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A quick Google says iOS' market share is 14%. I don't understand this position at all. Google is by far and away the market leader. Their ecosystem is free and

A quick Google says iOS' market share is 14%. I don't understand this position at all. Google is by far and away the market leader. Their ecosystem is free and you can do just about anything in it. Their Play store's standards are utterly bare bones. The devices are cheaper. If what you want is an open source (ish) platform that you can hack on, modify, install software yourself, whatever, all of that is available to you, at a lower price, over there. This feels to be the ultimate first world problem, to pay a handsome premium for a top-tier device, then to complain about it's shortcomings. So take it back! Nobody made you buy one. It's not like there aren't Android handsets that do all the stuff iOS ones do, occasionally even better, for similar prices. The main reason I stick to iOS is precisely for the locked down OS, and the curated App Store, so to see so many people complaining that they purchased the device when those things are like, the most obvious part of what comprises an iOS device, then complain about those things, is utter madness to me. Why the fuck must Apple also do that, with a higher priced device, that everyone claims is inferior to Android handsets with their quad core processors and is "just a fashion item?" Android users seem unhealthily obsessed with turning iOS into Android. Just let us do our own thing over here for fuck's sake. Yet again and again on here and elsewhere, iOS is constantly positioned as this MONOLITH of anti-consumer anti-developer DOOM, absolutely RUINING the mobile market. Again, FOUR. TEEN. PERCENT.

HideousKojima 6y ago
14% is worldwide, in the US it's roughly 50%
- FlownScepter 6y ago
  That's still nothing close to a monopoly.
  - stale2002 6y ago
    Anti trust law does not require a monopoly.
    - FlownScepter 6y ago
      Anti-trust law is entirely irrelevant despite how often it gets brought up in this discussion. Entering into the restrictions of an iPhone is 100% voluntary. You do not currently have the right to run whatever code you want on anything you own. This fails every commonly held definition of a monopoly. We're not even talking like, cable company monopoly here that's entered into by virtue of buying or renting property in a given space, which at least you have a lot of friction there to claim "I can't reasonably be expected to go elsewhere just to buy from a different cable provider." You literally just buy an Android phone, and you're free of the restrictions imposed by Apple, immediately.
      - stale2002 6y ago
        I would recommend that you read up on anti-trust law. https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/competition-guidance/guide-antitrust-laws/single-firm-conduct/monopolization-defined https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/competition-guidance/guide-a... Here is the government released statement on these types of topics. "Courts do not require a literal monopoly before applying rules for single firm conduct; that term is used as shorthand for a firm with significant and durable market power" That is from the US government. For any other further comments you have on the topic of anti-trust law, or market power, please read this government statement first and see how it applies to your statement. > Entering into the restrictions of an iPhone is 100% voluntary. If a company has significant market power, then anti-trust law can apply. > This fails every commonly held definition of a monopoly Anti trust law does not require a literal monopoly. So I am not sure why you are bringing that up. Anti-trust law only requires significant market power. And Apple has 50% of the US smartphone market, which is within the realm of what courts have considered to be significant market power. > You literally just buy an Android phone, and you're free of the restrictions imposed by Apple, immediately. Apple still has 50% of the US market. That can be significant market power, as the courts have ruled in the past.
      - munk-a 6y ago
        In the late 90s Microsoft was IMO, pretty clearly a monopoly while Apple survived as a beacon of "See guys - we're not technically a monopoly" - having a competitor isn't enough to not be participating in an anti-competitive market, the manner in which Android and Apple have a complete dominance of the market is pretty insane and it makes both of their business decisions fair game for anti-trust arguments.
  - xxs 6y ago
    The article is about the EU and 'monopoly' is not relevant for anti-competitive practices.
KillahBhyte 6y ago
THIS! Say it a little louder for those in the back. I work in IT. I do not want to have a mini IT project in my pocket that I have to fiddle with. I want a device that is dependable above all else that I don't have to work on for my everyday driver. This is the same answer I provide every time someone at work ask my why I carry an Apple phone. To me the curation is part of the draw. I know that this phone will require the least amount of my attention to keep it working day in, day out. That is the feature I wanted most. But every iOS post I read is along the lines of make it like android, and I have the same prevailing thought. Why?? I would not own a MacOS machine, I wouldn't like it. But I don't feel the need to get on every Mac discussion complaining it should be more like Linux. The fact the differences exist is a good thing.
- dkonofalski 6y ago
  Exactly. It's the same reason rich people hire people to do their accounting and cleaning and all the other stuff they don't want to do. I want to pick up my phone and use it not mess with it every 3 days because there's something slightly off or there's a bug with the latest mod I installed.
- FlownScepter 6y ago
  I actually have a Mac too, but I also have Bootcamp configured because Mac doesn't do everything I need. I'm just like, what do I need to do right now, and what's the most reliable tool for that job? My phone, ultimately, is communications and quick research. I need it to make calls, send messages, send emails, and use the browser. And off-duty, I use the camera to capture memories. I got the big one because I wanted the bigger screen (though ultimately I miss the smaller size one I had before, so that will likely change whenever I get around to replacing it.) And I also do projects. I build 3D printers, I play with Pi's, I build PC's. I do all kinds of tinkering shit. I just don't feel the need to do it on my phone, and therefore what are cited as "limitations" of it are just irrelevant to me. It does everything I need it to do, and more. Android and iOS in my mind aren't really even in competition. They're two very similar products that should appeal to two entirely different userbases. They're pickups and sportscars, both great for what they do, but utlimately trying to have a pickup that's also a sportscar just means it's probably going to be lousy at both.
Daho0n 6y ago
Why do you repeat market share? It is completely irrelevant and unless you understand this it is no wonder you are confused. Abuse of market position has nothing to do with monopoly. You can abuse your position without having a monopoly. Even if Apple had 1% they could still abuse their position. You can disagree that it is a problem but talking about market share is missing the point. >Just let us do our own thing over here for fuck's sake. No one is forcing you to do anything. There can be 10 app stores and you could still use one the one. Just like many PC gamers have done for decades. I own hundreds of games and I only use GOG and Steam. Pretending you are forced to do anything is disingenuous. People have more right to use their bought hardware than you and Apple have to deny it. It's not a matter of if but when Apple will be forced to allow people to own their owned hardware.
jedberg 6y ago
You're looking at this backwards. While their market share might be 14%, they control 66% of app revenue. As a developer I'm restricted from accessing that 66%. THAT is why I want an open platform. Access to those consumers. That has nothing to do with my choice of platform. It has to do with access to a large market which I am being restricted from.
- zepto 6y ago
  > It has to do with access to a large market which I am being restricted from. Wait - what App do you want to sell that won’t allow?
  - jedberg 6y ago
    There are ton of apps they won't allow. Firefox and Chrome are two big ones (with their own render engines). A python interpreter. Anything with porn. Basically, go to the Cydia store and look at any app in there. Why can't the Cydia store be allowed?
    - zepto 6y ago
      So you don’t actually have an app you want to publish? As for the Cydia store, that allows apps to to run on jailbroken phones, I.e. with security protections removed. It should be obvious why users want to buy a platform that is as secure as Apple can make it.
      - jedberg 6y ago
        I have apps I want to publish, but why would I even begin to work on them knowing that Apple could pull the plug on me at any time? And yes, the Cydia store is for jailbroken phones because that's the only way to load your own software onto your phone, but there are plenty of useful apps on there that aren't security issues and are only there to get around app store restrictions. Apple doesn't have to restrict which apps I run to keep it secure. They do just fine securing MacOS, which allows one to install whatever they want.

