : many electronic pieces are hard to replace, repair, debug if something isn't working ; not even talking about the full blown modern electronic gizmos where you now have to theoretically worry about your car getting (or not getting) software updates. Being in total control for me includes the ability to shoot yourself in the foot. I realize this isn't what your average 'a car is just a utility for me' driver wants, but what an enthusiast wants. to maybe come up with an imperfect analogy : average users use windows, power users use linux ; as long as I have linux as an option, I am happy. But the current development goes to a windows only world (in this metaphor), and it's rare to find cars that are exciting anymore.
  - amanaplanacanal 6y ago
    I’m trying to imagine a situation where I would want to not wear a seatbelt, but I don’t know what it would be.
    - RogerL 6y ago
      Driving around your property picking up tree branches or other debris. Backing a boat down a boat ramp. 4 wheeling where you have to hang out the window to see where your tire is. Basically there a lot of off road type situations where you want/need freedom of movement. I would guess from your comment that you don't these things, but many of us do. The one that kills me is it dings when the 'passenger' doesn't have their belt fashioned. Where the passenger is a box, or groceries, or whatever. I end up leaving the belt permanently put in, which is slightly annoying when I do have a passenger get in.
      - amanaplanacanal 6y ago
        Aye, that makes sense. All my driving is on pavement.
  - ska 6y ago
    > even in fast cars you often can't turn off the esc (electronic stability control) You can always drive older fast cars that are more manual. Not as safe maybe, but fun. Modern ones are mostly too powerful to do well without it.
  - heavenlyblue 6y ago
    > even while driving across an empty parking lot going 10 mph, or being on private property Being on private property does not imply you can break the law. And also being on private property does not imply lower chances or killing you self. If that were the case, construction workers would be in a really bad place since all of them work on “private property” - does that imply that they should not pay attention to health and safety? > you can't set height of headlamps manually anymore (good for xeon which burn out everyone else's eyes even with default height settings...) Why would you need to change the height of the headlights? Would you prefer for police to be given devices to detect if your lights were misconfigured when they stop you so that they could enforce that? Any safety methodology would tell you it’s easier to make sure people are unable to make mistakes rather than trying to make people conscious enough not to make them. Aviation industry is highly praised for that. > Being in total control for me includes an ability to shoot yourself in the foot. That’s the case where shooting yourself in the foot also implies shooting the brains out of a person who was stupid enough to stand a floor below you when you were shooting yourself in the foot. > power users use Linux But for example hardware running on Linux with high externalities if misconfigured is generally locked up (for example 4G modems and WiFi radio equipment). It will be really expensive for you to get your hands on “hacker” equipment to play with this.

andrepd 6y ago

>electronic assistances and cameras That's a good thing, no? Plus safety improvements of course.

Wxc2jjJmST9XWWL 6y ago
- even in fast cars you often can't turn off the esc (electronic stability control) - it might actually not allow you to make unusual maneuvers (handbrake turns, etc) ; this actually can trigger the automatic emergency hotline call (been a witness) - it beeps at you for not wearing your seat belt (even while driving across an empty parking lot going 10 mph, or being on private property) - it has distance sensors (car beeps at you when driving out of a narrow parking garage constantly) - it warns you when it's cold, wet, you drive too fast ... - you can't set height of headlamps manually anymore (good for xeon which burn out everyone else's eyes even with default height settings...) - it might check whether you are in lane and warn when you go outside of it you might not agree, but all of that frustrates me (and does, whenever I have a rental), and makes me feel less in control and being treated like a child. -> add to all that : many electronic pieces are hard to replace, repair, debug if something isn't working ; not even talking about the full blown modern electronic gizmos where you now have to theoretically worry about your car getting (or not getting) software updates. Being in total control for me includes the ability to shoot yourself in the foot. I realize this isn't what your average 'a car is just a utility for me' driver wants, but what an enthusiast wants. to maybe come up with an imperfect analogy : average users use windows, power users use linux ; as long as I have linux as an option, I am happy. But the current development goes to a windows only world (in this metaphor), and it's rare to find cars that are exciting anymore.
- amanaplanacanal 6y ago
  I’m trying to imagine a situation where I would want to not wear a seatbelt, but I don’t know what it would be.
  - RogerL 6y ago
    Driving around your property picking up tree branches or other debris. Backing a boat down a boat ramp. 4 wheeling where you have to hang out the window to see where your tire is. Basically there a lot of off road type situations where you want/need freedom of movement. I would guess from your comment that you don't these things, but many of us do. The one that kills me is it dings when the 'passenger' doesn't have their belt fashioned. Where the passenger is a box, or groceries, or whatever. I end up leaving the belt permanently put in, which is slightly annoying when I do have a passenger get in.
    - amanaplanacanal 6y ago
      Aye, that makes sense. All my driving is on pavement.
- ska 6y ago
  > even in fast cars you often can't turn off the esc (electronic stability control) You can always drive older fast cars that are more manual. Not as safe maybe, but fun. Modern ones are mostly too powerful to do well without it.
- heavenlyblue 6y ago
  > even while driving across an empty parking lot going 10 mph, or being on private property Being on private property does not imply you can break the law. And also being on private property does not imply lower chances or killing you self. If that were the case, construction workers would be in a really bad place since all of them work on “private property” - does that imply that they should not pay attention to health and safety? > you can't set height of headlamps manually anymore (good for xeon which burn out everyone else's eyes even with default height settings...) Why would you need to change the height of the headlights? Would you prefer for police to be given devices to detect if your lights were misconfigured when they stop you so that they could enforce that? Any safety methodology would tell you it’s easier to make sure people are unable to make mistakes rather than trying to make people conscious enough not to make them. Aviation industry is highly praised for that. > Being in total control for me includes an ability to shoot yourself in the foot. That’s the case where shooting yourself in the foot also implies shooting the brains out of a person who was stupid enough to stand a floor below you when you were shooting yourself in the foot. > power users use Linux But for example hardware running on Linux with high externalities if misconfigured is generally locked up (for example 4G modems and WiFi radio equipment). It will be really expensive for you to get your hands on “hacker” equipment to play with this.