5 ms·

The American factories are only producing for Americans. The European ones are producing for the whole world.

FooBarWidget 6y ago
Are they? Didn't the EU put up a vaccine export ban? https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-55860540 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-55860540
- corty 6y ago
  No, they are currently just requiring export licenses "to get an overview". Up to now, all export requests have been granted and there are large parts of the world where no license is required: https://www.tagesschau.de/wirtschaft/weltwirtschaft/eu-impfstoffe-exporte-101.html https://www.tagesschau.de/wirtschaft/weltwirtschaft/eu-impfs... Overall I would call it useless EU blustering, there won't be an export ban, no matter what happens. It is just the minimum required measure to save face.
  - bb123 6y ago
    Also lets not forget that this was specifically targeting the UK, not the rest of the world.
    - emteycz 6y ago
      Are you saying EU specifically tried to ban export to UK while export to the rest of the world is ok?
      - deleted 6y ago
        [deleted]
      - Reason077 6y ago
        There is/was a contract dispute between the EU and AstraZeneca regarding supply of the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine. The EU wanted AstraZeneca to supply additional vaccine from it's UK-based factories, which are already contracted to supply the UK. The export registration requirements (not an export ban) are, at least in part, in response to this dispute. https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/jan/30/lawyers-disagree-over-astrazenecas-duty-to-supply-vaccines-to-eu https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/jan/30/lawyers-dis...
        the-dude 6y ago
        There was misunderstanding and arrogance from EU bureaucrats about how business works. They have already tracked back ( Von Der Leyen in EU parliament, Merkel in media ).
        bipson 6y ago
        Well, the contract with the EU included the UK factory(ies) as a (potential?) supplier to the EU. UK signed the contracts slightly earlier and jump-started the programme by issuing an emergency approval a few weeks earlier than the regular approval by the EMA. And above all, it seems despite all efforts of coordination and treaties (COVAX), almost all players (except Norway) are playing the auction game and hoarding. This is a global pandemic and these "selfish" actions will have global effects :(
        corty 6y ago
        The rest of the world will get it's vaccines after the first-world states are all vaccinated. And while it sucks to live in a third-world country where vaccinations will come 2022 or 2023 maybe, I can't see any other way, except if the third world would do their own production. Letting more people in the first world die to save some in the third world would be politically impossible.
        Reason077 6y ago
        The problem is that letting the virus continue to circulate unchecked in the developing world just gives it more opportunities to mutate into new, possibly vaccine-resistant variants. Variants can then spread back to infect the first world, and as we've already seen, this can happen quite quickly. A global vaccination strategy is needed if we really want to get on top of Covid for the long term.
    - corty 6y ago
      That is not quite true, it doesn't only target the UK. The export requirements apply to basically everyone except third-world countries through Covax and Switzerland/Norway/Ukraine/Israel due to existing treaties. But it is true that the AstraZeneca/UK-situation was the trigger event that lead to the public noticing that something was amiss.
- the-dude 6y ago
  A Dutch facility is producing vaccines ( AZ ) for the UK, as they have been financed from the UK deal.
  - tluyben2 6y ago
    That factory is in Belgium right? Or do we have one too? (I don't really follow much covid news)
    - the-dude 6y ago
      https://nos.nl/artikel/2367290-eu-erkent-wel-degelijk-nederlandse-productie-astrazeneca-vaccin.html https://nos.nl/artikel/2367290-eu-erkent-wel-degelijk-nederl... Halix in Leiden.
vmception 6y ago
doesn't explain why European ones are happening in one factory
- DavideNL 6y ago
  > in one factory This is not true; Not sure if i can find the source i read (at spiegel.de) but i will have a look and post it if i find it.)
  - DavideNL 6y ago
    So apparently the main EU plant for production of the vaccine is in Puurs, Belgium. The second one (already producing today) is in Marburg, Germany. Source in German: > "In the first half of 2021, 250 million doses of the vaccine are to be produced..." https://www.spiegel.de/wirtschaft/unternehmen/corona-impfstoff-biontech-faehrt-impfstoffproduktion-in-marburg-hoch-a-ae2a498b-88e5-449e-b746-29bd08afc748 https://www.spiegel.de/wirtschaft/unternehmen/corona-impfsto... I don't know if there are more factories...?
dogma1138 6y ago
Some American factories are export restricted, Pfizer has set up production in the US which is cleared for export as they didn’t took any government funding for those production lines. Israel is getting most of their doses from US factories not EU ones.
- jacquesm 6y ago
  And pays more than 10x as much per dose.
  - dageshi 6y ago
    And that really doesn't matter compared to the cost of locking down a country and the lives saved by quicker vaccination.
    - jacquesm 6y ago
      Agreed. But given the lack of production this was an easier deal to make for Israel than for say all of the EU, no matter what the price, those vaccines are not available in that quantity.
      - dogma1138 6y ago
        Chicken and the egg if the EU would’ve handed out 50 billion € a year ago to setup production and stockpiles it would’ve made a difference...
  - dogma1138 6y ago
    Israel is paying about $30 a dose about twice the Pfizer listed price in the US and EU not 10 times more. It’s paying 10 times more when comparing to the AZ vaccine but that’s not apples to apples.
    - jacquesm 6y ago
      https://www.jpost.com/israel-news/the-cost-of-vaccinating-israel-nis-1-billion-655088 https://www.jpost.com/israel-news/the-cost-of-vaccinating-is... says $47 / dose

