4 ms·

Once you have a receipt from Apple for the music, you have proof of ownership. If you accidentally lost the CD between then and the time you get your PC taken

by count 15y ago

Once you have a receipt from Apple for the music, you have proof of ownership. If you accidentally lost the CD between then and the time you get your PC taken away for discovery in a copyright infringement lawsuit, that's plausible deniability. At least, way more so than just having 2TB of MP3s laying around with no media you ripped them from at all...

michael_dorfman 15y ago
Not really. Once you have a receipt from Apple, you have documentation that you used Apple's transcoding service. If you accidentally lost 2TB worth of CDs between that time and the seizure of your PC, you're still going to have some explaining to do.
- nkassis 15y ago
  It would be like presuming guilt, you don't have to prove those mp3s are legal they have to prove that you stole them. Also having mp3s isn't the same as distributing mp3s. tptacek is right I believe. As far as I understand it, every p2p case has been about distribution or suspicion of distribution (make available argument). And they have to have a reason to come scan your computer. Hence why I won't be using this "scan and buy" service, the scan part is dumb. Also as far as I know all my Amazon MP3 are identical to other users Amazon MP3 I don't think they have watermarks. How could you tell if they were mine or taken from someone.
  - barrkel 15y ago
    In a civil prosecution (which is how copyright violation ought normally be handled, particularly at the individual consumer level) the burden of proof is usually only "the balance of probabilities" (i.e. more likely to be true than not be true), not "beyond a reasonable doubt". (Of course, media companies would prefer that the government pass laws, pay for and implement the job of enforcing media company contracts, and this muddies the waters.)
    - count 15y ago
      That brings up a very interesting point - copyright lawsuits are currently civil affairs, and require a much lower burden of proof. The 'Industry' is pushing for it to become a felony, which would squarely sit it 'beyond a reasonable doubt' territory. My understanding is their current cases are full of little holes like this - would making it a felony actually make it easier for people to get away without convictions?
tptacek 15y ago
The reality here seems to be, people don't get busted for the 2TB of unlawful music they keep on their hard drives. They get busted for the gigabytes of music they actively transmit on P2P networks. So while this is a valid geek conundrum, it may not be of any practical import.

by count 15y ago

michael_dorfman 15y ago

Not really. Once you have a receipt from Apple, you have documentation that you used Apple's transcoding service. If you accidentally lost 2TB worth of CDs between that time and the seizure of your PC, you're still going to have some explaining to do.

nkassis 15y ago
It would be like presuming guilt, you don't have to prove those mp3s are legal they have to prove that you stole them. Also having mp3s isn't the same as distributing mp3s. tptacek is right I believe. As far as I understand it, every p2p case has been about distribution or suspicion of distribution (make available argument). And they have to have a reason to come scan your computer. Hence why I won't be using this "scan and buy" service, the scan part is dumb. Also as far as I know all my Amazon MP3 are identical to other users Amazon MP3 I don't think they have watermarks. How could you tell if they were mine or taken from someone.
- barrkel 15y ago
  In a civil prosecution (which is how copyright violation ought normally be handled, particularly at the individual consumer level) the burden of proof is usually only "the balance of probabilities" (i.e. more likely to be true than not be true), not "beyond a reasonable doubt". (Of course, media companies would prefer that the government pass laws, pay for and implement the job of enforcing media company contracts, and this muddies the waters.)
  - count 15y ago
    That brings up a very interesting point - copyright lawsuits are currently civil affairs, and require a much lower burden of proof. The 'Industry' is pushing for it to become a felony, which would squarely sit it 'beyond a reasonable doubt' territory. My understanding is their current cases are full of little holes like this - would making it a felony actually make it easier for people to get away without convictions?

tptacek 15y ago

The reality here seems to be, people don't get busted for the 2TB of unlawful music they keep on their hard drives. They get busted for the gigabytes of music they actively transmit on P2P networks. So while this is a valid geek conundrum, it may not be of any practical import.