6 ms·

Most healthcare apps not up to NHS standards

33 points by mikesabbagh 6y ago

McDev 6y ago
The last time I'll never use a healthcare app was when I heard about [0]. I can't trust our current tech / startup company culture with such sensitive things. [0]: https://www.digitalhealth.net/2020/09/babylon-to-face-no-further-action-for-data-breach-of-gp-at-hand/ https://www.digitalhealth.net/2020/09/babylon-to-face-no-fur... > Babylon Health will face “no further action” for a data breach that allowed a user of its GP app to access video recordings of other patients’ consultations.
- hkt 6y ago
  Grim. What's worse is that the semi-privatised world of GPs starting to come apart now means it would be a great moment to roll out an NHS GP app that was made and staffed in house. I suspect the government is quite unlikely to permit this though, so we'll end up at £20+ per appointment or a free to use private service like this GP at Hand. A pity and a waste, really.
  - rgblambda 6y ago
    >>it would be a great moment to roll out an NHS GP app that was made and staffed in house. Such a thing already exists and has been in use for years. https://www.nhs.uk/nhs-services/online-services/nhs-app/ https://www.nhs.uk/nhs-services/online-services/nhs-app/
    - c7DJTLrn 6y ago
      I recently filled out an eConsult form hoping that it would allow me to get help asynchronously without having to get an appointment. The response I got was pretty much "call us". Useless. I have a feeling that form I filled will never be looked at again.
- antihero 6y ago
  Once interviewed for them and the bait-n-switched the salary (or the recruiter massively inflated it, who knows - was advertised to be an 80K senior job and they were actually like nah we're only offering 60K).
- rvz 6y ago
  No surprises there. Babylon has special connections to the UK government as both part of the coronavirus technology task force and the health secretary being a regular cheerleader for them. So yes, they are able to get away with any sort of disaster like this one.
throwawayboise 6y ago
I've decided to opt out of the med-tech-industrial complex. As far as I can see it's mainly a transfer of wealth to already-wealthy people. I see the dentist twice a year. That's it. No apps, no health devices, no screenings, no monitoring, no doctors.
- brokenmachine 6y ago
  Good thinking!! Just decide to not get sick. Why doesn't everyone just do that?
  - dazc 6y ago
    People can do this to an extent but many don't.
    - antihero 6y ago
      You can live a healthier lifestyle which will prevent a lot of things, but there's still an absolute shitload of issues which are absolutely not a person's fault in the slightest.
      - rorykoehler 6y ago
        Loads of them are better handled outside of corporate/industrial medicine too. I’m very excited for medical advances etc however I don’t think modern medicinal therapies should be the default treatment option they are. Even my rheumatologist was 1) surprised I handled my condition without prescription medicine and pushed back when he suggested it and 2) at the results of my blood tests that showed my 100% diet based approach was working. My rule of thumb is that unless the pain and lifestyle impacts are unbearable or the treatment fixes the problem outright then an alternative approach is more desirable.
- KineticLensman 6y ago
  I did the same. Until I had a retinal vein occlusion caused by undetected high blood pressure. This caused a blind spot in my left eye's central visual field that lasted for weeks. I could not easily read using that eye alone. If it had been a retinal artery occlusion I'd have a permanent blind spot. Moral - some basic health checks can save a lot of grief.
goatinaboat 6y ago
The NHS is a pretty low bar for apps, it’s still running on Windows XP.
- mjevans 6y ago
  For anything that has to reach the whole public, this is a valid use case. Like that article (or was a it comment?) a little bit back about the recently homeless by relationship issues person filling out social aid forms on an old gaming device with a very limited browser and low memory and a tiny screen. ++ found it ++ "The unreasonable effectiveness of simple HTML" from a thread near the end of Jan 2021. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25915313 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25915313 https://shkspr.mobi/blog/2021/01/the-unreasonable-effectiveness-of-simple-html/ https://shkspr.mobi/blog/2021/01/the-unreasonable-effectiven...
- mhh__ 6y ago
  XP is not an App.
- hkt 6y ago
  Trident works on a version of it too: https://www.theregister.com/2008/12/16/windows_for_submarines_rollout/ https://www.theregister.com/2008/12/16/windows_for_submarine... Yes, the always at sea nuclear deterrent. Really. Perhaps new software ain't all that. (Or, as a country, we are desperately incompetent and heading for disaster-by-BSOD)
- frereubu 6y ago
  The NHS isn't "running on Windows XP". There are still a few machines like that - https://www.publictechnology.net/articles/news/nhs-still-running-2300-pcs-windows-xp https://www.publictechnology.net/articles/news/nhs-still-run... (2,300 as of July 2019, which will have decreased since then) - but after the wannacry attack they took it much more seriously (and I think that was partly the government taking it more seriously so they actually got the budget to do it) and were steadily migrating things to Windows 10.
  - c7DJTLrn 6y ago

