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It's not nearly as deadly as we feared when we initially started this lockdown insanity. Survival rate is what, 99.7% now? Back in March the fear was another 19

It's not nearly as deadly as we feared when we initially started this lockdown insanity. Survival rate is what, 99.7% now? Back in March the fear was another 1918 (CFR of like 2-4%). It's by basically every country's estimates an order of magnitude less deadly than we feared. Yet here we are, many folks scared so much they're praising their jailers and starting to love their cages.

dawnerd 6y ago
The nearly 500k dead Americans would like to think otherwise.
- throwaway3699 6y ago
  I'll bet a good chunk of that 500k also disagree with locking people in their homes and ruining the prospects of multiple future generations. Being anti-lockdown does not mean being pro-death. Now we know more about the virus the lockdown measures must be re-evaluated.
  - dawnerd 6y ago
    Dude there’s been no lockdowns in this country. Stay at home orders haven’t even been enforced, and people like yourself make them useless anyways.
    - throwaway3699 6y ago
      Thanks for generalising. I don't break the restrictions just because I'm arguing against them. Nor am I an American. What I do know is my American friends are suffering for the same reasons my local community are, and it's abhorrent to continue supporting these policies when it's destroying so many lives. I'm sick of hearing stories about children trying to commit suicide, people getting fat and lazy, domestic abuse reports skyrocketing, small businesses going under and taking generational wealth out of the working class. This isn't worth it, and we need a better solution.
      - teclordphrack2 6y ago
        "I don't break the restrictions" liar.
        throwaway3699 6y ago
        You don't know me. I have no reason to break to break restrictions. But I'm a comfortable tech worker while others aren't so lucky.
      - dawnerd 6y ago
        Ok I’m not going to argue anymore but let me point out some things since it sounds like you’re getting a distorted picture of what’s going on here. Everyone is free to travel anywhere in the country and even outside to places welcoming people. Schools are opening back up pretty quickly. Restaurants are doing in person again despite all common sense. Amusement centers are either already open or on the path to open, most are not even hurting that bad and some are flourishing (look at Disney’s stock price, what pandemic?). The only people really hurting the most are bars. And I really hate to say it but if someone is going to kill themselves over these “lockdowns” they’re already mentally ill and still would be without the pandemic. That’s another discussion around the poor state of mental health globally. The only thing destroying so many lives are families deciding to host massive parties and watching all of their relatives die from covid over a month. I guarantee unless your friends own a bar, they’re not hurting as much as they might lead on to believe.
      - pbourke 6y ago
        > taking generational wealth out of the working class. Do you have a source for that claim? Household savings were up across all American income categories in 2020. The $600 / week federal unemployment benefit that ended in July 2020 was the most significant (accidental) antipoverty program in decades. It lasted long enough that it’s effects will probably be felt for a year or more.
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
- sjwalter 6y ago
  You should write headlines for CNN. How does the fact that 2019 had a much much less deadly flu season fit into your narrative? And 2020 magically did away with the flu, eradicating this awful virus, plus reduced heart attacks massively.
throwawaymanbot 6y ago
Please provide factual data on the survival rate and not just your opinion of 99.7% What we do know is It has killed (currently) nearly 400-500K people in the US alone. It overwhelmed the health services of many places in the world and even here in the US (Even though the last president sought to massage those figures for less bad press) It causes long term problems in lungs and hearts, and goodness knows what else in perhaps up to 25% of the people who may not know how badly they are affected for years. In fact Covid19 has actually reduced the average age an American lives to by an entire year. And we know that wearing a mask was politicized to the point that its still a symbol of division instead of common sense protection that, lets face it, had it been adhered to and not turned in to a conspiracy theory divisive action may have enabled those very stores in California to remain open. Cant have it both ways!
flyingcircus3 6y ago
So to get your cooperation the next time the world needs collective sacrifice, the people defining the emergent worldwide problem on day one must be precisely correct in their predictions for what will happen over the next year?
- sjwalter 6y ago
  Of course not. But they have actually acted in such a way as to completely obliterate any credibility they had. From lying about masks being useful (Fauci), to the WHO carrying water for China, to the "it's 100% proven zoonosis, couldn't possibly be a lab creation), to the rapid shift away from any commentary about IFR/CFR once it became clear that it was an order of magnitude off. What's strange is I'm not arguing against crazy strict measures during a deadly pandemic. What I'm arguing is that we have learned a lot about this coronavirus, which is just one of thousands/millions of coronaviruses, and even though we learned it was nothing like what we feared, the policy response never changed.
  - flyingcircus3 6y ago
    Why do you associate the lack of credibility with investigation into the virus's origin? What lends any credibility to the lab theory? Science isnt a team sport, yet a certain group of people seem very invested in the sinister explanation. It's been repeated over and over that initial recommendations against mask usage was in the hope that people didn't hoard them and prevent healthcare workers from getting them. Predicting the irrational behavior of large populations is a key skill of leadership. Judging by way people hoard toilet paper, hand sanitizer, and other goods, that prediction seems pretty spot on. The disease being less deadly than we feared, and our response to it remaining the same are not contradictory. Even 10x less deaths than originally predicted is still a major crisis. It is still worthy of attempts to mitigate the problem, and the mitigation strategies are still the same.

