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How is one of the most renewable energy places on earth a "bastion of the oil/petrochemical industry"? The answer to the question "where else in the US?" is ba

How is one of the most renewable energy places on earth a "bastion of the oil/petrochemical industry"? The answer to the question "where else in the US?" is basically "everywhere else in the US".

TylerE 6y ago
Uh, how is it not? Texas produces 41% of US oil, more than 4x any other state. They also dominate refinery capacity.
- fastball 6y ago
  Sounds like Texas is a bastion of energy.
  - megaman821 6y ago
    Maybe even the energy capital of the world.
  - Qwertious 6y ago
    Yes, but if you think they'd put a price on carbon anytime soon then I have a bridge to sell you. They're a bastion of climate denial, and bringing up their wind power is irrelevant whataboutism.
    - cryptoquick 6y ago
      Except, wind lost generation capacity in the cold, just as all other forms of energy generation did. Is it possible that warming temperatures in the oceans weren't considered to be an issue when we first started seeing arctic air being blown further south by the jetstream due to a changing climate from anthropogenic carbon sources? Possibly. There are certainly mitigation mechanisms they could have invested in. If the public heard their taxpayer dollars or utility fees were being wasted on winterizing efforts in notoroiously hot Texas, even if there were responsible decision-makers, their hands were tied at risk of being shamed for wasteful spending in the court of public opinion. It is still a shame that they're left out in the cold, so to speak. Hopefully they can come up with more sensible remedies, if not out of a change of ideology, perhaps a sense of practicality?
      - briffle 6y ago
        >Except, wind lost generation capacity in the cold, just as all other forms of energy generation did. They don't in Iowa, or North Dakota. Or anywhere north, where they spend a few extra dollars to make sure they can handle the cold
        fastball 6y ago
        Right... because getting cold is normal in those places.
        deleted 6y ago
        [deleted]
      - tsimionescu 6y ago
        > If the public heard their taxpayer dollars or utility fees were being wasted on winterizing efforts in notoroiously hot Texas This is a direct consequence of the climate change denial coming, to a great extent, directly out of those same lawmakers. If the public had instead been informed about the likely extreme weather events that will be brought about by climate change with the same zeal that they are being lied to today, this type of spending could have easily been presented as necessary. Instead of taking this crisis as a time or reckoning, we're of course seeing everyone doubling down on this, insisting that it's proof global warming isn't happening and all the expected bs.
        barry-cotter 6y ago
        No one gets votes for disaster preparedness. > Myopic Voters and Natural Disaster Policy > Do voters effectively hold elected officials accountable for policy decisions? Using data on natural disasters, government spending, and election returns, we show that voters reward the incumbent presidential party for delivering disaster relief spending, but not for investing in disaster preparedness spending. These inconsistencies distort the incentives of public officials, leading the government to underinvest in disaster preparedness, thereby causing substantial public welfare losses. We estimate that $1 spent on preparedness is worth about $15 in terms of the future damage it mitigates. By estimating both the determinants of policy decisions and the consequences of those policies, we provide more complete evidence about citizen competence and government accountability. https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/american-political-science-review/article/abs/myopic-voters-and-natural-disaster-policy/039708A3223EC114365ADF56F1D26423 https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/american-political-s...
  - rualca 6y ago
    > Sounds like Texas is a bastion of energy. Sounds to me they are the bastion of the energy industry. Which are historically the main opponents of any concern regarding climate change.
    - fastball 6y ago
      Only because all the original climate change activists were stridently anti-growth / borderline misanthropes. And obviously the energy industry is firmly in the "growth" camp.
    - undefined1 6y ago
      an opponent wouldn't be the top wind producer in the country and second in solar.
BurningFrog 6y ago
The fact that Texas has huge exploitable oil reserves is an accident of geology, not a political stance.
- TylerE 6y ago
  But has resulted in many oil companies being based there, which means lots of money flowing to politicians, which DOES make it a political stance. 'member Halliburton? ExxonMobil? Virtually every large US-based oil company is headquartered in Houston.
  - walrus01 6y ago
    And certainly not just domestically either, if you look at where much of the technical expertise came from that set up the modern organization of Saudi Aramco. Houston, mostly.
- brudgers 6y ago
  If you drive I20 west through Dallas and on toward Midland and Odessa, you will come to the Permian Basin. From there to I20’s merge with I10, the air will smell like a can of motor oil much of the time and at night the land will extend to the horizon with mercury vapor lights of pump jacks every few hundred yards. Of course it’s West Texas and not many people go out that way - it’s the road from Atlanta to El Paso - making it out of sight; out of mind. And if you take I10 west out of New Orleans, after the refineries of Louisiana, you will see refineries from the border to Houston and Port Arthur. Open your mouth and you might just taste the air. The post colonial history of Texas is people arriving to extract its resources. The oil may just be chance. The roughnecks and their oil pumps are deliberate.
xirbeosbwo1234 6y ago
The fact that they have wind farms is entirely irrelevant to the fact that their economy is dependent on oil and their politicians are major proponents of denialism. Stop playing dumb.

