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I think a modern dualist would view this as hardware vs software. If all were able to measure were voltage levels on a CPU, you would say all computing is inev

I think a modern dualist would view this as hardware vs software. If all were able to measure were voltage levels on a CPU, you would say all computing is inevitably bound to changing electrical voltages/currents. However, you would miss out on all the math and algorithms and the beauty and richness that is software. A dualist might see the “soul” as the software that the physical brain executes. Of course, if all you have access to is brain electrical measurements, you see no distinction. However, if you look inside yourself with introspection, you will see a richness of ideas, thoughts, motivations that actually drive the physical brain.

esperent 6y ago
> A dualist might see the “soul” as the software that the physical brain executes. I don't think so (although there are multiple definitions of "dualist"). In the software/hardware analogy, the software still exists, physically. It's described directly in electrical impulses going though the hardware. For dualists, the soul is strictly non-physical.
- weinzierl 6y ago
  The hardware is the plastic, the metal and the silicon, software is ultimately the fleeting electrical signals. That's how I see it too and a pretty common view, I think. What I read from the parent comment is different though. It's more akin to electricity belongs to the physical world, software is the non-physical.
pjc50 6y ago
The question of interest is are these two separate things (dualism), or the same thing seen at different scales? The Earth is beautiful when seen from space: you can see entire oceans. That doesn't mean that the ocean isn't made out of water molecules or that we must impute some special non-physical "oceanness" to it.
pessimizer 6y ago
Introspection is an untrustworthy self-narrative. Repeating a bunch of language that you've been told describes why people behave as they do is indistinguishable from the introspection you describe. GPT-3 could definitely do it convincingly. edit: I'd recommend Eric Schwitzgebel for discussions about introspection and consciousness http://faculty.ucr.edu/~eschwitz/ http://faculty.ucr.edu/~eschwitz/
GoblinSlayer 6y ago
Hardware + software is a physicalist view. Dualist view is material hardware + astral hardware, ironically they don't quite believe in software.
- finghin 6y ago
  There are plenty of property dualists around: https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/dualism/#ProDua https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/dualism/#ProDua
  - mannykannot 6y ago
    Hardware + software would not qualify as property dualism (at least as described in your link) unless one was asserting that the behavior of the software could not be completely accounted for in terms of hardware operations. In that article, the example of vitalism is apposite.

esperent 6y ago

> A dualist might see the “soul” as the software that the physical brain executes. I don't think so (although there are multiple definitions of "dualist"). In the software/hardware analogy, the software still exists, physically. It's described directly in electrical impulses going though the hardware. For dualists, the soul is strictly non-physical.

weinzierl 6y ago
The hardware is the plastic, the metal and the silicon, software is ultimately the fleeting electrical signals. That's how I see it too and a pretty common view, I think. What I read from the parent comment is different though. It's more akin to electricity belongs to the physical world, software is the non-physical.

pjc50 6y ago

The question of interest is are these two separate things (dualism), or the same thing seen at different scales? The Earth is beautiful when seen from space: you can see entire oceans. That doesn't mean that the ocean isn't made out of water molecules or that we must impute some special non-physical "oceanness" to it.

pessimizer 6y ago

Introspection is an untrustworthy self-narrative. Repeating a bunch of language that you've been told describes why people behave as they do is indistinguishable from the introspection you describe. GPT-3 could definitely do it convincingly. edit: I'd recommend Eric Schwitzgebel for discussions about introspection and consciousness http://faculty.ucr.edu/~eschwitz/ http://faculty.ucr.edu/~eschwitz/

GoblinSlayer 6y ago

Hardware + software is a physicalist view. Dualist view is material hardware + astral hardware, ironically they don't quite believe in software.

finghin 6y ago
There are plenty of property dualists around: https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/dualism/#ProDua https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/dualism/#ProDua
- mannykannot 6y ago
  Hardware + software would not qualify as property dualism (at least as described in your link) unless one was asserting that the behavior of the software could not be completely accounted for in terms of hardware operations. In that article, the example of vitalism is apposite.