14 ms·

Airbnb will build a new tech hub in Atlanta

140 points by 7d7n 6y ago

Shivetya 6y ago
First Microsoft and not Airbnb. As if our traffic didn't qualify us as the LA of the East. Seriously though, metropolitan Atlanta is a great area to live with three major interstates going through the city and a very well developer surrounding area. With many businesses adopting more lenient WFH policies the drive is not always a concern. Schools are generally a good mix of public and private as with any area. https://blogs.microsoft.com/blog/2021/02/11/investing-to-grow-in-and-with-atlanta/ https://blogs.microsoft.com/blog/2021/02/11/investing-to-gro...
- dpflan 6y ago
  Agree on your points, tech WFH/remote policies should benefit a city (especially more car-centric like Atlanta). If they can prioritize proximity to public transit, mainly rail or core bus route, that really helps, but if not, could also be a reason to make investment in transit to that area. P.S.: typo? "...and not Airbnb" --> "...and now Airbnb" :)
- robbyking 6y ago
  > As if our traffic didn't qualify us as the LA of the East. I lived in Athens, GA for almost a decade, and when my wife and decided to move to a bigger city, this was a major factor in us deciding not to move to Atlanta. We're really big on biking and public transportation, and at the time it didn't feel like Atlanta was an option because of this. That said, I miss Georgia a lot. I don't think people who live in other states realize how cool Athens and Atlanta are.
  - sudosteph 6y ago
    I'm in Asheville, so not that far away, but I've still never visited Athens. I've heard great things about the music scene though! When I lived in Seattle, I met a lot of people with very distorted views of Southern cities in general. A lot of people who have never spent much time (or any time) in the south get their whole concept of us from crazy politicians, awful hollywood movies, and jim crow. That said - I've met tons of southerners that stereotype all Californians unfairly negatively as well (they think it's all berkely antifa and LA gangs). This is one big reason I really wish we had a national program like the one Yang proposed, where high schoolers could spend time in different communities across the country. Travel is expensive, but there's really no substitute for it when it comes to dispelling regional prejudices.
    - robbyking 6y ago
      I agree 100%! One of the reasons I moved to Athens was I wanted to live in a creative community in a part of the country I had never lived before. Now that I'm a parent I can't until we can travel again so my 4yo can experience some other cultures, here and abroad. There's too much tribalism, and when it comes down to it most of us want the same things[1] What's funny is when we moved, we actually considered Asheville, too, but decided to go a little bigger. When we lived in Athens it was rare we'd visit Asheville and not run in to someone we knew, or saw that a friend's band from Athens was playing. There is (or was, at least) a lot of reciprocity between the two music scenes. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZX5MHNvjw7o#t=6m36s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZX5MHNvjw7o#t=6m36s
  - mym1990 6y ago
    I have recently moved back to Atlanta from SF and missed the biking aspect of SF dearly. Atlanta is getting much better though, the belt line is connecting many neighborhoods and there is lots of development happening for further bike and walking paths. One day I hope to ride down Peachtree without fearing for my life...one day.
- avolcano 6y ago
  The traffic is really fucking bad, to be honest - I've been considering moving back to metro Atlanta post-pandemic (grew up in Gwinnett County, currently up in NYC, still go back to visit 2x a year) and it's the biggest concern I have with taking a local job. It's definitely as bad as LA or Houston (and the pure sprawl seems to match the latter). I'd probably try to rely on MARTA and that's tricky to do even if you want to. My sister now lives in Decatur and I've been looking at some of the apartments near the MARTA stations there, and they're unfortunately mostly exclusively new luxury buildings (which I am very lucky to be able to afford on my current salary, but maybe not at a local job, or an adjusted-for-relocation remote one). Frustrating how there's so little walkable development around the MARTA stations other than Decatur's, and what there is is so expensive. Of course, I could deal with a five minute park and ride, but it's kinda the principle of the thing.
  - dashundchen 6y ago
    The sprawl of most of the Sunbelt cities (Atlanta, Houston, Phoenix) seems absolutely unlivable to me. A tiny historic core just engulfed by tens of miles of car dependent tract housing and strip malls, all strung together by 8 lane highways is a nightmare to me. You must have to live in your car to get anywhere interesting. Obviously that doesn't stop people from moving there but I am always shocked more walk-able dense development hasn't taken root.
    - lotsofpulp 6y ago
      > I am always shocked more dense development hasn't taken root. Because it inevitably butts up against people’s desire to not live near lower socioeconomic classes who may not be able to afford a car centric life. See the prevalence of school rankings (proxy for parental wealth) in real estate websites. Older cities or older areas within cities with dense construction were grandfathered in, but I doubt we’ll see another new city like that in the US. The primary way we separate us from them is with unwalkable distances.
