49 ms·

As I mentioned above, Bitcoins value relative to the dollar is irrelevant, because its value is found in its utility. So long as there are goods and services to

As I mentioned above, Bitcoins value relative to the dollar is irrelevant, because its value is found in its utility. So long as there are goods and services to purchase with Bitcoin (and it seems very difficult for a government to stop such services from existing), the utility of the currency remains valuable, regardless of its exchange rate to the dollar. EDIT: The fact that government would have a very difficult time shutting down the Bitcoin economy is yet another example of its utility and value.

scott_s 15y ago
Utility for what. If things have real, actual value, then they can be exchanged for dollars, even if it's only on the black market. We don't mean there has to be an official exchange rate between bitcoins and dollars. We mean there has to be someone willing to say "I'll give you X USD for Y bitcoins" even if that's just under the table. If no one is willing to do that, then bitcoins have no value. What I, and others, are saying is that in the future, no such people will exist. Our prediction is that the current bitcoin economy is transient and will eventually vanish. Hence, we say bitcoins have no value. It's similar to saying that a particular stock has no value if you think that that particular company will collapse.
- icarus_drowning 15y ago
  *there has to be someone willing to say "I'll give you X USD for Y bitcoins" Not really. They have to be willing to say "I'll give you X thing that you value in exchange for Y bitcoins." The entire point is that the design of bitcoin makes that scenario likely to always be true precisely because it is nearly impossible to stop. As I said above, the very fact that it represents a system that is very difficult for state actors to attack ensures that it will almost certainly be used for exchanging goods and services that governments would rather not exist. Not a terribly noble future, perhaps, but certainly one that ensures bitcoins have value.
  - scott_s 15y ago
    If people are willing to trade goods for it, then someone will be willing to trade dollars for it (or yen, euros, or any established currency). For a reason that I am unaware of, you seem to think that just because something can be traded it will be traded. That's not true. People tend to only trade things that are readily exchangeable in the larger economy - things that have value.

scott_s 15y ago

Utility for what. If things have real, actual value, then they can be exchanged for dollars, even if it's only on the black market. We don't mean there has to be an official exchange rate between bitcoins and dollars. We mean there has to be someone willing to say "I'll give you X USD for Y bitcoins" even if that's just under the table. If no one is willing to do that, then bitcoins have no value. What I, and others, are saying is that in the future, no such people will exist. Our prediction is that the current bitcoin economy is transient and will eventually vanish. Hence, we say bitcoins have no value. It's similar to saying that a particular stock has no value if you think that that particular company will collapse.

icarus_drowning 15y ago
*there has to be someone willing to say "I'll give you X USD for Y bitcoins" Not really. They have to be willing to say "I'll give you X thing that you value in exchange for Y bitcoins." The entire point is that the design of bitcoin makes that scenario likely to always be true precisely because it is nearly impossible to stop. As I said above, the very fact that it represents a system that is very difficult for state actors to attack ensures that it will almost certainly be used for exchanging goods and services that governments would rather not exist. Not a terribly noble future, perhaps, but certainly one that ensures bitcoins have value.
- scott_s 15y ago
  If people are willing to trade goods for it, then someone will be willing to trade dollars for it (or yen, euros, or any established currency). For a reason that I am unaware of, you seem to think that just because something can be traded it will be traded. That's not true. People tend to only trade things that are readily exchangeable in the larger economy - things that have value.