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I watched bitcoin. I remember people spending 50BTC for pizzas, or whatever. I mined a couple dozen and threw that laptop away. I don't feel like I missed out.

I watched bitcoin. I remember people spending 50BTC for pizzas, or whatever. I mined a couple dozen and threw that laptop away. I don't feel like I missed out. I invest because I want value. I want to own a part of something that generates value to the world. I invest to meet my goals (which I've already done without BTC). I invest to sleep well knowing that my money is making me money. BTC offers none of this. I challenge you to name any value BTC provides beyond moving money from one jurisdiction to another. (Which is still value, but not one I need, nor feel the need to speculate in.) Am I bitter others got rich? Nope. Do I wish I was richer? Not really, I'm doing fine, I don't spend what I have anyway. Do I worry about BTC mania infecting others and possibly causing harm where it's not needed? Yes. That is why BTC is a bad idea. It's pure speculation. There is no value beyond what someone else will pay you for it.

Sodman 6y ago
> I mined a couple dozen and threw that laptop away. I don't feel like I missed out. > I invest because I want value. So you want value, but you don't feel that you missed out by throwing out over a million dollars worth of assets? (couple dozen at ~50k/BTC valuation). Sure it has no value beyond what someone else will pay you for it, but today somebody else would literally be willing to give you over a million dollars for it.
- nappy-doo 6y ago
  That's like counting angels on a head of a pin. Would I have sold it before 50k? yes, yes I would. Can I accurately predict what someone would pay me for it tomorrow? No. Can I estimate the amount it will return to me in 10 years through dividends, or earnings growth, or repurchases (or in BTC's case, lost wallets)? No. Is there regulation protecting my investment? Not really. It is a purely speculative investment. If you want to go find my laptop, it's in a landfill in Massachusetts somewhere. Have at it! It was an early macbook. It has a Daft Punk sticker I bought at Newbury Comics. Value is NOT price. BTC objectively has no little to no value. Price, sure, it's all over the place. What is the par value of a BTC? What's the earnings yield on it? ROIC? ROE? How is it providing jobs to people (beyond speculators)? It is (objectively) a drag on society and progress. No thank you.
  - anm89 6y ago
    Price is value if you sell at that price. You then would gain currency which you could exchange for something that you think is a better value.
    - nappy-doo 6y ago
      You're making my point for me. BTC has no value. To be useful, I need it to be something else. I have made so much more in salary and investment growth than those BTC in the same time. I provide value to the world, and world has rewarded that. BTC provides nothing but speeding the heat-death of the universe and hodl memes.
      - anm89 6y ago
        BTC is up about 10x from it's year low right now. Are you saying you have 10xed your networth with salary in that timeframe?
        nappy-doo 6y ago
        Nope. I'm saying I've made more since I mined the bitcoin, apologies if that didn't make sense. Ok, I have a proposition. Let's negotiate. How many BTC/year do you require for me to buy all of your work product, for the rest of your life? How many BTC do you want? Choose carefully. I posit, there is no amount we can agree on to make this transaction.
  - Sodman 6y ago
    If you don't want to be any richer, then why do returns, dividends, yields or earnings growth matter? It's great that you're successful enough that throwing away over a million dollars worth of BTC isn't a big deal for you, but that's a life-changing amount of money for most folks. I'm making no claims about the features or benefits of BTC, but one million dollars worth of bitcoin is primarily useful because it can be exchanged for one million dollars, today, right now. It doesn't need any additional features, promises, guarantees or selling points.

Sodman 6y ago

> I mined a couple dozen and threw that laptop away. I don't feel like I missed out. > I invest because I want value. So you want value, but you don't feel that you missed out by throwing out over a million dollars worth of assets? (couple dozen at ~50k/BTC valuation). Sure it has no value beyond what someone else will pay you for it, but today somebody else would literally be willing to give you over a million dollars for it.

nappy-doo 6y ago
That's like counting angels on a head of a pin. Would I have sold it before 50k? yes, yes I would. Can I accurately predict what someone would pay me for it tomorrow? No. Can I estimate the amount it will return to me in 10 years through dividends, or earnings growth, or repurchases (or in BTC's case, lost wallets)? No. Is there regulation protecting my investment? Not really. It is a purely speculative investment. If you want to go find my laptop, it's in a landfill in Massachusetts somewhere. Have at it! It was an early macbook. It has a Daft Punk sticker I bought at Newbury Comics. Value is NOT price. BTC objectively has no little to no value. Price, sure, it's all over the place. What is the par value of a BTC? What's the earnings yield on it? ROIC? ROE? How is it providing jobs to people (beyond speculators)? It is (objectively) a drag on society and progress. No thank you.
- anm89 6y ago
  Price is value if you sell at that price. You then would gain currency which you could exchange for something that you think is a better value.
  - nappy-doo 6y ago
    You're making my point for me. BTC has no value. To be useful, I need it to be something else. I have made so much more in salary and investment growth than those BTC in the same time. I provide value to the world, and world has rewarded that. BTC provides nothing but speeding the heat-death of the universe and hodl memes.
    - anm89 6y ago
      BTC is up about 10x from it's year low right now. Are you saying you have 10xed your networth with salary in that timeframe?
      - nappy-doo 6y ago
        Nope. I'm saying I've made more since I mined the bitcoin, apologies if that didn't make sense. Ok, I have a proposition. Let's negotiate. How many BTC/year do you require for me to buy all of your work product, for the rest of your life? How many BTC do you want? Choose carefully. I posit, there is no amount we can agree on to make this transaction.
- Sodman 6y ago
  If you don't want to be any richer, then why do returns, dividends, yields or earnings growth matter? It's great that you're successful enough that throwing away over a million dollars worth of BTC isn't a big deal for you, but that's a life-changing amount of money for most folks. I'm making no claims about the features or benefits of BTC, but one million dollars worth of bitcoin is primarily useful because it can be exchanged for one million dollars, today, right now. It doesn't need any additional features, promises, guarantees or selling points.