HideousKojima 6y ago

14% is worldwide, in the US it's roughly 50%

FlownScepter 6y ago
That's still nothing close to a monopoly.
- stale2002 6y ago
  Anti trust law does not require a monopoly.
  - FlownScepter 6y ago
    Anti-trust law is entirely irrelevant despite how often it gets brought up in this discussion. Entering into the restrictions of an iPhone is 100% voluntary. You do not currently have the right to run whatever code you want on anything you own. This fails every commonly held definition of a monopoly. We're not even talking like, cable company monopoly here that's entered into by virtue of buying or renting property in a given space, which at least you have a lot of friction there to claim "I can't reasonably be expected to go elsewhere just to buy from a different cable provider." You literally just buy an Android phone, and you're free of the restrictions imposed by Apple, immediately.
    - stale2002 6y ago
      I would recommend that you read up on anti-trust law. https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/competition-guidance/guide-antitrust-laws/single-firm-conduct/monopolization-defined https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/competition-guidance/guide-a... Here is the government released statement on these types of topics. "Courts do not require a literal monopoly before applying rules for single firm conduct; that term is used as shorthand for a firm with significant and durable market power" That is from the US government. For any other further comments you have on the topic of anti-trust law, or market power, please read this government statement first and see how it applies to your statement. > Entering into the restrictions of an iPhone is 100% voluntary. If a company has significant market power, then anti-trust law can apply. > This fails every commonly held definition of a monopoly Anti trust law does not require a literal monopoly. So I am not sure why you are bringing that up. Anti-trust law only requires significant market power. And Apple has 50% of the US smartphone market, which is within the realm of what courts have considered to be significant market power. > You literally just buy an Android phone, and you're free of the restrictions imposed by Apple, immediately. Apple still has 50% of the US market. That can be significant market power, as the courts have ruled in the past.
    - munk-a 6y ago
      In the late 90s Microsoft was IMO, pretty clearly a monopoly while Apple survived as a beacon of "See guys - we're not technically a monopoly" - having a competitor isn't enough to not be participating in an anti-competitive market, the manner in which Android and Apple have a complete dominance of the market is pretty insane and it makes both of their business decisions fair game for anti-trust arguments.
- xxs 6y ago
  The article is about the EU and 'monopoly' is not relevant for anti-competitive practices.

