3 ms·

I want to use this, but every time I try to switch it is not there yet. Sure it has the core stuff, but things like ActionMailer and the built in S3 support in

by syspec 6y ago

I want to use this, but every time I try to switch it is not there yet. Sure it has the core stuff, but things like ActionMailer and the built in S3 support in ActiveStorage, Devise, keep me going back. Too many of those things are not there... yet ... with Phoenix Also nothing beats active record after they added Arel which turns your query into an AST and optimizes it before sending it out - Ecto is not really there yet and doesn't look like it will get there

andy_ppp 6y ago
I think most packages are just as good if not better than their Ruby equivalents these days (and really we can do all of the things you mentioned in elixir), the active record pattern is obviously easier to understand than Ecto, but if you know how to write well optimised SQL you never want to go back to an ORM (even if it tries to rewrite your queries for you with magic).
- anhari 6y ago
  ActiveRecord and the scenic gem for database views is a very powerful combination. For the vast majority of queries, you don't need to write optimized SQL by hand. When you do, you can push that work to a version controlled database view, and wrap it in a ActiveRecord class interface and still get all of the ORM niceties.
  - andy_ppp 6y ago
    The difference here is between two different philosophies: 1) I want the thing to just work, it doesn't matter about underlying complexity, give me the magic and the version controlled database view and the ORM niceties. 2) I don't trust magic as it has bitten me in the arse before, let me make and be able to fix things myself as I'm working at a (slightly) lower level. I'm not saying either is correct but in Phoenix/Elixir magic stuff tends to be kept to a minimum. One man's "for the vast majority of queries" is another persons "will work fine until you need to do something complex". It's all trade offs and I choose mine carefully as I'm sure you do.

by syspec 6y ago

andy_ppp 6y ago

I think most packages are just as good if not better than their Ruby equivalents these days (and really we can do all of the things you mentioned in elixir), the active record pattern is obviously easier to understand than Ecto, but if you know how to write well optimised SQL you never want to go back to an ORM (even if it tries to rewrite your queries for you with magic).

anhari 6y ago
ActiveRecord and the scenic gem for database views is a very powerful combination. For the vast majority of queries, you don't need to write optimized SQL by hand. When you do, you can push that work to a version controlled database view, and wrap it in a ActiveRecord class interface and still get all of the ORM niceties.
- andy_ppp 6y ago
  The difference here is between two different philosophies: 1) I want the thing to just work, it doesn't matter about underlying complexity, give me the magic and the version controlled database view and the ORM niceties. 2) I don't trust magic as it has bitten me in the arse before, let me make and be able to fix things myself as I'm working at a (slightly) lower level. I'm not saying either is correct but in Phoenix/Elixir magic stuff tends to be kept to a minimum. One man's "for the vast majority of queries" is another persons "will work fine until you need to do something complex". It's all trade offs and I choose mine carefully as I'm sure you do.