7 ms·

Using completely wrong greek letters in the title is making me very uneasy for no good reason

omnicognate 6y ago
> I chose the name because I like the idea of having the freedom to write software without restrictions that transcends traditional boundaries. Actmallu pdrtable execmtable
- jwilk 6y ago
  Sorry to ruin the joke, but y is actually in Latin script.
  - omnicognate 6y ago
    Yeah, that's why I tried to pick the closest Greek has to a y sound, which I think (I only know a bit of GCSE ancient greek from 30 years ago) is upsilon. If I'd read it as the letter that looks most like a y it would have been "actmallg" (gamma).
jdxcode 6y ago
I read your comment thinking you were being stodgy, but then I went to the site and had the same reaction.
enriquto 6y ago
I used to feel the same way, and this is indeed an annoying practice. Yet here it makes perfect sense, since this work is based on using certain symbols (e.g., header magic numbers in one executable file format) according to a non-intended interpretation based on casual and meaningless similarities (e.g., as machine instructions in another executable file format).
- madeofpalk 6y ago
  okay well just fuck anyone using a screen reader then.
  - ryanianian 6y ago
    The HTML is accessible: <h1 title="Actually Portable Executable">αcτµαlly ...
    - enriquto 6y ago
      The whole page is written in beautiful HTML also (probably by hand?)
      - JxLS-cpgbe0 6y ago
        <p style="float:right"> <center> Sure looks handwritten to me. I guess "beautiful" is subjective; the <center> element being deprecated is not.
    - madeofpalk 6y ago
      ahhh fair!!! Unfortunately only the page title. Elsewhere in the document it's not annotated the <a href="https://raw.githubusercontent.com/jart/cosmopolitan/667ab245fe0326972b7da52a95da97125d61c8cf/ape/ape.S">αcτµαlly pδrταblε εxεcµταblε</a> format still obnoxious though imho
    - oqkf 6y ago
      No, that should be an ARIA label. Specifically NOT a `title` attribute. A title provides additional (not redundant) info and browsers and assistive technologies implement the attribute differently.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
  - coldtea 6y ago
    Why, do the people with the screen reader have some specific need to read the title of this article? As if it's some important resource or something? It's just one irrelevant thing they can't read, same as millions of articles written in different languages...
- oqkf 6y ago
  It doesn't make perfect sense. If the name is actually "Actually Portable Executable" then all users should be able to read it that way. If it is only stylized as "αcτµαlly pδrταblε εxεcµταblε" a readable name should be available alongside the visual styling (using ARIA attributes, for example).
  - thotsBgone 6y ago
    Mouse over the title on the webpage
    - oqkf 6y ago
      Ok, it shows a tooltip. The `title` attribute should specifically not be used here; ARIA labels should. The title attribute is implemented differently across browsers and assistive technologies [1] and is supposed to be a title, not a duplicate of the content of the element. https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/HTML/Global_attributes/title#accessibility_concerns https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/HTML/Global_att...
      - deleted 6y ago
        [deleted]
- defgeneric 6y ago
  But the metaphor doesn't work. I understand the intent, but if anything, it's more appropriate for an error-correcting code.
codetrotter 6y ago
Now you reminded me of a book that my grand father has, where the title is something like: Яцssiди Сдяs And it’s just so horrible to make a title using Cyrillic characters according to what looks like Latin and not according to their actual sounds XD
JoelMcCracken 6y ago
I mean, i keep reading it as the letters themselves; really the only two that bothered me were delta ~ d and not o, and mu is m and not u
pcthrowaway 6y ago
As someone who reads and speaks (μόνο ενά λίγο - only a little) Greek, same. There's a subreddit for parodying the phenomenon - http://reddit.com/r/grssk http://reddit.com/r/grssk
stjohnswarts 6y ago
Since I think this is a study in compatibility and not meant to be paradigm changing new programming concept I think the author is having fun with all of it rather than being overly serious and not concerned about being bookish
sn9 6y ago
Can't imagine that doing so is going over well for people using screen-readers.