KillahBhyte 6y ago

THIS! Say it a little louder for those in the back. I work in IT. I do not want to have a mini IT project in my pocket that I have to fiddle with. I want a device that is dependable above all else that I don't have to work on for my everyday driver. This is the same answer I provide every time someone at work ask my why I carry an Apple phone. To me the curation is part of the draw. I know that this phone will require the least amount of my attention to keep it working day in, day out. That is the feature I wanted most. But every iOS post I read is along the lines of make it like android, and I have the same prevailing thought. Why?? I would not own a MacOS machine, I wouldn't like it. But I don't feel the need to get on every Mac discussion complaining it should be more like Linux. The fact the differences exist is a good thing.

dkonofalski 6y ago
Exactly. It's the same reason rich people hire people to do their accounting and cleaning and all the other stuff they don't want to do. I want to pick up my phone and use it not mess with it every 3 days because there's something slightly off or there's a bug with the latest mod I installed.
FlownScepter 6y ago
I actually have a Mac too, but I also have Bootcamp configured because Mac doesn't do everything I need. I'm just like, what do I need to do right now, and what's the most reliable tool for that job? My phone, ultimately, is communications and quick research. I need it to make calls, send messages, send emails, and use the browser. And off-duty, I use the camera to capture memories. I got the big one because I wanted the bigger screen (though ultimately I miss the smaller size one I had before, so that will likely change whenever I get around to replacing it.) And I also do projects. I build 3D printers, I play with Pi's, I build PC's. I do all kinds of tinkering shit. I just don't feel the need to do it on my phone, and therefore what are cited as "limitations" of it are just irrelevant to me. It does everything I need it to do, and more. Android and iOS in my mind aren't really even in competition. They're two very similar products that should appeal to two entirely different userbases. They're pickups and sportscars, both great for what they do, but utlimately trying to have a pickup that's also a sportscar just means it's probably going to be lousy at both.

Daho0n 6y ago

Why do you repeat market share? It is completely irrelevant and unless you understand this it is no wonder you are confused. Abuse of market position has nothing to do with monopoly. You can abuse your position without having a monopoly. Even if Apple had 1% they could still abuse their position. You can disagree that it is a problem but talking about market share is missing the point. >Just let us do our own thing over here for fuck's sake. No one is forcing you to do anything. There can be 10 app stores and you could still use one the one. Just like many PC gamers have done for decades. I own hundreds of games and I only use GOG and Steam. Pretending you are forced to do anything is disingenuous. People have more right to use their bought hardware than you and Apple have to deny it. It's not a matter of if but when Apple will be forced to allow people to own their owned hardware.

jedberg 6y ago

You're looking at this backwards. While their market share might be 14%, they control 66% of app revenue. As a developer I'm restricted from accessing that 66%. THAT is why I want an open platform. Access to those consumers. That has nothing to do with my choice of platform. It has to do with access to a large market which I am being restricted from.

zepto 6y ago
> It has to do with access to a large market which I am being restricted from. Wait - what App do you want to sell that won’t allow?
- jedberg 6y ago
  There are ton of apps they won't allow. Firefox and Chrome are two big ones (with their own render engines). A python interpreter. Anything with porn. Basically, go to the Cydia store and look at any app in there. Why can't the Cydia store be allowed?
  - zepto 6y ago
    So you don’t actually have an app you want to publish? As for the Cydia store, that allows apps to to run on jailbroken phones, I.e. with security protections removed. It should be obvious why users want to buy a platform that is as secure as Apple can make it.
    - jedberg 6y ago
      I have apps I want to publish, but why would I even begin to work on them knowing that Apple could pull the plug on me at any time? And yes, the Cydia store is for jailbroken phones because that's the only way to load your own software onto your phone, but there are plenty of useful apps on there that aren't security issues and are only there to get around app store restrictions. Apple doesn't have to restrict which apps I run to keep it secure. They do just fine securing MacOS, which allows one to install whatever they want.