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It is fine to break stuff even if it is popular as it doesn't achieve the overall objective. There's no compulsion to allow something just because it is popular

It is fine to break stuff even if it is popular as it doesn't achieve the overall objective. There's no compulsion to allow something just because it is popular.

gruez 6y ago
In the context of this discussion (blocking at enterprises), I doubt any sysadmin is going to be able to convince the leadership that blocking all google services is an acceptable trade-off. If you're doing the blocking yourself on your own network then sure whatever, you don't really care whether google stuff breaks, but you probably also have safebrowsing disabled, or know how to whitelist the safebrowsing endpoint yourself if you need it, so the whitelist argument isn't relevant in that context.
- tchalla 6y ago
  > In the context of this discussion (blocking at enterprises), I doubt any sysadmin is going to be able to convince the leadership that blocking all google services is an acceptable trade-off. If that was the case, here was the original comment. > Apple servers are whitelisted in adblocking and firewall APIs What exactly did you disagree with?
tialaramex 6y ago
Nope. Mother Nature doesn't have to care whether her rules are popular, the laws of thermodynamics are actually very unpopular, but they apply anyway. However people can disobey our laws and so if they aren't popular enough they're worthless. The UK used to have laws controlling the ownership of dogs. Each dog required a license, licenses were taxed and you could be refused a license. But that law was very unpopular, and so it was abolished - not because licensing dog ownership wasn't a good idea, but because even if it was a great idea it was too unpopular to succeed.
- tchalla 6y ago
  > Mother Nature doesn't have to care whether her rules are popular, the laws of thermodynamics are actually very unpopular, but they apply anyway. I am pretty sure whitelisting servers don't follow the laws of Thermodynamics or nature.
  - 8note 6y ago
    They certainly follow both. Require energy to run and give off heat energy as waste
    - tchalla 6y ago
      And those laws have no effect on what should be whitelisted and what shouldn't. Let's not argue for the sake of arguing. The aim is to not debate but move the discussion forward. I don't see that happening.
- 8note 6y ago
  The laws of thermodynamics are incredibly popular. The explanation they provide for the ticking of time, and how they enable us to produce incredibly efficient systems is fantastic. Without the human invention of entropy, we'd have no clue why our perpetual motion machines aren't working. For the mechanics those laws describe, they're great too. Pretty sure there would be constant unwanted explosions everywhere if energy could keep transforming in any way where it's conserved. I like that my table doesn't decide to be a bomb at random

It is fine to break stuff even if it is popular as it doesn't achieve the overall objective. There's no compulsion to allow something just because it is popular.

gruez 6y ago

In the context of this discussion (blocking at enterprises), I doubt any sysadmin is going to be able to convince the leadership that blocking all google services is an acceptable trade-off. If you're doing the blocking yourself on your own network then sure whatever, you don't really care whether google stuff breaks, but you probably also have safebrowsing disabled, or know how to whitelist the safebrowsing endpoint yourself if you need it, so the whitelist argument isn't relevant in that context.

tchalla 6y ago
> In the context of this discussion (blocking at enterprises), I doubt any sysadmin is going to be able to convince the leadership that blocking all google services is an acceptable trade-off. If that was the case, here was the original comment. > Apple servers are whitelisted in adblocking and firewall APIs What exactly did you disagree with?

tialaramex 6y ago

Nope. Mother Nature doesn't have to care whether her rules are popular, the laws of thermodynamics are actually very unpopular, but they apply anyway. However people can disobey our laws and so if they aren't popular enough they're worthless. The UK used to have laws controlling the ownership of dogs. Each dog required a license, licenses were taxed and you could be refused a license. But that law was very unpopular, and so it was abolished - not because licensing dog ownership wasn't a good idea, but because even if it was a great idea it was too unpopular to succeed.

tchalla 6y ago
> Mother Nature doesn't have to care whether her rules are popular, the laws of thermodynamics are actually very unpopular, but they apply anyway. I am pretty sure whitelisting servers don't follow the laws of Thermodynamics or nature.
- 8note 6y ago
  They certainly follow both. Require energy to run and give off heat energy as waste
  - tchalla 6y ago
    And those laws have no effect on what should be whitelisted and what shouldn't. Let's not argue for the sake of arguing. The aim is to not debate but move the discussion forward. I don't see that happening.
8note 6y ago
The laws of thermodynamics are incredibly popular. The explanation they provide for the ticking of time, and how they enable us to produce incredibly efficient systems is fantastic. Without the human invention of entropy, we'd have no clue why our perpetual motion machines aren't working. For the mechanics those laws describe, they're great too. Pretty sure there would be constant unwanted explosions everywhere if energy could keep transforming in any way where it's conserved. I like that my table doesn't decide to be a bomb at random