5 ms·

>Your point is only correct if you replace the word "most" with "my." The fact that trackpads are hugely popular indicates that your needs are not typical, and

>Your point is only correct if you replace the word "most" with "my." The fact that trackpads are hugely popular indicates that your needs are not typical, and you should not impose your choices upon others with different needs. But Apple trackpads are not hugely popular, they have a fraction (~10%, likely less) of the global market. Does the fact that non-Apple computers are hugely popular indicate that the needs of Apple trackpad fans are not typical, and they should not extol their virtues to others? > Show me a better multi-purpose input device that I can use to rotate objects on a screen. Or zoom into a specific object without affecting other objects on a screen. Or configure to have multiple hotspots that when tapped can trigger events or macros. I’ve previously used a normal Apple mouse and keyboard to do all of these things in Adobe Photoshoshop and Illustrator on macOS and subsequently a random BestBuy mouse and ancient Compaq keyboard to do them in Gimp, Inkscape, and Blender on GNU (with xdotool for hot corners, which I’m counting as close enough to tapping hotspots). A graphics tablet would only work better. > Again, trackpads aren't your thing. Good for you. Other people love them, and millions of people get real work done on them each day. Again, non-Apple trackpads don’t seem to be your thing. Good for you. The majority of trackpad users use them every day.

reaperducer 6y ago
I’ve previously used a normal Apple Magic mouse and keyboard to do all of these things If you've used a Magic Mouse, then you've used a mouse with a trackpad on its back. Glad you liked it! And no, rotating in Photoshop with the keyboard isn't the same as rotating with a trackpad. It's an entirely different process that is significantly less efficient, unless you already know the exact angle of rotation you want down to the 0.1°.
- boogies 6y ago
  > If you've used a Magic Mouse, then you've used a mouse with a trackpad on its back. Glad you liked it! My mistake. I used a standard Apple mouse (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Mighty_Mouse https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Mighty_Mouse). I used its clickable scroll ball and squeeze functionality and suspect I would dislike the Magic mouse. > And no, rotating in Photoshop with the keyboard isn't the same as rotating with a trackpad. It's an entirely different process that is significantly less efficient, unless you already know the exact angle of rotation you want down to the 0.1°. IMO the ideal mouse + keyboard rotation style is Blender’s, which is more efficient in this scenario than a trackpad. But I still believe a graphics tablet would be objectively superior.
  - jaegerpicker 6y ago
    Have three graphics tablets, while they are FAR superior for art work they are not at all better for rotation. In fact I use blender on Mac and regularly use the trackpad to zoom and rotate because it's far more precise. Similar for 2D drawing, my favorite 2D environment is the iPad Pro and Apple Pencil. I still rotate with two finger gestures.
throwaway894345 6y ago
You... you do realize that you can’t order a PC laptop with a Mac trackpad, right? No one is like, “I could have the Mac trackpad for the same cost, but I prefer the stuttery trackpad that moves the cursor and selects shit when my palm gets too close”.
- boogies 6y ago
  > You... you do realize that you can’t order a PC laptop with a Mac trackpad, right? You can as long as you can order x86 Macs with Bootcamp. > No one is like, “I could have the Mac trackpad for the same cost, but I prefer the stuttery trackpad that moves the cursor and selects bleep when my palm gets too close”. No, but there are plenty of people who think “I prefer no trackpad to accidentally swipe [—even if palm rejection is perfect, I want total hand —including finger— rejection—] at all”, from people who buy Macs and use the setting Apple provides to disable the trackpad when mice are plugged in, to people who use their Mac as a PC laptop and manually disable the trackpad (https://www.lakshmikanth.com/how-to-disable-trackpad-on-bootcamp/ https://www.lakshmikanth.com/how-to-disable-trackpad-on-boot...), to people who try to more permanently disconnect broken old Mac trackpads (https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/386625/macbook-pro-2013-disable-trackpad-input-completely#386626 https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/386625/macbook-pro...), to people who physically disconnect their trackpads, to people who buy old thinkpads because eg. at least some x200s have only a trackpoint and fingerprint sensor.
  - throwaway894345 6y ago
    It seems like you've moved the goalposts from your original claim/implication that non-Mac trackpads are more popular to "not everyone likes trackpads". As far as I know, no one has argued that everyone likes trackpads?
    - boogies 6y ago
      My implication was that the fact that many people use trackpads doesn’t somehow prove that trackpads are a good tool (as reaperducer seemed to imply) (despite the fact that people can’t easily get laptops without them) any more than the fact that many people use non-Apple trackpads somehow proves that non-Apple trackpads are better (despite the fact that many people can’t easily get laptops they like without them).
BugsJustFindMe 6y ago
> But Apple trackpads are not hugely popular, they have a fraction (~10%, likely less) of the global market. The person you're replying to said "trackpads are popular" with no mention of Apple. Your entire argument so far has been against trackpads in general. Why shift goalposts?
- boogies 6y ago
  The comment I was replying to was ~⅔ quasi argumentum ad populum. So I replied to their quasi argumentum ad populum with examples of it applied to the broader context of the thread, including the comment I originally replied to, and replied to their other argument with counterpoints both with and without Apple hardware.
- likeclockwork 6y ago
  Is it even called a "trackpad" outside of Apple machines? I'm pretty sure they're called "touchpads" generally. So maybe "trackpad" is inherently referent to Apple.
  - BugsJustFindMe 6y ago
    > Is it even called a "trackpad" outside of Apple machines? Yes. https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/faqs/laptop-faqs/what-is-a-trackpad/ https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/faqs/laptop-faqs/what-is-a-trac... https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/surface-trackpad-settings/9wzdncrfhzt8?activetab=pivot:overviewtab https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/surface-trackpad-settings/... http://support.blackberry.com/kb/articleDetail?articleNumber=000035627 http://support.blackberry.com/kb/articleDetail?articleNumber... https://edgeup.asus.com/2019/the-asus-screenpad-2-0-lets-the-trackpad-do-so-much-more/ https://edgeup.asus.com/2019/the-asus-screenpad-2-0-lets-the... https://wikidiff.com/trackpad/touchpad https://wikidiff.com/trackpad/touchpad Trackpad and touchpad are generic synonyms according to every source I can find.
    - likeclockwork 6y ago
      I'm not sure that they actually are. Touchpad was the name I always heard for that kind of input, remember they're not only used in computers. I don't have the data but I think this is like the motherboard / logic board split. In other words "trackpad" may be Apple for "touchpad".