    - Apocryphon 6y ago
      You've just described Silicon Valley outside of San Francisco proper.
softwaredoug 6y ago
I have wondered if with a flight from Silicon Valley/NYC during the pandemic, if there would be an explicit focus on convincing people from blue(democrat)-areas to move to political flippable/purple(competitive) states like Arizona, Georgia, Texas. So when I see "move to Atlanta" it makes me wonder if companies, with their progressive employees, might even make this an explicit strategy. If anything for long term political stability in the US, which helps business...
- jeffbee 6y ago
  "flight" from the SF Bay Area radically overstated: https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/People-are-leaving-S-F-but-not-for-Austin-or-15955527.php https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/People-are-leavi...
  - rconti 6y ago
    Yeah, home transaction values across CA during the pandemic are accelerating faster than the nation as a whole.
- kingnothing 6y ago
  Large companies want to have offices in large cities. Most large cities, Atlanta included, are blue.
  - lucasmullens 6y ago
    Right, but getting 1000+ more techies who mostly lean left into Georgia might change the result of a statewide election.
alexashka 6y ago
I don't pretend to be an expert, but what 'tech' is there to AirBNB exactly? A SQL database setup and UI CRUD layers for every popular platform? Why does this company even need a hub? It could use some extra lobbying power I'm sure, given that it's entire business model is dependent upon them remaining a de-facto monopoly.
- dclusin 6y ago
  Don’t forget a batch job framework such as airflow.
- foobiekr 6y ago
  Literally every post about one of these companies has a comment like this. The issue for companies like AirBNB is not that their application is necessarily bafflingly complex (though it is absolutely true that, especially during the nosql era, amazingly baroque and bizarre architectures had a heyday) but that operating reliably at scale is hard, requires good decisionmaking on multiple dimensions, and requires attention to things that "just CRUD app" doesn't capture because none of them actually matter at low scale.
  - deeeeplearning 6y ago
    The same could be said about flowers.com, macys.com, or literally any company doing business on the internet. Scale is basically a solved problem so pretending that AirBnb is a "Tech Company" or that they have any interesting tech is incredibly naive.
    - foobiekr 6y ago
      Scale is not a solved problem at all. And yes, the came could be said for other, less sexy companies.
    - filoleg 6y ago
      Once macys.com gets a page with all the tech they open-sourced that is actually used at a ton of places outside of the company, similar to that of Airbnb[0], then we can talk. Out of the ones I personally worked with, Enzyme[1] is pretty much the de-facto industry standard for writing React unit tests. Airflow[2] is used very commonly (our team at a big known non-tech company I used to work at used it about 5 years ago), and so is Lottie[3]. And these are just the ones off the top of my head, given that I actually got to use those. They have many many more that seem to have a pretty high usage. And their tech blog is very insightful, I learned quite a bit from it myself when it comes to my development skills. And no, I neither was nor currently am employed by Airbnb, not a big user of theirs, not paid to say any of this, and I have no particular liking towards them at all. 0. https://airbnb.io/projects/ https://airbnb.io/projects/ 1. https://airbnb.io/projects/enzyme/ https://airbnb.io/projects/enzyme/ 2. https://airbnb.io/projects/airflow/ https://airbnb.io/projects/airflow/ 3. https://airbnb.io/projects/lottie-android/ https://airbnb.io/projects/lottie-android/
bitcharmer 6y ago
Airbnb and tech hub in one sentence. Could someone explain to me what one has to do with the other?
- jppope 6y ago
  +1
- pb7 6y ago
  >The new Atlanta hub will eventually house much of the company's growing technical and programming work, including a product development team. RTFA.
  - randomsearch 6y ago
    I would guess the implication might be that Airbnb isn’t a tech company but an accommodation company? Is that fair? I don’t know. Feels like there’s a spectrum. Can’t see anything Airbnb have done that’s technically innovative, but rather their main innovation is a very novel (and much criticised) business model.
    - pb7 6y ago
      It literally doesn't matter what they are. They have engineers and they're building an office geared for them. They could bake bread as their business but if they build an office for the 3 software guys that build their marketing website and integrate a 3rd party inventory system while the 1,000 bakers work elsewhere, it would be their tech hub. Don't let your hate for Airbnb pick apart every single headline.
- dang 6y ago
  "Please don't post shallow dismissals, especially of other people's work. A good critical comment teaches us something." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
jppope 6y ago
Yikes. So a few years back... my buddy said he was moving to Georgia, and my reply was: "which one? One is a war-torn country in the middle east and another is a place I would never go to..."
- rcpt 6y ago
  Well ok. Georgia does has some nice things like the start of the start of the Appalachian Trail, hostel in the forest, and beautiful coastline.
- pylua 6y ago