> I chose the name because I like the idea of having the freedom to write software without restrictions that transcends traditional boundaries. Actmallu pdrtable execmtable

jwilk 6y ago
Sorry to ruin the joke, but y is actually in Latin script.
- omnicognate 6y ago
  Yeah, that's why I tried to pick the closest Greek has to a y sound, which I think (I only know a bit of GCSE ancient greek from 30 years ago) is upsilon. If I'd read it as the letter that looks most like a y it would have been "actmallg" (gamma).

jdxcode 6y ago

I read your comment thinking you were being stodgy, but then I went to the site and had the same reaction.

enriquto 6y ago

I used to feel the same way, and this is indeed an annoying practice. Yet here it makes perfect sense, since this work is based on using certain symbols (e.g., header magic numbers in one executable file format) according to a non-intended interpretation based on casual and meaningless similarities (e.g., as machine instructions in another executable file format).

madeofpalk 6y ago
okay well just fuck anyone using a screen reader then.
- ryanianian 6y ago
  The HTML is accessible: <h1 title="Actually Portable Executable">αcτµαlly ...
  - enriquto 6y ago
    The whole page is written in beautiful HTML also (probably by hand?)
    - JxLS-cpgbe0 6y ago
      <p style="float:right"> <center> Sure looks handwritten to me. I guess "beautiful" is subjective; the <center> element being deprecated is not.
  - madeofpalk 6y ago
    ahhh fair!!! Unfortunately only the page title. Elsewhere in the document it's not annotated the <a href="https://raw.githubusercontent.com/jart/cosmopolitan/667ab245fe0326972b7da52a95da97125d61c8cf/ape/ape.S">αcτµαlly pδrταblε εxεcµταblε</a> format still obnoxious though imho
  - oqkf 6y ago
    No, that should be an ARIA label. Specifically NOT a `title` attribute. A title provides additional (not redundant) info and browsers and assistive technologies implement the attribute differently.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- coldtea 6y ago
  Why, do the people with the screen reader have some specific need to read the title of this article? As if it's some important resource or something? It's just one irrelevant thing they can't read, same as millions of articles written in different languages...
oqkf 6y ago
It doesn't make perfect sense. If the name is actually "Actually Portable Executable" then all users should be able to read it that way. If it is only stylized as "αcτµαlly pδrταblε εxεcµταblε" a readable name should be available alongside the visual styling (using ARIA attributes, for example).
- thotsBgone 6y ago
  Mouse over the title on the webpage
  - oqkf 6y ago
    Ok, it shows a tooltip. The `title` attribute should specifically not be used here; ARIA labels should. The title attribute is implemented differently across browsers and assistive technologies [1] and is supposed to be a title, not a duplicate of the content of the element. https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/HTML/Global_attributes/title#accessibility_concerns https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/HTML/Global_att...
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
defgeneric 6y ago
But the metaphor doesn't work. I understand the intent, but if anything, it's more appropriate for an error-correcting code.

codetrotter 6y ago

Now you reminded me of a book that my grand father has, where the title is something like: Яцssiди Сдяs And it’s just so horrible to make a title using Cyrillic characters according to what looks like Latin and not according to their actual sounds XD

JoelMcCracken 6y ago

I mean, i keep reading it as the letters themselves; really the only two that bothered me were delta ~ d and not o, and mu is m and not u

pcthrowaway 6y ago

As someone who reads and speaks (μόνο ενά λίγο - only a little) Greek, same. There's a subreddit for parodying the phenomenon - http://reddit.com/r/grssk http://reddit.com/r/grssk

stjohnswarts 6y ago

Since I think this is a study in compatibility and not meant to be paradigm changing new programming concept I think the author is having fun with all of it rather than being overly serious and not concerned about being bookish

sn9 6y ago

Can't imagine that doing so is going over well for people using screen-readers.