reaperducer 6y ago

I’ve previously used a normal Apple Magic mouse and keyboard to do all of these things If you've used a Magic Mouse, then you've used a mouse with a trackpad on its back. Glad you liked it! And no, rotating in Photoshop with the keyboard isn't the same as rotating with a trackpad. It's an entirely different process that is significantly less efficient, unless you already know the exact angle of rotation you want down to the 0.1°.

boogies 6y ago
> If you've used a Magic Mouse, then you've used a mouse with a trackpad on its back. Glad you liked it! My mistake. I used a standard Apple mouse (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Mighty_Mouse https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Mighty_Mouse). I used its clickable scroll ball and squeeze functionality and suspect I would dislike the Magic mouse. > And no, rotating in Photoshop with the keyboard isn't the same as rotating with a trackpad. It's an entirely different process that is significantly less efficient, unless you already know the exact angle of rotation you want down to the 0.1°. IMO the ideal mouse + keyboard rotation style is Blender’s, which is more efficient in this scenario than a trackpad. But I still believe a graphics tablet would be objectively superior.
- jaegerpicker 6y ago
  Have three graphics tablets, while they are FAR superior for art work they are not at all better for rotation. In fact I use blender on Mac and regularly use the trackpad to zoom and rotate because it's far more precise. Similar for 2D drawing, my favorite 2D environment is the iPad Pro and Apple Pencil. I still rotate with two finger gestures.

