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What exactly do they have on the lady, except that she is an officer in the PLA? OK, she's wearing uniform and is employed at a military hospital, but members o

What exactly do they have on the lady, except that she is an officer in the PLA? OK, she's wearing uniform and is employed at a military hospital, but members of the US Medical Corps are officers at military hospitals. It's easy to understand why a physician might wish to work in brain disease. What secrets were exfiltrated?

syops 6y ago
From the article: "Members of the Chinese People's Liberation Army cannot lie on their visa applications and come to the United States to study without expecting the FBI and our partners to catch them." said Assistant Director Alan E. Kohler Jr. of the FBI's Counterintelligence Division. "Time and again, the Chinese government prioritizes stealing U.S. research and taking advantage of our universities over obeying international norms." It doesn't matter if she was unsuccessful at exfiltrating secrets. What matters is that, apparently, she's an agent of a foreign government who lied about said affiliation on her application for a visa.
- dogma1138 6y ago
  This is what foreign nationals are prosecuted for when it comes to espionage - failure to declare yourself as a foreign agent. Most espionage laws are only directly applicable to citizens of the state in question.
kevinventullo 6y ago
I’m not sure what else, but this alone would prove she lied on her Visa application and lied to authorities in an interview. From the article: If convicted, she faces a maximum statutory penalty of up to 10 years in prison and a fine of $250,000 for the visa fraud count; up to 20 years in prison and a fine of $250,000 for each of the obstruction and alteration charges; and up to five years in prison and a fine of $250,000 for the false statements charge.
- HarryHirsch 6y ago
  The point is: why bother prosecuting that crap when patently no state secrets are involved? Why not simply revoke the visa, deport the person and ban her from re-entry? Do they want to create uncertainty for people who have served in the PLA or generally discourage Chinese researchers from working in the US? The purpose of the exercise is wholly unclear! What is the Department of State up to?
  - Godel_unicode 6y ago
    They want to discourage people from doing the things with which she is charged; lying on visa applications, obstructing justice, and making false statements. Those all seem like good goals to me?
    - HarryHirsch 6y ago
      It seems like a misdirection of resources to me, like the cops catching speeders on open roads. Instead of investigating and preventing crime they stop someone who is above the speed limit, talk to them really condescendingly and issue a fine. That stuff does wonders for the perception of law enforcement but lines the city's coffers.
  - Isamu 6y ago
    > What is the Department of State up to? Is not enforcing existing law one of their functions?
rsj_hn 6y ago
It doesn't matter whether the questions are important to you, they are important to the Federal agencies that hold in their hand life changing stuff: whether you are allowed to live in the US, whether your grant gets funded, whether you get employment at a US funded research department. These are high stakes disclosures to obtain much sought after benefits. Omit something that would instantly disqualify you from said benefits and expect to have a house fall on you that is the same order of magnitude as the benefits obtained. Now what is the value of a given career, US residency, Stanford employment, or Federal grant? At least hundreds of thousands of dollars - easily in the millions. That is the scale of fraud being committed here, as none of these would have been an option for her if the PLA ties were disclosed. She would not be at Stanford, nor even in the US, nor in her current employment if her status were known. Now you may disagree with the policy of not giving Federal dollars to PLA members or not hiring them in US research departments, but just because you disagree with the policy doesn't make the stakes any lower.

syops 6y ago

From the article: "Members of the Chinese People's Liberation Army cannot lie on their visa applications and come to the United States to study without expecting the FBI and our partners to catch them." said Assistant Director Alan E. Kohler Jr. of the FBI's Counterintelligence Division. "Time and again, the Chinese government prioritizes stealing U.S. research and taking advantage of our universities over obeying international norms." It doesn't matter if she was unsuccessful at exfiltrating secrets. What matters is that, apparently, she's an agent of a foreign government who lied about said affiliation on her application for a visa.

dogma1138 6y ago
This is what foreign nationals are prosecuted for when it comes to espionage - failure to declare yourself as a foreign agent. Most espionage laws are only directly applicable to citizens of the state in question.

kevinventullo 6y ago

I’m not sure what else, but this alone would prove she lied on her Visa application and lied to authorities in an interview. From the article: If convicted, she faces a maximum statutory penalty of up to 10 years in prison and a fine of $250,000 for the visa fraud count; up to 20 years in prison and a fine of $250,000 for each of the obstruction and alteration charges; and up to five years in prison and a fine of $250,000 for the false statements charge.

HarryHirsch 6y ago
The point is: why bother prosecuting that crap when patently no state secrets are involved? Why not simply revoke the visa, deport the person and ban her from re-entry? Do they want to create uncertainty for people who have served in the PLA or generally discourage Chinese researchers from working in the US? The purpose of the exercise is wholly unclear! What is the Department of State up to?
- Godel_unicode 6y ago
  They want to discourage people from doing the things with which she is charged; lying on visa applications, obstructing justice, and making false statements. Those all seem like good goals to me?
  - HarryHirsch 6y ago
    It seems like a misdirection of resources to me, like the cops catching speeders on open roads. Instead of investigating and preventing crime they stop someone who is above the speed limit, talk to them really condescendingly and issue a fine. That stuff does wonders for the perception of law enforcement but lines the city's coffers.
- Isamu 6y ago
  > What is the Department of State up to? Is not enforcing existing law one of their functions?

rsj_hn 6y ago

It doesn't matter whether the questions are important to you, they are important to the Federal agencies that hold in their hand life changing stuff: whether you are allowed to live in the US, whether your grant gets funded, whether you get employment at a US funded research department. These are high stakes disclosures to obtain much sought after benefits. Omit something that would instantly disqualify you from said benefits and expect to have a house fall on you that is the same order of magnitude as the benefits obtained. Now what is the value of a given career, US residency, Stanford employment, or Federal grant? At least hundreds of thousands of dollars - easily in the millions. That is the scale of fraud being committed here, as none of these would have been an option for her if the PLA ties were disclosed. She would not be at Stanford, nor even in the US, nor in her current employment if her status were known. Now you may disagree with the policy of not giving Federal dollars to PLA members or not hiring them in US research departments, but just because you disagree with the policy doesn't make the stakes any lower.