Are they? Didn't the EU put up a vaccine export ban? https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-55860540 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-55860540

corty 6y ago
No, they are currently just requiring export licenses "to get an overview". Up to now, all export requests have been granted and there are large parts of the world where no license is required: https://www.tagesschau.de/wirtschaft/weltwirtschaft/eu-impfstoffe-exporte-101.html https://www.tagesschau.de/wirtschaft/weltwirtschaft/eu-impfs... Overall I would call it useless EU blustering, there won't be an export ban, no matter what happens. It is just the minimum required measure to save face.
- bb123 6y ago
  Also lets not forget that this was specifically targeting the UK, not the rest of the world.
  - emteycz 6y ago
    Are you saying EU specifically tried to ban export to UK while export to the rest of the world is ok?
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
    - Reason077 6y ago
      There is/was a contract dispute between the EU and AstraZeneca regarding supply of the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine. The EU wanted AstraZeneca to supply additional vaccine from it's UK-based factories, which are already contracted to supply the UK. The export registration requirements (not an export ban) are, at least in part, in response to this dispute. https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/jan/30/lawyers-disagree-over-astrazenecas-duty-to-supply-vaccines-to-eu https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/jan/30/lawyers-dis...
      - the-dude 6y ago
        There was misunderstanding and arrogance from EU bureaucrats about how business works. They have already tracked back ( Von Der Leyen in EU parliament, Merkel in media ).
      - bipson 6y ago
        Well, the contract with the EU included the UK factory(ies) as a (potential?) supplier to the EU. UK signed the contracts slightly earlier and jump-started the programme by issuing an emergency approval a few weeks earlier than the regular approval by the EMA. And above all, it seems despite all efforts of coordination and treaties (COVAX), almost all players (except Norway) are playing the auction game and hoarding. This is a global pandemic and these "selfish" actions will have global effects :(
        corty 6y ago
        The rest of the world will get it's vaccines after the first-world states are all vaccinated. And while it sucks to live in a third-world country where vaccinations will come 2022 or 2023 maybe, I can't see any other way, except if the third world would do their own production. Letting more people in the first world die to save some in the third world would be politically impossible.
        Reason077 6y ago
        The problem is that letting the virus continue to circulate unchecked in the developing world just gives it more opportunities to mutate into new, possibly vaccine-resistant variants. Variants can then spread back to infect the first world, and as we've already seen, this can happen quite quickly. A global vaccination strategy is needed if we really want to get on top of Covid for the long term.
  - corty 6y ago
    That is not quite true, it doesn't only target the UK. The export requirements apply to basically everyone except third-world countries through Covax and Switzerland/Norway/Ukraine/Israel due to existing treaties. But it is true that the AstraZeneca/UK-situation was the trigger event that lead to the public noticing that something was amiss.
the-dude 6y ago
A Dutch facility is producing vaccines ( AZ ) for the UK, as they have been financed from the UK deal.
- tluyben2 6y ago
  That factory is in Belgium right? Or do we have one too? (I don't really follow much covid news)
  - the-dude 6y ago
    https://nos.nl/artikel/2367290-eu-erkent-wel-degelijk-nederlandse-productie-astrazeneca-vaccin.html https://nos.nl/artikel/2367290-eu-erkent-wel-degelijk-nederl... Halix in Leiden.

vmception 6y ago

doesn't explain why European ones are happening in one factory

DavideNL 6y ago
> in one factory This is not true; Not sure if i can find the source i read (at spiegel.de) but i will have a look and post it if i find it.)
- DavideNL 6y ago
  So apparently the main EU plant for production of the vaccine is in Puurs, Belgium. The second one (already producing today) is in Marburg, Germany. Source in German: > "In the first half of 2021, 250 million doses of the vaccine are to be produced..." https://www.spiegel.de/wirtschaft/unternehmen/corona-impfstoff-biontech-faehrt-impfstoffproduktion-in-marburg-hoch-a-ae2a498b-88e5-449e-b746-29bd08afc748 https://www.spiegel.de/wirtschaft/unternehmen/corona-impfsto... I don't know if there are more factories...?

dogma1138 6y ago

Some American factories are export restricted, Pfizer has set up production in the US which is cleared for export as they didn’t took any government funding for those production lines. Israel is getting most of their doses from US factories not EU ones.

jacquesm 6y ago
And pays more than 10x as much per dose.
- dageshi 6y ago
  And that really doesn't matter compared to the cost of locking down a country and the lives saved by quicker vaccination.
  - jacquesm 6y ago
    Agreed. But given the lack of production this was an easier deal to make for Israel than for say all of the EU, no matter what the price, those vaccines are not available in that quantity.
    - dogma1138 6y ago
      Chicken and the egg if the EU would’ve handed out 50 billion € a year ago to setup production and stockpiles it would’ve made a difference...
- dogma1138 6y ago
  Israel is paying about $30 a dose about twice the Pfizer listed price in the US and EU not 10 times more. It’s paying 10 times more when comparing to the AZ vaccine but that’s not apples to apples.
  - jacquesm 6y ago
    https://www.jpost.com/israel-news/the-cost-of-vaccinating-israel-nis-1-billion-655088 https://www.jpost.com/israel-news/the-cost-of-vaccinating-is... says $47 / dose