  Good for you. A lot of people enjoy living in Atlanta . If you don’t like it then don’t visit. No need to speak like this .
- draw_down 6y ago
  Thanks for posting
- dang 6y ago
  Please don't take HN threads into regional flamewar. We're trying to stay out of hell here. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
pratik661 6y ago
I grew up in metro Atlanta and studied at Georgia Tech. The state government subsidizes college education for grads with a certain GPA (HOPE Scholarship). However, I (and most CS grads I knew) left Atlanta for better paying jobs in NYC/Bay Area/Seattle/Austin. I always wondered why the ATL tech scene was 'underdeveloped' compared to comparable sized cities like Seattle and Austin, despite having major research institutions (Georgia Tech and Emory) to anchor it. This is what I mean by 'underdeveloped': - Most software dev job postings (as of May 2018) have SPECIFIC tech stack requirements. This to me is a red flag. Most recruiters in 'developed' tech cities assume that software development skills are transferable and that technology stacks/frameworks/languages can be learned. - The salaries offered were still very low compared to comparable COL locations like Austin - No major FAANG presence to put upward pressure on local developer wages
- rjbwork 6y ago
  Just out of curiosity, as an Atlanta based dev, what kinds of salaries are common in Austin at various levels?
  - pratik661 6y ago
    I hope I don't open a major can of worms by my parent comment. This is based on a sample of my own personal experience of 1 Austin interview and LOTs of Atlanta interviews. As a SDE with 4 YOE, I was offered $110k ish in Austin vs barely scraping 90-100k in Atlanta. I ended up taking an offer in NYC (which was my top choice to begin with).
    - dimmke 6y ago
      I live in Atlanta. I get a lot of recruiters pitching me senior SWE jobs from mediocre companies with salary ranges between 115k-130k. I think 130-150 is average for senior roles. That's definitely lower than other markets, but Atlanta is a much cheaper place to live than most other big cities. Housing is definitely catching up though. The only thing I will say about Atlanta, it gets HUMID for large swathes of the year. The climate is really unpleasant if you're prone to sweating and enjoy being outdoors.
franze 6y ago
Q: But many Airbnb Engineers do you need to fix Airbnbs horrible website? A: Lets make a techhub in Atlanta to evaluate this question.
cletus 6y ago
I think a couple of good things may come out of the pandemic: 1. Big companies being more amenable to remote work. I don't see a total shift to remote to be likely or even desirable but a partial shift is good; and 2. An end to the ultimately unsustainable ultra-concentration of tech jobs in places like SF and NYC. I see the likely winners here are Atlanta, Denver/Boulder, Dallas/Forth Worth, Austin and Tampa. This may well trickle-down to mid-sized regional centers too. Think Boise, Salt Lake City, Louisville, Nashville, Memphis, etc. I support this decentralization.
sudosteph 6y ago
I'm happy for Atlanta - it's about time they got some recognition for the growth that's happening there. However, as someone who started her tech career working at satellite offices for west coast tech companies (in RTP, NC) before moving to Seattle - there's just no comparison to the career opportunity that comes from working at a HQ (or even just in the same timezone as the HQ!). I'm back in NC, which isn't so bad now that I've "leveled up" my resume with FAANG experience and have plenty of remote work skills - but I still recommend that ambitious engineers from the south spend at least a few years in a west coast tech hub. It's possible that NYC works too now, but I'm not sure. Regardless, this is a smart move for airbnb. I have no doubt they'll get great talented engineers, lower costs, and be able to brag about their diversity numbers compared to other west coast companies as a result. But until there is real startup investment in the south, I'm not optimistic that we'll see anything special come from this trend. That said, if I'm wrong and this means more tech investment in Atlanta for startups too - I'd be incredibly happy.
kirktrue 6y ago
The article subheading states: Airbnb needed an East Coast home. Why particularly an east coast home vs. just another home? What's the strategic benefit of the east coast in particular?
- cheriot 6y ago
  Most of the US population is on the coasts and their headquarters is on the other one.
- sdljfjafsd 6y ago
  Time zones are important if your teams rely on synchronous communication (slack, zoom, etc.). My org has gone "remote" but we still rely heavily on synchronous communication so we still prefer to hire people in the same time zone. Time zones are also important if you are doing customer or client support.
- UncleMeat 6y ago
  A considerable portion of the US lives in the southeast. Georgia Tech is a strong CS program that is outputting a ton of qualified graduates. Not everybody living in the southeast wants to move to SF. The Southeast also has much better representation in traditionally underrepresented groups in CS, enabling tech companies to mitigate some of the "pipeline problem" that makes it basically impossible to achieve diversity goals. There are also few major tech companies with hubs in Atlanta, meaning that the first ones to really develop there can scoop up talent more easily.
conjecTech 6y ago
Woo boy, I see a lot of people throwing shade at Atlanta here. That's not exactly a new phenomenon. As a native ATLien, let me quote one of our prophets: The south got something to say.