throwaway894345 6y ago

You... you do realize that you can’t order a PC laptop with a Mac trackpad, right? No one is like, “I could have the Mac trackpad for the same cost, but I prefer the stuttery trackpad that moves the cursor and selects shit when my palm gets too close”.

boogies 6y ago
> You... you do realize that you can’t order a PC laptop with a Mac trackpad, right? You can as long as you can order x86 Macs with Bootcamp. > No one is like, “I could have the Mac trackpad for the same cost, but I prefer the stuttery trackpad that moves the cursor and selects bleep when my palm gets too close”. No, but there are plenty of people who think “I prefer no trackpad to accidentally swipe [—even if palm rejection is perfect, I want total hand —including finger— rejection—] at all”, from people who buy Macs and use the setting Apple provides to disable the trackpad when mice are plugged in, to people who use their Mac as a PC laptop and manually disable the trackpad (https://www.lakshmikanth.com/how-to-disable-trackpad-on-bootcamp/ https://www.lakshmikanth.com/how-to-disable-trackpad-on-boot...), to people who try to more permanently disconnect broken old Mac trackpads (https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/386625/macbook-pro-2013-disable-trackpad-input-completely#386626 https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/386625/macbook-pro...), to people who physically disconnect their trackpads, to people who buy old thinkpads because eg. at least some x200s have only a trackpoint and fingerprint sensor.
- throwaway894345 6y ago
  It seems like you've moved the goalposts from your original claim/implication that non-Mac trackpads are more popular to "not everyone likes trackpads". As far as I know, no one has argued that everyone likes trackpads?
  - boogies 6y ago
    My implication was that the fact that many people use trackpads doesn’t somehow prove that trackpads are a good tool (as reaperducer seemed to imply) (despite the fact that people can’t easily get laptops without them) any more than the fact that many people use non-Apple trackpads somehow proves that non-Apple trackpads are better (despite the fact that many people can’t easily get laptops they like without them).

BugsJustFindMe 6y ago

> But Apple trackpads are not hugely popular, they have a fraction (~10%, likely less) of the global market. The person you're replying to said "trackpads are popular" with no mention of Apple. Your entire argument so far has been against trackpads in general. Why shift goalposts?

boogies 6y ago
The comment I was replying to was ~⅔ quasi argumentum ad populum. So I replied to their quasi argumentum ad populum with examples of it applied to the broader context of the thread, including the comment I originally replied to, and replied to their other argument with counterpoints both with and without Apple hardware.
likeclockwork 6y ago
Is it even called a "trackpad" outside of Apple machines? I'm pretty sure they're called "touchpads" generally. So maybe "trackpad" is inherently referent to Apple.
- BugsJustFindMe 6y ago
  > Is it even called a "trackpad" outside of Apple machines? Yes. https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/faqs/laptop-faqs/what-is-a-trackpad/ https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/faqs/laptop-faqs/what-is-a-trac... https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/surface-trackpad-settings/9wzdncrfhzt8?activetab=pivot:overviewtab https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/surface-trackpad-settings/... http://support.blackberry.com/kb/articleDetail?articleNumber=000035627 http://support.blackberry.com/kb/articleDetail?articleNumber... https://edgeup.asus.com/2019/the-asus-screenpad-2-0-lets-the-trackpad-do-so-much-more/ https://edgeup.asus.com/2019/the-asus-screenpad-2-0-lets-the... https://wikidiff.com/trackpad/touchpad https://wikidiff.com/trackpad/touchpad Trackpad and touchpad are generic synonyms according to every source I can find.
  - likeclockwork 6y ago
    I'm not sure that they actually are. Touchpad was the name I always heard for that kind of input, remember they're not only used in computers. I don't have the data but I think this is like the motherboard / logic board split. In other words "trackpad" may be Apple for "touchpad".