5 ms·

A list of open and open source 5G software projects

75 points by mychele 6y ago

kemitchell 6y ago
Patents?
- anaganisk 6y ago
  Humble doubt: Are they applicable on non-commercial and open source uses too? Can patents prevent that?
  - kemitchell 6y ago
    Yes. https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/35/271 https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/35/271
  - southerntofu 6y ago
    It really depends on your legislation, and also how much you allow yourself to be governed by unjust legislation. For example people like Rhizomatica are building internet / cellphone infrastructure on a free-software stack without (to my knowledge) caring at all about patents (good). On the other side of the world Freifunk community network in Germany has in i believe illegal activities to protect their users, and have fought up to the supreme court for that. Sorry i can't really provide a source as i don't speak german but it has something to do with secondary liability. So overall, please never let anyone dictate all the good you should do. Especially not lawmakers and lawyers.
    - TobTobXX 6y ago
      This? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freifunk#Legal_Issues https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freifunk#Legal_Issues Terrifying.
      - southerntofu 6y ago
        That's probably it. However i'm not from germany and don't speak german so please don't take my word for it.
  - teddyh 6y ago
    Oh my yes: http://endsoftpatents.org/ http://endsoftpatents.org/
- ng55QPSK 6y ago
  I'm part of 5G research and you would find my name on some 5G patents (and on 4G and 3G ... which means i do this now for long time). Actually depending on the local law (EU here) usage is usage. Most patent holders (i.e. the mobile communication industry, think Qualcomm, Ericssion, Huawei, Intel, Nokia, Operators etc.) don't enforce patents on non-commercial activities. If you make money with standards that have patents applied there are licensing schemes.
waynesonfire 6y ago
Is this stuff applicable to hobbyists?
- mychele 6y ago
  OP here. You would need some hardware components to run a 5G stack, starting from servers to software-defined radios. Another challenge may be linked to spectrum licenses, unless you transmit/receive in unlicensed bands.
  - waynesonfire 6y ago
    Thanks, thought so.
southerntofu 6y ago
5G is not supported by most phones. It requires a lot more infrastructure (base stations) than traditional GSM because of shorter range, so operators worldwide are currently on a concrete craze destroying the environment ever more. And it opens a lot more avenues for surveillance. All of that without bringing any measurable improvement of life to anyone. Why the hell would i want free-software stack for that tech? On one hand it'll be used to legitimize 5G in the first place which is far from consensual topic, even in tech-friendly circles. On the other hand, i conceptually appreciate the idea to run my own GSM stack, BUT 5G is mostly worse (if i want short range i'll just do wifi thanks) and even if i run my own stack, commercial operators will never peer with me so my users won't be able to talk with anyone else (pretty useless). In my very personal view, cell phone networks are useless pieces of tech that need to be replaced with proper Internet infrastructure.
- ng55QPSK 6y ago
  "5G is not supported by most phones." - "It requires a lot more infrastructure (base stations) than traditional GSM because of shorter range". Is not fully correct. 5G brings a new air-interface and a new system architecture. Your 4G phone might use a 5G network already without you noticing - as the operators moveed to 5G system architecture already while keeping their 4G air-interface. And you can run 5G air-interface on the same spectrum 4G (or 3G) was on.
  - southerntofu 6y ago
    You are of course technically correct. However, most providers here have not deployed 5G yet, and are facing waves of sabotage with their trial deployments as the people are angry due to the number of controversies surrounding 5G. The usual criticisms of surveillance capitalism and IoT apply, but also: > The report, published Saturday, found that 5G networks could be responsible for an extra 3 to 7 billion extra tonnes of CO2 released into atmosphere. https://www.france24.com/en/europe/20201220-deploying-5g-will-lead-to-spike-in-co2-emissions-french-climate-council-warns https://www.france24.com/en/europe/20201220-deploying-5g-wil... > moveed to 5G system architecture already while keeping their 4G air-interface Yes, so that means operator have to deploy their new 5G towers. And in addition, they still have to maintain existing infrastructure, or redeploy 2G/4G setup on their new towers. In my opinion, that's a strong maintenance burden, and a strong waste of resources that we could do without. But what's really shocking is that most of the population still has bad connectivity, and those who have the 4G are already pretty happy with it. It's an understatement to say it's an insult to pour billions of $$$$ into 5G when some folks still don't have any (or so little) xDSL or even 2G.