- daveevad 6y ago
  I too am tired of those close-minded folks.
forrestthewoods 6y ago
Hell yeah. Everyone says they care about diversity. But you aren’t going to build a diverse workforce if all your offices are in SF, NYC, London, and Seattle. I’ve wanted to see big tech expand into the South for years. (Austin doesn’t count.) Atlanta and Nashville please.
- oh_sigh 6y ago
  If diversity just a euphemism for "non-white", then NYC is as diverse as Atlanta - both with about 40% white population and 60% non-white. NYC is far more diverse than America as a whole - 30% fewer whites, 2x more blacks, and 80% more Latinos, 3x more Asians, and 10x more Jews than one would expect from America's overall demographics. In fact, by most measures NYC is more diverse than Atlanta. Atlanta is for the most part whites+blacks, whereas NY has an actual latino and asian population.
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
jerzyt 6y ago
I did a project in Atlanta which required my presence on-site, so every week a flight to and back. I've spent enough time working there that I had to pay Georgia state tax. Anyway, I consider Atlanta to have one of the worst airports in US. Pathologically long lines through security, even with the rapid pass. Maybe it won't be a problem in the Covid era, with zoom calls everywhere, but in the pre-Covid era Atlanta was a PITA for travel.
- prepend 6y ago
  Hartsfield sucks but when compared to other busy airports it’s pretty good. And they have many chick-fil-as.
  - wslack 6y ago
    It's also much bigger than most other airports, double the number of gates as SFO.
    - prepend 6y ago
      Good point, I used to hate it until I experienced other airports. JFK you have to walk and bus between terminals. DeGaulle you have to bus to planes. LAX you have to walk between terminals. ATL’s plane train means you’re always 10 minutes away from any terminal. And at least Marta runs into the airport. Atlanta public transport sucks but at least it’s to the airport. It’s weird how many cities don’t have trains going to the airport. I’m not sure there’s any airport close to busy that works this well. I prefer smaller airports where you can just walk in (OAK, FLL) but they don’t have as many flights to places.
  - filoleg 6y ago
    I found the entire Hartsfield experience, ironically, to mirror that of Chick-fil-a. You see a very long line, get a sense of dread of having to wait in it, and in 5-10 mins that whole line disappears. I remember one time arriving to Hartsfield just an hour before my flight was supposed to take off, saw that the TSA line spilled out into the entrance area of the airport (due to half the security checkpoints being closed for whatever reason), and, at this point, I've made my peace with missing the flight. Just 10 mins later, I got to the front of the TSA line. The way they managed to unwrangle such a huge line was impressive, and it instantly reminded me of Chick-fil-a at the Georgia Tech student center building. Every time I got to it, I would see a line of 20-30 students, but it never took me more than 10 mins to get my food (from the moment I joined the line, to the moment I walked out).
dreamcompiler 6y ago
OK I'll bite. Airbnb is a website. A hard-to-navigate, overproduced one, but it's still basically just a website coupled to a database. And it's not even as complex as Uber's because it doesn't need realtime GPS tracking of anything. Why does Airbnb need a "tech hub?"
- Naac 6y ago
  Sounds like a good systems design interview question. Design an Airbnb like website operating globally. I think going through this exercise will show it's more than "just a website"
  - dreamcompiler 6y ago
    Most major companies have to build a high reliability, highly-scalable website operating globally. Lots of people know how to build these things [except of course for contractors that the US federal government hires], and most of them don't have "tech hubs" in any major city unless they're ... you know ... actual tech companies. Why do we consider a glorified hotel company like Airbnb a tech company? Just because YC invested in them?
    - ttesttom 6y ago
      How is a company that is an entirely online marketplace with no physical property not a 'tech company'?
- Guest42 6y ago
  Agreed, meanwhile large banks do things that are technically incredible but get seen as boring.
  - stevenhuang 6y ago
    Such as?
    - deleted 6y ago
yandrypozo 6y ago
I thought that tech companies were moving towards remote work.
ffggvv 6y ago
short airbnb. this is clearly their priority
vadlamak 6y ago
Atlanta is a mixed bag. I am a person of color, an immigrant and spent about a decade working in the coasts (NYC and Bay Area) before relocating to Atlanta about 6 years ago. The Pros > relatively newer, affordable housing > decent weather > good public schools > there is room for my young kids to grow in the suburbs > It is green (love the tree cover), though the locals don't seem to care and keep chopping down the trees with no remorse. > not prone to earth quakes, forest fires and gets plenty of rainfall. > Plenty of trails, lakes. You can get to a beach in 5 hours (Hilton Head, Destin etc) The Cons > Salaries are lower and yes roles are stack specific > Opportunities are limited. > Mindset > Traffic If I had the means to buy a home at any of the tech centers, I would have not moved. It is always a good idea to stay close to the mother ship(HQ). The network effect of companies attracting engineers and other way around will always work.