33 points by mikesabbagh 6y ago

The last time I'll never use a healthcare app was when I heard about [0]. I can't trust our current tech / startup company culture with such sensitive things. [0]: https://www.digitalhealth.net/2020/09/babylon-to-face-no-further-action-for-data-breach-of-gp-at-hand/ https://www.digitalhealth.net/2020/09/babylon-to-face-no-fur... > Babylon Health will face “no further action” for a data breach that allowed a user of its GP app to access video recordings of other patients’ consultations.

hkt 6y ago
Grim. What's worse is that the semi-privatised world of GPs starting to come apart now means it would be a great moment to roll out an NHS GP app that was made and staffed in house. I suspect the government is quite unlikely to permit this though, so we'll end up at £20+ per appointment or a free to use private service like this GP at Hand. A pity and a waste, really.
- rgblambda 6y ago
  >>it would be a great moment to roll out an NHS GP app that was made and staffed in house. Such a thing already exists and has been in use for years. https://www.nhs.uk/nhs-services/online-services/nhs-app/ https://www.nhs.uk/nhs-services/online-services/nhs-app/
  - c7DJTLrn 6y ago
    I recently filled out an eConsult form hoping that it would allow me to get help asynchronously without having to get an appointment. The response I got was pretty much "call us". Useless. I have a feeling that form I filled will never be looked at again.
antihero 6y ago
Once interviewed for them and the bait-n-switched the salary (or the recruiter massively inflated it, who knows - was advertised to be an 80K senior job and they were actually like nah we're only offering 60K).
rvz 6y ago
No surprises there. Babylon has special connections to the UK government as both part of the coronavirus technology task force and the health secretary being a regular cheerleader for them. So yes, they are able to get away with any sort of disaster like this one.

throwawayboise 6y ago

I've decided to opt out of the med-tech-industrial complex. As far as I can see it's mainly a transfer of wealth to already-wealthy people. I see the dentist twice a year. That's it. No apps, no health devices, no screenings, no monitoring, no doctors.

brokenmachine 6y ago
Good thinking!! Just decide to not get sick. Why doesn't everyone just do that?
- dazc 6y ago
  People can do this to an extent but many don't.
  - antihero 6y ago
    You can live a healthier lifestyle which will prevent a lot of things, but there's still an absolute shitload of issues which are absolutely not a person's fault in the slightest.
    - rorykoehler 6y ago
      Loads of them are better handled outside of corporate/industrial medicine too. I’m very excited for medical advances etc however I don’t think modern medicinal therapies should be the default treatment option they are. Even my rheumatologist was 1) surprised I handled my condition without prescription medicine and pushed back when he suggested it and 2) at the results of my blood tests that showed my 100% diet based approach was working. My rule of thumb is that unless the pain and lifestyle impacts are unbearable or the treatment fixes the problem outright then an alternative approach is more desirable.
KineticLensman 6y ago
I did the same. Until I had a retinal vein occlusion caused by undetected high blood pressure. This caused a blind spot in my left eye's central visual field that lasted for weeks. I could not easily read using that eye alone. If it had been a retinal artery occlusion I'd have a permanent blind spot. Moral - some basic health checks can save a lot of grief.

goatinaboat 6y ago

The NHS is a pretty low bar for apps, it’s still running on Windows XP.

mjevans 6y ago
For anything that has to reach the whole public, this is a valid use case. Like that article (or was a it comment?) a little bit back about the recently homeless by relationship issues person filling out social aid forms on an old gaming device with a very limited browser and low memory and a tiny screen. ++ found it ++ "The unreasonable effectiveness of simple HTML" from a thread near the end of Jan 2021. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25915313 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25915313 https://shkspr.mobi/blog/2021/01/the-unreasonable-effectiveness-of-simple-html/ https://shkspr.mobi/blog/2021/01/the-unreasonable-effectiven...
mhh__ 6y ago
XP is not an App.
hkt 6y ago
Trident works on a version of it too: https://www.theregister.com/2008/12/16/windows_for_submarines_rollout/ https://www.theregister.com/2008/12/16/windows_for_submarine... Yes, the always at sea nuclear deterrent. Really. Perhaps new software ain't all that. (Or, as a country, we are desperately incompetent and heading for disaster-by-BSOD)
frereubu 6y ago
The NHS isn't "running on Windows XP". There are still a few machines like that - https://www.publictechnology.net/articles/news/nhs-still-running-2300-pcs-windows-xp https://www.publictechnology.net/articles/news/nhs-still-run... (2,300 as of July 2019, which will have decreased since then) - but after the wannacry attack they took it much more seriously (and I think that was partly the government taking it more seriously so they actually got the budget to do it) and were steadily migrating things to Windows 10.
- c7DJTLrn 6y ago