75 points by mychele 6y ago

kemitchell 6y ago

Patents?

anaganisk 6y ago
Humble doubt: Are they applicable on non-commercial and open source uses too? Can patents prevent that?
- kemitchell 6y ago
  Yes. https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/35/271 https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/35/271
- southerntofu 6y ago
  It really depends on your legislation, and also how much you allow yourself to be governed by unjust legislation. For example people like Rhizomatica are building internet / cellphone infrastructure on a free-software stack without (to my knowledge) caring at all about patents (good). On the other side of the world Freifunk community network in Germany has in i believe illegal activities to protect their users, and have fought up to the supreme court for that. Sorry i can't really provide a source as i don't speak german but it has something to do with secondary liability. So overall, please never let anyone dictate all the good you should do. Especially not lawmakers and lawyers.
  - TobTobXX 6y ago
    This? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freifunk#Legal_Issues https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freifunk#Legal_Issues Terrifying.
    - southerntofu 6y ago
      That's probably it. However i'm not from germany and don't speak german so please don't take my word for it.
- teddyh 6y ago
  Oh my yes: http://endsoftpatents.org/ http://endsoftpatents.org/
ng55QPSK 6y ago
I'm part of 5G research and you would find my name on some 5G patents (and on 4G and 3G ... which means i do this now for long time). Actually depending on the local law (EU here) usage is usage. Most patent holders (i.e. the mobile communication industry, think Qualcomm, Ericssion, Huawei, Intel, Nokia, Operators etc.) don't enforce patents on non-commercial activities. If you make money with standards that have patents applied there are licensing schemes.

waynesonfire 6y ago

Is this stuff applicable to hobbyists?

mychele 6y ago
OP here. You would need some hardware components to run a 5G stack, starting from servers to software-defined radios. Another challenge may be linked to spectrum licenses, unless you transmit/receive in unlicensed bands.
- waynesonfire 6y ago
  Thanks, thought so.

southerntofu 6y ago

5G is not supported by most phones. It requires a lot more infrastructure (base stations) than traditional GSM because of shorter range, so operators worldwide are currently on a concrete craze destroying the environment ever more. And it opens a lot more avenues for surveillance. All of that without bringing any measurable improvement of life to anyone. Why the hell would i want free-software stack for that tech? On one hand it'll be used to legitimize 5G in the first place which is far from consensual topic, even in tech-friendly circles. On the other hand, i conceptually appreciate the idea to run my own GSM stack, BUT 5G is mostly worse (if i want short range i'll just do wifi thanks) and even if i run my own stack, commercial operators will never peer with me so my users won't be able to talk with anyone else (pretty useless). In my very personal view, cell phone networks are useless pieces of tech that need to be replaced with proper Internet infrastructure.

ng55QPSK 6y ago
"5G is not supported by most phones." - "It requires a lot more infrastructure (base stations) than traditional GSM because of shorter range". Is not fully correct. 5G brings a new air-interface and a new system architecture. Your 4G phone might use a 5G network already without you noticing - as the operators moveed to 5G system architecture already while keeping their 4G air-interface. And you can run 5G air-interface on the same spectrum 4G (or 3G) was on.
- southerntofu 6y ago
  You are of course technically correct. However, most providers here have not deployed 5G yet, and are facing waves of sabotage with their trial deployments as the people are angry due to the number of controversies surrounding 5G. The usual criticisms of surveillance capitalism and IoT apply, but also: > The report, published Saturday, found that 5G networks could be responsible for an extra 3 to 7 billion extra tonnes of CO2 released into atmosphere. https://www.france24.com/en/europe/20201220-deploying-5g-will-lead-to-spike-in-co2-emissions-french-climate-council-warns https://www.france24.com/en/europe/20201220-deploying-5g-wil... > moveed to 5G system architecture already while keeping their 4G air-interface Yes, so that means operator have to deploy their new 5G towers. And in addition, they still have to maintain existing infrastructure, or redeploy 2G/4G setup on their new towers. In my opinion, that's a strong maintenance burden, and a strong waste of resources that we could do without. But what's really shocking is that most of the population still has bad connectivity, and those who have the 4G are already pretty happy with it. It's an understatement to say it's an insult to pour billions of $$$$ into 5G when some folks still don't have any (or so little) xDSL or even 2G.