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These 4 points are all pretty critical to Uber's business though. 1. If the drivers set the fair, then customers have no idea what a trip will cost or if uber

These 4 points are all pretty critical to Uber's business though. 1. If the drivers set the fair, then customers have no idea what a trip will cost or if uber shows the drivers fair then why would the customer not always choose the cheapest causing a rush to the the bottom for pricing. 2. This one is open ended and I am not knowledgeable enough to comment on it. 3. If a driver is constantly rejecting rides this is going to affect the algorithm and negatively affect customers. You cant be on the clock and open to rides but consistently reject them when they are assigned. 4. It just makes sense to be able to let poor performers go. From the article "This is a win-win-win for drivers, passengers and cities. It means Uber now has the correct economic incentives not to oversupply the market with too many vehicles and too many drivers", Mr Aslam, president of the App Drivers & Couriers Union What he is saying but maybe does not realize is that this is actually the death of the gig economy at least as it relates to Uber. If there is now a forced reduction in drivers, its a regression to taxi cabs and it reduces the ability of someone to just grab a quick shift here and there and reduces Uber's incentive to allow them too.

hrktb 6y ago
I think the argument is less to stop doing the 4 above, than to accept it's a employer/employee relationship and behave accordingly. If there is actual value in the service, they should be able to adjust to the decision.
- wonderwonder 6y ago
  If its a generic employer/employee relationship then should uber not require 40 hours a week per driver? I am not opposed to that but it does kill the gig concept of the job. It will drastically remove the ability of people to just pick up shifts on the fly. Uber is currently very much a loss generating company, adding additional cost to their business plan will accelerate that. If they go out of business, even if just in specific markets, then that helps no one.
  - pmyteh 6y ago
    Lots of businesses in the UK operate with employees not working 40 hours a week. Some of them have 'zero hours' contracts where work is at the discretion of the employer, at hours of their choosing, and with little notice. If it makes more economic sense for Uber to have a pool of full-time drivers to send to jobs, then that's a model they can move to. If not (because demand is inconsistent, or not evenly spread throughout the day, or whatever) then I have no doubt they'll continue with flexible rostering (perhaps taking more control as to timetabling). And the UK is not in any way short of private hire companies or drivers. Many of them have apps, and Uber is not consistently cheaper than other cab companies. Frankly from a customer point of view it doesn't make a lot of difference whether they go out of business or not in England.
  - DanBC 6y ago
    Uber is cheaper because they're avoiding tax. When Uber claims that they do not employ the drivers they're also saying that the drivers (as independent businesses) are responsible for charging VAT and paying that to HMRC. You only have to register for VAT if your vattable income exceeds £85,000 per year, so most drivers haven't registered for or charged VAT.
snarf21 6y ago
I don't understand your point #1. Uber could still set a baseline price of X as a suggested price for this trip. Each driver gets a chance to offer Y that what they will accept for the trip (maybe it is way outside of downtown so they want a lot more to compensate driving back). All it does it slow down Uber giving you an instant price. It would be trivial to have an instant online auction mechanism in the app. You start it at $5 and it goes up $.17 until a driver says yes. This doesn't really change much of the experience in my mind. It seems like your main criticism is that this might make ride-share more expensive and less convenient for you. Do you think this is actually worse for the drivers?
- JamesSwift 6y ago
  Yes, or Uber could eat the cost over the quoted price. They cant be "just the marketplace" as well as the one that sets the price unless they accept the risk that the actual price charged by the vendor is higher than the quote.
- wonderwonder 6y ago
  I am saying that if Uber does not set the price, what is to stop desperate drivers from setting their prices at 15% lower than the next driver, other drivers would be forced to do the same and then the rate per trip actually goes down, not up.
  - 908B64B197 6y ago
    If drivers are getting desperate, it's because there's an oversupply. What will stop drivers is simply that they won't be able to drive forever if they lose money on rides. That sets a minimal price.
cbozeman 6y ago
In regards to point 1: A safe driver who knows the area well and has an immaculate vehicle should be allowed to set their own rate. You talk about "customers having no idea what a trip will cost" like that isn't a supremely easily fixed problem. You simply filter out by cost per mile, no different than filtering results on eBay or another website. You tell the Uber app you're only willing to pay $0.80 per mile, or whatever that number is. Maybe you end up in 2012 Honda Civic on your ride back... or you crank it up to $2.00 per mile and you end up in an Audi A6. Power to the people?

hrktb 6y ago

I think the argument is less to stop doing the 4 above, than to accept it's a employer/employee relationship and behave accordingly. If there is actual value in the service, they should be able to adjust to the decision.

wonderwonder 6y ago
If its a generic employer/employee relationship then should uber not require 40 hours a week per driver? I am not opposed to that but it does kill the gig concept of the job. It will drastically remove the ability of people to just pick up shifts on the fly. Uber is currently very much a loss generating company, adding additional cost to their business plan will accelerate that. If they go out of business, even if just in specific markets, then that helps no one.
- pmyteh 6y ago
  Lots of businesses in the UK operate with employees not working 40 hours a week. Some of them have 'zero hours' contracts where work is at the discretion of the employer, at hours of their choosing, and with little notice. If it makes more economic sense for Uber to have a pool of full-time drivers to send to jobs, then that's a model they can move to. If not (because demand is inconsistent, or not evenly spread throughout the day, or whatever) then I have no doubt they'll continue with flexible rostering (perhaps taking more control as to timetabling). And the UK is not in any way short of private hire companies or drivers. Many of them have apps, and Uber is not consistently cheaper than other cab companies. Frankly from a customer point of view it doesn't make a lot of difference whether they go out of business or not in England.
- DanBC 6y ago
  Uber is cheaper because they're avoiding tax. When Uber claims that they do not employ the drivers they're also saying that the drivers (as independent businesses) are responsible for charging VAT and paying that to HMRC. You only have to register for VAT if your vattable income exceeds £85,000 per year, so most drivers haven't registered for or charged VAT.

snarf21 6y ago

I don't understand your point #1. Uber could still set a baseline price of X as a suggested price for this trip. Each driver gets a chance to offer Y that what they will accept for the trip (maybe it is way outside of downtown so they want a lot more to compensate driving back). All it does it slow down Uber giving you an instant price. It would be trivial to have an instant online auction mechanism in the app. You start it at $5 and it goes up $.17 until a driver says yes. This doesn't really change much of the experience in my mind. It seems like your main criticism is that this might make ride-share more expensive and less convenient for you. Do you think this is actually worse for the drivers?

JamesSwift 6y ago
Yes, or Uber could eat the cost over the quoted price. They cant be "just the marketplace" as well as the one that sets the price unless they accept the risk that the actual price charged by the vendor is higher than the quote.
wonderwonder 6y ago
I am saying that if Uber does not set the price, what is to stop desperate drivers from setting their prices at 15% lower than the next driver, other drivers would be forced to do the same and then the rate per trip actually goes down, not up.
- 908B64B197 6y ago
  If drivers are getting desperate, it's because there's an oversupply. What will stop drivers is simply that they won't be able to drive forever if they lose money on rides. That sets a minimal price.

cbozeman 6y ago

In regards to point 1: A safe driver who knows the area well and has an immaculate vehicle should be allowed to set their own rate. You talk about "customers having no idea what a trip will cost" like that isn't a supremely easily fixed problem. You simply filter out by cost per mile, no different than filtering results on eBay or another website. You tell the Uber app you're only willing to pay $0.80 per mile, or whatever that number is. Maybe you end up in 2012 Honda Civic on your ride back... or you crank it up to $2.00 per mile and you end up in an Audi A6. Power to the people?