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Grocery costs don't vary nearly as much regionally as housing, and also are not as significant a percentage of household budget, so that makes sense. Personall

Grocery costs don't vary nearly as much regionally as housing, and also are not as significant a percentage of household budget, so that makes sense. Personally I find grocery shopping quite affordable, as I'm sure do most in the HN demographic. However the rate of people experiencing food insecurity in the US was around 12% prior to the pandemic, which shows that grocery costs are a serious concern for many. People in that group, which has expanded this year, do not have the option to increase their grocery budget in proportion to price inflation.

jrochkind1 6y ago
It's definitely true that lower-income people spend a higher percentage of their income on groceries. But it's also true that the % of income spent on groceries on average has been dropping over time. Groceries may have made more sense as a metric when the CPI was invented than they do now. "Between 1960 and 1998, the average share of disposable personal income spent on total food by Americans, on average, fell from 17.0 to 10.1 percent" https://www.ers.usda.gov/data-products/chart-gallery/gallery/chart-detail/?chartId=76967 https://www.ers.usda.gov/data-products/chart-gallery/gallery...
- nsomaru 6y ago
  How does the growth and concentration of wealth in the hands of billionaires affect that data? An average doesn’t seem like a reliable stat in this context.
  - jrochkind1 6y ago
    I don't think relatively few billionaries would effect this kind of average much mathematically. But I'm not really sure how they calculate this number in the first place, the USDA page's only citation is "for more information contact", which is kind of lame. It seems likely that it's based on a survey sample though. It makes sense to me though; we have whole categories of expense that our grandparents just didn't have, they had a lot less stuff than we have. But they needed about the same number of calories. (On the other hand, I bet average % of income spent on rent has gone up...) Apparently Americans also spend less % of income on food than most other countries, which is kind of odd. https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2015/03/02/389578089/your-grandparents-spent-more-of-their-money-on-food-than-you-do https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2015/03/02/389578089/yo... For this discussion, the reason it matters that less % of income is spent on groceries -- is that it makes a CPI based on groceries not as good a metric of relative buying power overall.
chiefalchemist 6y ago
Grocery costs are a concern? Perhaps. But I'd say that's driven by housing costs. That is, you can skip meals but a least (or property taxes) is a non-toggling commitment. When in doubt, the rent gets paid. There's also the cost of healthcare, or the financial repercussion of not having coverage. People are food insecure. It's freightening. But the root issue is more than food.

jrochkind1 6y ago

It's definitely true that lower-income people spend a higher percentage of their income on groceries. But it's also true that the % of income spent on groceries on average has been dropping over time. Groceries may have made more sense as a metric when the CPI was invented than they do now. "Between 1960 and 1998, the average share of disposable personal income spent on total food by Americans, on average, fell from 17.0 to 10.1 percent" https://www.ers.usda.gov/data-products/chart-gallery/gallery/chart-detail/?chartId=76967 https://www.ers.usda.gov/data-products/chart-gallery/gallery...

nsomaru 6y ago
How does the growth and concentration of wealth in the hands of billionaires affect that data? An average doesn’t seem like a reliable stat in this context.
- jrochkind1 6y ago
  I don't think relatively few billionaries would effect this kind of average much mathematically. But I'm not really sure how they calculate this number in the first place, the USDA page's only citation is "for more information contact", which is kind of lame. It seems likely that it's based on a survey sample though. It makes sense to me though; we have whole categories of expense that our grandparents just didn't have, they had a lot less stuff than we have. But they needed about the same number of calories. (On the other hand, I bet average % of income spent on rent has gone up...) Apparently Americans also spend less % of income on food than most other countries, which is kind of odd. https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2015/03/02/389578089/your-grandparents-spent-more-of-their-money-on-food-than-you-do https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2015/03/02/389578089/yo... For this discussion, the reason it matters that less % of income is spent on groceries -- is that it makes a CPI based on groceries not as good a metric of relative buying power overall.

chiefalchemist 6y ago

Grocery costs are a concern? Perhaps. But I'd say that's driven by housing costs. That is, you can skip meals but a least (or property taxes) is a non-toggling commitment. When in doubt, the rent gets paid. There's also the cost of healthcare, or the financial repercussion of not having coverage. People are food insecure. It's freightening. But the root issue is more than food.