140 points by 7d7n 6y ago

First Microsoft and not Airbnb. As if our traffic didn't qualify us as the LA of the East. Seriously though, metropolitan Atlanta is a great area to live with three major interstates going through the city and a very well developer surrounding area. With many businesses adopting more lenient WFH policies the drive is not always a concern. Schools are generally a good mix of public and private as with any area. https://blogs.microsoft.com/blog/2021/02/11/investing-to-grow-in-and-with-atlanta/ https://blogs.microsoft.com/blog/2021/02/11/investing-to-gro...

dpflan 6y ago
Agree on your points, tech WFH/remote policies should benefit a city (especially more car-centric like Atlanta). If they can prioritize proximity to public transit, mainly rail or core bus route, that really helps, but if not, could also be a reason to make investment in transit to that area. P.S.: typo? "...and not Airbnb" --> "...and now Airbnb" :)
robbyking 6y ago
> As if our traffic didn't qualify us as the LA of the East. I lived in Athens, GA for almost a decade, and when my wife and decided to move to a bigger city, this was a major factor in us deciding not to move to Atlanta. We're really big on biking and public transportation, and at the time it didn't feel like Atlanta was an option because of this. That said, I miss Georgia a lot. I don't think people who live in other states realize how cool Athens and Atlanta are.
- sudosteph 6y ago
  I'm in Asheville, so not that far away, but I've still never visited Athens. I've heard great things about the music scene though! When I lived in Seattle, I met a lot of people with very distorted views of Southern cities in general. A lot of people who have never spent much time (or any time) in the south get their whole concept of us from crazy politicians, awful hollywood movies, and jim crow. That said - I've met tons of southerners that stereotype all Californians unfairly negatively as well (they think it's all berkely antifa and LA gangs). This is one big reason I really wish we had a national program like the one Yang proposed, where high schoolers could spend time in different communities across the country. Travel is expensive, but there's really no substitute for it when it comes to dispelling regional prejudices.
  - robbyking 6y ago
    I agree 100%! One of the reasons I moved to Athens was I wanted to live in a creative community in a part of the country I had never lived before. Now that I'm a parent I can't until we can travel again so my 4yo can experience some other cultures, here and abroad. There's too much tribalism, and when it comes down to it most of us want the same things[1] What's funny is when we moved, we actually considered Asheville, too, but decided to go a little bigger. When we lived in Athens it was rare we'd visit Asheville and not run in to someone we knew, or saw that a friend's band from Athens was playing. There is (or was, at least) a lot of reciprocity between the two music scenes. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZX5MHNvjw7o#t=6m36s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZX5MHNvjw7o#t=6m36s
- mym1990 6y ago
  I have recently moved back to Atlanta from SF and missed the biking aspect of SF dearly. Atlanta is getting much better though, the belt line is connecting many neighborhoods and there is lots of development happening for further bike and walking paths. One day I hope to ride down Peachtree without fearing for my life...one day.
avolcano 6y ago
The traffic is really fucking bad, to be honest - I've been considering moving back to metro Atlanta post-pandemic (grew up in Gwinnett County, currently up in NYC, still go back to visit 2x a year) and it's the biggest concern I have with taking a local job. It's definitely as bad as LA or Houston (and the pure sprawl seems to match the latter). I'd probably try to rely on MARTA and that's tricky to do even if you want to. My sister now lives in Decatur and I've been looking at some of the apartments near the MARTA stations there, and they're unfortunately mostly exclusively new luxury buildings (which I am very lucky to be able to afford on my current salary, but maybe not at a local job, or an adjusted-for-relocation remote one). Frustrating how there's so little walkable development around the MARTA stations other than Decatur's, and what there is is so expensive. Of course, I could deal with a five minute park and ride, but it's kinda the principle of the thing.
- dashundchen 6y ago
  The sprawl of most of the Sunbelt cities (Atlanta, Houston, Phoenix) seems absolutely unlivable to me. A tiny historic core just engulfed by tens of miles of car dependent tract housing and strip malls, all strung together by 8 lane highways is a nightmare to me. You must have to live in your car to get anywhere interesting. Obviously that doesn't stop people from moving there but I am always shocked more walk-able dense development hasn't taken root.
  - lotsofpulp 6y ago
    > I am always shocked more dense development hasn't taken root. Because it inevitably butts up against people’s desire to not live near lower socioeconomic classes who may not be able to afford a car centric life. See the prevalence of school rankings (proxy for parental wealth) in real estate websites. Older cities or older areas within cities with dense construction were grandfathered in, but I doubt we’ll see another new city like that in the US. The primary way we separate us from them is with unwalkable distances.
  - Apocryphon 6y ago
    You've just described Silicon Valley outside of San Francisco proper.

