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> I don't evade taxes, so you're welcome to my surplus. The taxes were already accounted for, my claim is on top of what you already contributed. > By all mea
by chordalkeyboard 6y ago
> I don't evade taxes, so you're welcome to my surplus.
The taxes were already accounted for, my claim is on top of what you already contributed.
> By all means, please expound upon the victims of violence caused by taxpaying in modern day America.
Its all very simple, if you don’t give them what they want, they threaten you at first and then they come take what they want.
> Are you referring to
This isn’t helpful.
> Then you'll have to provide your alternative to taxation,
Its the same as my alternative to rape. Namely, abolition.
> and indeed your alternative to governments or societies, as those can't really exist beyond taxes, at least until we achieve a post-scarcity society.
I thought you were familiar with alternative viewpoints? When you put out a fire, what do you replace it with? If your society is dependent on violence and coercion, then perhaps your society shouldn’t exist.
> Incidentally, I should note that being against the principle of taxation not only precludes income taxes, but sales taxes and other consumption taxes, property taxes, estate taxes, tariffs, public tolls.
Don’t stop there, I’m also opposed to bank robbery, grand theft auto, petty theft, burglary, larceny, fraud, theft by conversion, and rapine. You get a lot for your trouble when you give up aggressive violence.
> you would call it theft and thus NASA would continue to go unfunded.
I’m fine with NASA relying on voluntary sources of funding and ceasing to extort the working class.
> "Taxation is theft" is a meme well-known to the internet, and this conversation we are having has been repeated over and over uncountable times. Neither of us represent original ideas. We are just rehashing the same unanswerable debate many men have had before us.
If you think the debate is unanswerable then perhaps you would enjoy something else more. For my part, the only way to find an answer is to have the debate. Furthermore in my experience these debates tend to get derailed by people pattern-matching their interlocutor’s response to something they feel more comfortable responding to and in the process eliding nuanced arguments in favor of rehashing things that haven’t even been mentioned. Either “taxation is theft” or “taxation is not theft” (or some more compicated relation between ‘taxation’ and ‘theft’), but in no case does “‘taxation is theft’ is a libertarian idea” get use closer to a resolution.
> memoization can be a way to expedite a solution.
I’ll look, thanks.
- Apocryphon 6y ago> The taxes were already accounted for, my claim is on top of what you already contributed. Not according to you, as you view taxes as inherently illegitimate. Though if you have a Patreon or GoFundMe to validate your claim then by all means. > Its all very simple, if you don’t give them what they want, they threaten you at first and then they come take what they want. If you don't wear clothes, you'd be arrested for public indecency. > You get a lot for your trouble when you give up aggressive violence. Tell it to the Iroquois, sadly. > If your society is dependent on violence and coercion, then perhaps your society shouldn’t exist. Then say you don't believe in society. > You get a lot for your trouble when you give up aggressive violence. Then why not give away property, as well? There are arguments to be made that private property violates the NAP. > For my part, the only way to find an answer is to have the debate. There really isn't an answer to be had in a debate, because fundamentally both sides are operating from stances so alien from one another to essentially be in different languages. "Taxation is theft" and "taxation is not theft" is not really meaningful in this context, as there is no agreed upon definition of what theft is. Despite its unanswerable nature, it is still quite enjoyable.
- chordalkeyboard 6y ago> Not according to you, as you view taxes as inherently illegitimate. Though if you have a Patreon or GoFundMe to validate your claim then by all means. I’m responding to taxes the way you responded to my request for some of your surplus. You’re asserting you already paid taxes, you don’t get to decide how much tax you pay. > If you don't wear clothes, you'd be arrested for public indecency. I concede that laws requiring clothing are akin to taxation in that one group of people imposes their values on another group without their consent. > Then say you don't believe in society. I’m fine with society, I disagree with you that taxation is necessary for society. > Then why not give away property, as well? There are arguments to be made that private property violates the NAP. Property is a consequence of animalian territorial instincts and human tool-using instincts. If someone can articulate a coherent vision of a property-less society, others are welcome to join them. Mostly the problem is that the people who challenge notions of property rights seem to be motivated by the prospect of obtaining the property of others who would prefer to retain it. In essence, they don’t have a problem with property, but with certain people’s ownership of certain things because they would rather that other people own those same things. > Despite its unanswerable nature, it is still quite enjoyable. Glad you’re enjoying it and likewise.