Yeah I agree, there's lots of bloat as well, that's why I said that the transition of bubble tinkerers to actual coding with any high level languages and framew

Yeah I agree, there's lots of bloat as well, that's why I said that the transition of bubble tinkerers to actual coding with any high level languages and frameworks would be very liberating. Even a beginner could do a heck lot in something like RoR or Django, without even mastering the respective languages.