softwaredoug 6y ago

I have wondered if with a flight from Silicon Valley/NYC during the pandemic, if there would be an explicit focus on convincing people from blue(democrat)-areas to move to political flippable/purple(competitive) states like Arizona, Georgia, Texas. So when I see "move to Atlanta" it makes me wonder if companies, with their progressive employees, might even make this an explicit strategy. If anything for long term political stability in the US, which helps business...

jeffbee 6y ago
"flight" from the SF Bay Area radically overstated: https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/People-are-leaving-S-F-but-not-for-Austin-or-15955527.php https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/People-are-leavi...
- rconti 6y ago
  Yeah, home transaction values across CA during the pandemic are accelerating faster than the nation as a whole.
kingnothing 6y ago
Large companies want to have offices in large cities. Most large cities, Atlanta included, are blue.
- lucasmullens 6y ago
  Right, but getting 1000+ more techies who mostly lean left into Georgia might change the result of a statewide election.

alexashka 6y ago

I don't pretend to be an expert, but what 'tech' is there to AirBNB exactly? A SQL database setup and UI CRUD layers for every popular platform? Why does this company even need a hub? It could use some extra lobbying power I'm sure, given that it's entire business model is dependent upon them remaining a de-facto monopoly.

dclusin 6y ago
Don’t forget a batch job framework such as airflow.
foobiekr 6y ago
Literally every post about one of these companies has a comment like this. The issue for companies like AirBNB is not that their application is necessarily bafflingly complex (though it is absolutely true that, especially during the nosql era, amazingly baroque and bizarre architectures had a heyday) but that operating reliably at scale is hard, requires good decisionmaking on multiple dimensions, and requires attention to things that "just CRUD app" doesn't capture because none of them actually matter at low scale.
- deeeeplearning 6y ago
  The same could be said about flowers.com, macys.com, or literally any company doing business on the internet. Scale is basically a solved problem so pretending that AirBnb is a "Tech Company" or that they have any interesting tech is incredibly naive.
  - foobiekr 6y ago
    Scale is not a solved problem at all. And yes, the came could be said for other, less sexy companies.
  - filoleg 6y ago
    Once macys.com gets a page with all the tech they open-sourced that is actually used at a ton of places outside of the company, similar to that of Airbnb[0], then we can talk. Out of the ones I personally worked with, Enzyme[1] is pretty much the de-facto industry standard for writing React unit tests. Airflow[2] is used very commonly (our team at a big known non-tech company I used to work at used it about 5 years ago), and so is Lottie[3]. And these are just the ones off the top of my head, given that I actually got to use those. They have many many more that seem to have a pretty high usage. And their tech blog is very insightful, I learned quite a bit from it myself when it comes to my development skills. And no, I neither was nor currently am employed by Airbnb, not a big user of theirs, not paid to say any of this, and I have no particular liking towards them at all. 0. https://airbnb.io/projects/ https://airbnb.io/projects/ 1. https://airbnb.io/projects/enzyme/ https://airbnb.io/projects/enzyme/ 2. https://airbnb.io/projects/airflow/ https://airbnb.io/projects/airflow/ 3. https://airbnb.io/projects/lottie-android/ https://airbnb.io/projects/lottie-android/

bitcharmer 6y ago

Airbnb and tech hub in one sentence. Could someone explain to me what one has to do with the other?

jppope 6y ago
+1
pb7 6y ago
>The new Atlanta hub will eventually house much of the company's growing technical and programming work, including a product development team. RTFA.
- randomsearch 6y ago
  I would guess the implication might be that Airbnb isn’t a tech company but an accommodation company? Is that fair? I don’t know. Feels like there’s a spectrum. Can’t see anything Airbnb have done that’s technically innovative, but rather their main innovation is a very novel (and much criticised) business model.
  - pb7 6y ago
    It literally doesn't matter what they are. They have engineers and they're building an office geared for them. They could bake bread as their business but if they build an office for the 3 software guys that build their marketing website and integrate a 3rd party inventory system while the 1,000 bakers work elsewhere, it would be their tech hub. Don't let your hate for Airbnb pick apart every single headline.
dang 6y ago
"Please don't post shallow dismissals, especially of other people's work. A good critical comment teaches us something." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

jppope 6y ago

Yikes. So a few years back... my buddy said he was moving to Georgia, and my reply was: "which one? One is a war-torn country in the middle east and another is a place I would never go to..."