dawnerd 6y ago

The nearly 500k dead Americans would like to think otherwise.

throwaway3699 6y ago
I'll bet a good chunk of that 500k also disagree with locking people in their homes and ruining the prospects of multiple future generations. Being anti-lockdown does not mean being pro-death. Now we know more about the virus the lockdown measures must be re-evaluated.
- dawnerd 6y ago
  Dude there’s been no lockdowns in this country. Stay at home orders haven’t even been enforced, and people like yourself make them useless anyways.
  - throwaway3699 6y ago
    Thanks for generalising. I don't break the restrictions just because I'm arguing against them. Nor am I an American. What I do know is my American friends are suffering for the same reasons my local community are, and it's abhorrent to continue supporting these policies when it's destroying so many lives. I'm sick of hearing stories about children trying to commit suicide, people getting fat and lazy, domestic abuse reports skyrocketing, small businesses going under and taking generational wealth out of the working class. This isn't worth it, and we need a better solution.
    - teclordphrack2 6y ago
      "I don't break the restrictions" liar.
      - throwaway3699 6y ago
        You don't know me. I have no reason to break to break restrictions. But I'm a comfortable tech worker while others aren't so lucky.
    - dawnerd 6y ago
      Ok I’m not going to argue anymore but let me point out some things since it sounds like you’re getting a distorted picture of what’s going on here. Everyone is free to travel anywhere in the country and even outside to places welcoming people. Schools are opening back up pretty quickly. Restaurants are doing in person again despite all common sense. Amusement centers are either already open or on the path to open, most are not even hurting that bad and some are flourishing (look at Disney’s stock price, what pandemic?). The only people really hurting the most are bars. And I really hate to say it but if someone is going to kill themselves over these “lockdowns” they’re already mentally ill and still would be without the pandemic. That’s another discussion around the poor state of mental health globally. The only thing destroying so many lives are families deciding to host massive parties and watching all of their relatives die from covid over a month. I guarantee unless your friends own a bar, they’re not hurting as much as they might lead on to believe.
    - pbourke 6y ago
      > taking generational wealth out of the working class. Do you have a source for that claim? Household savings were up across all American income categories in 2020. The $600 / week federal unemployment benefit that ended in July 2020 was the most significant (accidental) antipoverty program in decades. It lasted long enough that it’s effects will probably be felt for a year or more.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
sjwalter 6y ago
You should write headlines for CNN. How does the fact that 2019 had a much much less deadly flu season fit into your narrative? And 2020 magically did away with the flu, eradicating this awful virus, plus reduced heart attacks massively.

throwawaymanbot 6y ago

Please provide factual data on the survival rate and not just your opinion of 99.7% What we do know is It has killed (currently) nearly 400-500K people in the US alone. It overwhelmed the health services of many places in the world and even here in the US (Even though the last president sought to massage those figures for less bad press) It causes long term problems in lungs and hearts, and goodness knows what else in perhaps up to 25% of the people who may not know how badly they are affected for years. In fact Covid19 has actually reduced the average age an American lives to by an entire year. And we know that wearing a mask was politicized to the point that its still a symbol of division instead of common sense protection that, lets face it, had it been adhered to and not turned in to a conspiracy theory divisive action may have enabled those very stores in California to remain open. Cant have it both ways!

flyingcircus3 6y ago

So to get your cooperation the next time the world needs collective sacrifice, the people defining the emergent worldwide problem on day one must be precisely correct in their predictions for what will happen over the next year?

sjwalter 6y ago
Of course not. But they have actually acted in such a way as to completely obliterate any credibility they had. From lying about masks being useful (Fauci), to the WHO carrying water for China, to the "it's 100% proven zoonosis, couldn't possibly be a lab creation), to the rapid shift away from any commentary about IFR/CFR once it became clear that it was an order of magnitude off. What's strange is I'm not arguing against crazy strict measures during a deadly pandemic. What I'm arguing is that we have learned a lot about this coronavirus, which is just one of thousands/millions of coronaviruses, and even though we learned it was nothing like what we feared, the policy response never changed.
- flyingcircus3 6y ago
  Why do you associate the lack of credibility with investigation into the virus's origin? What lends any credibility to the lab theory? Science isnt a team sport, yet a certain group of people seem very invested in the sinister explanation. It's been repeated over and over that initial recommendations against mask usage was in the hope that people didn't hoard them and prevent healthcare workers from getting them. Predicting the irrational behavior of large populations is a key skill of leadership. Judging by way people hoard toilet paper, hand sanitizer, and other goods, that prediction seems pretty spot on. The disease being less deadly than we feared, and our response to it remaining the same are not contradictory. Even 10x less deaths than originally predicted is still a major crisis. It is still worthy of attempts to mitigate the problem, and the mitigation strategies are still the same.