How is one of the most renewable energy places on earth a "bastion of the oil/petrochemical industry"? The answer to the question "where else in the US?" is basically "everywhere else in the US".

TylerE 6y ago

Uh, how is it not? Texas produces 41% of US oil, more than 4x any other state. They also dominate refinery capacity.

fastball 6y ago
Sounds like Texas is a bastion of energy.
- megaman821 6y ago
  Maybe even the energy capital of the world.
- Qwertious 6y ago
  Yes, but if you think they'd put a price on carbon anytime soon then I have a bridge to sell you. They're a bastion of climate denial, and bringing up their wind power is irrelevant whataboutism.
  - cryptoquick 6y ago
    Except, wind lost generation capacity in the cold, just as all other forms of energy generation did. Is it possible that warming temperatures in the oceans weren't considered to be an issue when we first started seeing arctic air being blown further south by the jetstream due to a changing climate from anthropogenic carbon sources? Possibly. There are certainly mitigation mechanisms they could have invested in. If the public heard their taxpayer dollars or utility fees were being wasted on winterizing efforts in notoroiously hot Texas, even if there were responsible decision-makers, their hands were tied at risk of being shamed for wasteful spending in the court of public opinion. It is still a shame that they're left out in the cold, so to speak. Hopefully they can come up with more sensible remedies, if not out of a change of ideology, perhaps a sense of practicality?
    - briffle 6y ago
      >Except, wind lost generation capacity in the cold, just as all other forms of energy generation did. They don't in Iowa, or North Dakota. Or anywhere north, where they spend a few extra dollars to make sure they can handle the cold
      - fastball 6y ago
        Right... because getting cold is normal in those places.
      - deleted 6y ago
        [deleted]
    - tsimionescu 6y ago
      > If the public heard their taxpayer dollars or utility fees were being wasted on winterizing efforts in notoroiously hot Texas This is a direct consequence of the climate change denial coming, to a great extent, directly out of those same lawmakers. If the public had instead been informed about the likely extreme weather events that will be brought about by climate change with the same zeal that they are being lied to today, this type of spending could have easily been presented as necessary. Instead of taking this crisis as a time or reckoning, we're of course seeing everyone doubling down on this, insisting that it's proof global warming isn't happening and all the expected bs.
      - barry-cotter 6y ago
        No one gets votes for disaster preparedness. > Myopic Voters and Natural Disaster Policy > Do voters effectively hold elected officials accountable for policy decisions? Using data on natural disasters, government spending, and election returns, we show that voters reward the incumbent presidential party for delivering disaster relief spending, but not for investing in disaster preparedness spending. These inconsistencies distort the incentives of public officials, leading the government to underinvest in disaster preparedness, thereby causing substantial public welfare losses. We estimate that $1 spent on preparedness is worth about $15 in terms of the future damage it mitigates. By estimating both the determinants of policy decisions and the consequences of those policies, we provide more complete evidence about citizen competence and government accountability. https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/american-political-science-review/article/abs/myopic-voters-and-natural-disaster-policy/039708A3223EC114365ADF56F1D26423 https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/american-political-s...
- rualca 6y ago
  > Sounds like Texas is a bastion of energy. Sounds to me they are the bastion of the energy industry. Which are historically the main opponents of any concern regarding climate change.
  - fastball 6y ago
    Only because all the original climate change activists were stridently anti-growth / borderline misanthropes. And obviously the energy industry is firmly in the "growth" camp.
  - undefined1 6y ago
    an opponent wouldn't be the top wind producer in the country and second in solar.

BurningFrog 6y ago

The fact that Texas has huge exploitable oil reserves is an accident of geology, not a political stance.

TylerE 6y ago
But has resulted in many oil companies being based there, which means lots of money flowing to politicians, which DOES make it a political stance. 'member Halliburton? ExxonMobil? Virtually every large US-based oil company is headquartered in Houston.
- walrus01 6y ago
  And certainly not just domestically either, if you look at where much of the technical expertise came from that set up the modern organization of Saudi Aramco. Houston, mostly.
brudgers 6y ago
If you drive I20 west through Dallas and on toward Midland and Odessa, you will come to the Permian Basin. From there to I20’s merge with I10, the air will smell like a can of motor oil much of the time and at night the land will extend to the horizon with mercury vapor lights of pump jacks every few hundred yards. Of course it’s West Texas and not many people go out that way - it’s the road from Atlanta to El Paso - making it out of sight; out of mind. And if you take I10 west out of New Orleans, after the refineries of Louisiana, you will see refineries from the border to Houston and Port Arthur. Open your mouth and you might just taste the air. The post colonial history of Texas is people arriving to extract its resources. The oil may just be chance. The roughnecks and their oil pumps are deliberate.

xirbeosbwo1234 6y ago

The fact that they have wind farms is entirely irrelevant to the fact that their economy is dependent on oil and their politicians are major proponents of denialism. Stop playing dumb.