rcpt 6y ago
Well ok. Georgia does has some nice things like the start of the start of the Appalachian Trail, hostel in the forest, and beautiful coastline.
pylua 6y ago
Good for you. A lot of people enjoy living in Atlanta . If you don’t like it then don’t visit. No need to speak like this .
draw_down 6y ago
Thanks for posting
dang 6y ago
Please don't take HN threads into regional flamewar. We're trying to stay out of hell here. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

pratik661 6y ago

I grew up in metro Atlanta and studied at Georgia Tech. The state government subsidizes college education for grads with a certain GPA (HOPE Scholarship). However, I (and most CS grads I knew) left Atlanta for better paying jobs in NYC/Bay Area/Seattle/Austin. I always wondered why the ATL tech scene was 'underdeveloped' compared to comparable sized cities like Seattle and Austin, despite having major research institutions (Georgia Tech and Emory) to anchor it. This is what I mean by 'underdeveloped': - Most software dev job postings (as of May 2018) have SPECIFIC tech stack requirements. This to me is a red flag. Most recruiters in 'developed' tech cities assume that software development skills are transferable and that technology stacks/frameworks/languages can be learned. - The salaries offered were still very low compared to comparable COL locations like Austin - No major FAANG presence to put upward pressure on local developer wages

rjbwork 6y ago
Just out of curiosity, as an Atlanta based dev, what kinds of salaries are common in Austin at various levels?
- pratik661 6y ago
  I hope I don't open a major can of worms by my parent comment. This is based on a sample of my own personal experience of 1 Austin interview and LOTs of Atlanta interviews. As a SDE with 4 YOE, I was offered $110k ish in Austin vs barely scraping 90-100k in Atlanta. I ended up taking an offer in NYC (which was my top choice to begin with).
  - dimmke 6y ago
    I live in Atlanta. I get a lot of recruiters pitching me senior SWE jobs from mediocre companies with salary ranges between 115k-130k. I think 130-150 is average for senior roles. That's definitely lower than other markets, but Atlanta is a much cheaper place to live than most other big cities. Housing is definitely catching up though. The only thing I will say about Atlanta, it gets HUMID for large swathes of the year. The climate is really unpleasant if you're prone to sweating and enjoy being outdoors.

franze 6y ago

Q: But many Airbnb Engineers do you need to fix Airbnbs horrible website? A: Lets make a techhub in Atlanta to evaluate this question.

cletus 6y ago

I think a couple of good things may come out of the pandemic: 1. Big companies being more amenable to remote work. I don't see a total shift to remote to be likely or even desirable but a partial shift is good; and 2. An end to the ultimately unsustainable ultra-concentration of tech jobs in places like SF and NYC. I see the likely winners here are Atlanta, Denver/Boulder, Dallas/Forth Worth, Austin and Tampa. This may well trickle-down to mid-sized regional centers too. Think Boise, Salt Lake City, Louisville, Nashville, Memphis, etc. I support this decentralization.

sudosteph 6y ago

I'm happy for Atlanta - it's about time they got some recognition for the growth that's happening there. However, as someone who started her tech career working at satellite offices for west coast tech companies (in RTP, NC) before moving to Seattle - there's just no comparison to the career opportunity that comes from working at a HQ (or even just in the same timezone as the HQ!). I'm back in NC, which isn't so bad now that I've "leveled up" my resume with FAANG experience and have plenty of remote work skills - but I still recommend that ambitious engineers from the south spend at least a few years in a west coast tech hub. It's possible that NYC works too now, but I'm not sure. Regardless, this is a smart move for airbnb. I have no doubt they'll get great talented engineers, lower costs, and be able to brag about their diversity numbers compared to other west coast companies as a result. But until there is real startup investment in the south, I'm not optimistic that we'll see anything special come from this trend. That said, if I'm wrong and this means more tech investment in Atlanta for startups too - I'd be incredibly happy.

kirktrue 6y ago

The article subheading states: Airbnb needed an East Coast home. Why particularly an east coast home vs. just another home? What's the strategic benefit of the east coast in particular?

cheriot 6y ago
Most of the US population is on the coasts and their headquarters is on the other one.
sdljfjafsd 6y ago
Time zones are important if your teams rely on synchronous communication (slack, zoom, etc.). My org has gone "remote" but we still rely heavily on synchronous communication so we still prefer to hire people in the same time zone. Time zones are also important if you are doing customer or client support.
UncleMeat 6y ago
A considerable portion of the US lives in the southeast. Georgia Tech is a strong CS program that is outputting a ton of qualified graduates. Not everybody living in the southeast wants to move to SF. The Southeast also has much better representation in traditionally underrepresented groups in CS, enabling tech companies to mitigate some of the "pipeline problem" that makes it basically impossible to achieve diversity goals. There are also few major tech companies with hubs in Atlanta, meaning that the first ones to really develop there can scoop up talent more easily.

conjecTech 6y ago

Woo boy, I see a lot of people throwing shade at Atlanta here. That's not exactly a new phenomenon. As a native ATLien, let me quote one of our prophets: The south got something to say.

daveevad 6y ago
I too am tired of those close-minded folks.

forrestthewoods 6y ago

Hell yeah. Everyone says they care about diversity. But you aren’t going to build a diverse workforce if all your offices are in SF, NYC, London, and Seattle. I’ve wanted to see big tech expand into the South for years. (Austin doesn’t count.) Atlanta and Nashville please.

oh_sigh 6y ago
If diversity just a euphemism for "non-white", then NYC is as diverse as Atlanta - both with about 40% white population and 60% non-white. NYC is far more diverse than America as a whole - 30% fewer whites, 2x more blacks, and 80% more Latinos, 3x more Asians, and 10x more Jews than one would expect from America's overall demographics. In fact, by most measures NYC is more diverse than Atlanta. Atlanta is for the most part whites+blacks, whereas NY has an actual latino and asian population.

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

jerzyt 6y ago

I did a project in Atlanta which required my presence on-site, so every week a flight to and back. I've spent enough time working there that I had to pay Georgia state tax. Anyway, I consider Atlanta to have one of the worst airports in US. Pathologically long lines through security, even with the rapid pass. Maybe it won't be a problem in the Covid era, with zoom calls everywhere, but in the pre-Covid era Atlanta was a PITA for travel.

prepend 6y ago
Hartsfield sucks but when compared to other busy airports it’s pretty good. And they have many chick-fil-as.
- wslack 6y ago
  It's also much bigger than most other airports, double the number of gates as SFO.
  - prepend 6y ago
    Good point, I used to hate it until I experienced other airports. JFK you have to walk and bus between terminals. DeGaulle you have to bus to planes. LAX you have to walk between terminals. ATL’s plane train means you’re always 10 minutes away from any terminal. And at least Marta runs into the airport. Atlanta public transport sucks but at least it’s to the airport. It’s weird how many cities don’t have trains going to the airport. I’m not sure there’s any airport close to busy that works this well. I prefer smaller airports where you can just walk in (OAK, FLL) but they don’t have as many flights to places.
- filoleg 6y ago
  I found the entire Hartsfield experience, ironically, to mirror that of Chick-fil-a. You see a very long line, get a sense of dread of having to wait in it, and in 5-10 mins that whole line disappears. I remember one time arriving to Hartsfield just an hour before my flight was supposed to take off, saw that the TSA line spilled out into the entrance area of the airport (due to half the security checkpoints being closed for whatever reason), and, at this point, I've made my peace with missing the flight. Just 10 mins later, I got to the front of the TSA line. The way they managed to unwrangle such a huge line was impressive, and it instantly reminded me of Chick-fil-a at the Georgia Tech student center building. Every time I got to it, I would see a line of 20-30 students, but it never took me more than 10 mins to get my food (from the moment I joined the line, to the moment I walked out).

dreamcompiler 6y ago

OK I'll bite. Airbnb is a website. A hard-to-navigate, overproduced one, but it's still basically just a website coupled to a database. And it's not even as complex as Uber's because it doesn't need realtime GPS tracking of anything. Why does Airbnb need a "tech hub?"

Naac 6y ago
Sounds like a good systems design interview question. Design an Airbnb like website operating globally. I think going through this exercise will show it's more than "just a website"
- dreamcompiler 6y ago
  Most major companies have to build a high reliability, highly-scalable website operating globally. Lots of people know how to build these things [except of course for contractors that the US federal government hires], and most of them don't have "tech hubs" in any major city unless they're ... you know ... actual tech companies. Why do we consider a glorified hotel company like Airbnb a tech company? Just because YC invested in them?
  - ttesttom 6y ago
    How is a company that is an entirely online marketplace with no physical property not a 'tech company'?
Guest42 6y ago
Agreed, meanwhile large banks do things that are technically incredible but get seen as boring.
- stevenhuang 6y ago
  Such as?
  - deleted 6y ago

yandrypozo 6y ago

I thought that tech companies were moving towards remote work.

ffggvv 6y ago

short airbnb. this is clearly their priority

vadlamak 6y ago

Atlanta is a mixed bag. I am a person of color, an immigrant and spent about a decade working in the coasts (NYC and Bay Area) before relocating to Atlanta about 6 years ago. The Pros > relatively newer, affordable housing > decent weather > good public schools > there is room for my young kids to grow in the suburbs > It is green (love the tree cover), though the locals don't seem to care and keep chopping down the trees with no remorse. > not prone to earth quakes, forest fires and gets plenty of rainfall. > Plenty of trails, lakes. You can get to a beach in 5 hours (Hilton Head, Destin etc) The Cons > Salaries are lower and yes roles are stack specific > Opportunities are limited. > Mindset > Traffic If I had the means to buy a home at any of the tech centers, I would have not moved. It is always a good idea to stay close to the mother ship(HQ). The network effect of companies attracting engineers and other way around will always work.