6 ms·

re 4) - this is what Tesla does a lot :( In Model3 you can move front passenger seat forward and up (to clean up in the back) all the way to the point when it

by pound 6y ago

re 4) - this is what Tesla does a lot :( In Model3 you can move front passenger seat forward and up (to clean up in the back) all the way to the point when it pushes on sun visor and cracks the mirror in it. Just by using handles intended to move the seat, no manual pressure or anything, there are no limitation on how far it goes and it's strong enough.. Tesla service centers blame owners for that and charge full replacement cost for the visor :\

jbob2000 6y ago
Haha, if you think that's bad, try driving a jeep. You don't even have to drive it for it to break!
- TheSpiceIsLife 6y ago
  "There's only one Jeep" because all the others fell apart.
- camjohnson26 6y ago
  My jeep has 60k miles and never any issues
  - fl0wenol 6y ago
    Even as an anecdote, that's not impressive.
    - camjohnson26 6y ago
      Ok? Counter example to “breaks even if you don’t drive it”
    - dylan604 6y ago
      It is for a Jeep though
- SigmundA 6y ago
  My Jeep Wrangler does not have any physical interference issues regarding seats breaking mirrors and the only issue I have had is the rear main seal started leaking and they happily replaced under warranty at 4 years and 6 months no questions asked.
- Foomf 6y ago
  This is exactly my experience with the jeep my family had. However, there's a big caveat: the jeep engine itself was perfect. Over the 15 or so years we had it, that engine was solid. Everything else in the jeep failed at some point or another, and had nothing to do with driving. I have a few examples off the top of my head: The heated seats died after a few months. The insides of the car doors became detached because the glue wasn't strong enough. One by one the dashboard knobs all split apart at one point or another. We were a normal family, there were no crazy kids or pets in it that went nuts on the inside. Our jeep just kind of disintegrated around us, and none of the problems had to do with actually driving the jeep. So yes, we didn't even need to drive it for it to fall apart.
  - sokoloff 6y ago
    The 4.0 liter L6 was a great engine. The 5.2/5.9 liter V8 was almost exactly the opposite of that.
walrus01 6y ago
Just out of morbid curiosity, what does this visor cost to replace? I'm guessing $299
- pound 6y ago
  Actually it wasn't too expensive - something like half of that (I don't remember exact number, but mid-100s). It was more of a feeling that I shouldn't be paying for it at all that displeased me :( (and reddit is full of stories when it happened with others (with the same service centers' experience))
  - pound 6y ago
    One more thing that has no solution now but I'm sure Tesla will not fix it at all or will charge a lot for it: White interior and black seatbelts. Despite Musks's promises how durable white interior is, seatbelts they use are dyed with I don't know what and they mar the seats. It's permanently baked in and cannot be removed.. Tesla responded long time ago that they are looking for solution, but whatever they will change will definitely not apply to any existing (screwed-up) white interior owners.
    - adamcstephens 6y ago
      Musk really said the white interior is durable? Maybe they got a deal on white material and wanted to sucker people into buying it.
      - pound 6y ago
        Tbh, it actually is okay. After about two years most prominent marks we have on them are those left by seatbelts.
buran77 6y ago
One thing people don't understand about cost saving is that it almost always looks good in the short term. You save a lot of money by using commercial grade parts (like eMMC, the dashboard screen, etc.), or by hiring SW and HW engineers who have never worked in the automotive or embedded environment. It's sacrificing quality for quantity and price. But it's usually the customers who pay for it all, one way or another. From Tesla's perspective the bet might have payed off, by the time this becomes an actual problem for them, they're already over the hump and weathered the worst of times, and can afford to spec them better (one would hope they learned something from this although I have my doubts). In reality probably the real reason this worked for Tesla is Musk's ability to build a fanatical fanbase that can drown out any other voice.
- pound 6y ago
  Funny thing is while I was okay with buying Tesla, it was Musk's personality attached to it that really bugged me.. So while there is a (quite loud) fanbase, there is also a group of potential Tesla owners who may go other route just due to desire to not be associated with "meme king"
  - onethought 6y ago
    The (actual) founders of Tesla are much more interesting and compelling than Elon in this regard
  - buran77 6y ago
    The idea was that there is a critical mass of people which are vocal enough to help Musk push Tesla's public image past any blunder. No other car manufacturer has this kind of clout.
    - throwaway0a5e 6y ago
      >No other car manufacturer has this kind of clout. Toyota does. Though they did put out ~20yr of great cars (emphasis on cars) to get that.
toddmorey 6y ago
That's really disappointing to hear. I've owned a Model S since before the Model 3 arrived and have always fretted that the level of service I received wasn't sustainable at scale. They AGGRESSIVELY attacked any problems and replaced parts, even when that's not what I asked for. It's kinda nuts. Just the things I can remember: - All 4 door handles were replaced with newer versions - I complained about a corner of stitching on the driver's seat and got an entirely new driver's seat - Glovebox cover replaced (to address latch) - Steering wheel controls replaced - Driver display unit replaced entirely - Sunroof replaced Granted, that's A LOT of parts to address, but their attitude was we'll do anything to make it right. Never once pushed back or questioned. Usually told me that they wanted to replace the part (rather than fix) because Tesla had engineered an improved version. And, to their credit, the new parts they put in seemed to have meaningful improvements and have worked really well.
- andykellr 6y ago
  As a 2013 Model S owner and now a 2018 and 2021 Model 3 owner (Tesla only family), I agree 100%. I assumed there were a few reasons for the Model S service I received: 1. Small scale 2. Desire to keep early adopters happy 3. 2x the cost of the Model 3 However, my Model 3 service has been really poor. In my new 2021 the charge port bolt was loose and wouldn't charge. Known issue that took several days and many phone calls to get fixed while traveling. Eventually a service manager got involved and the fix took 5 minutes. Then they installed Homelink and forgot to plug the front sensors back in. Full self-driving was unavailable for 3 weeks until they returned to plug in the sensors. Also ordered snow tires from Tesla and the TPMS sensors don't work in my car (2021 uses BLE sensors). They're ordering new sensors and I will need to take my wheels to a tire store to have them installed. It's been less than 2 months since I took delivery. Love the car, love the company, an enthusiastic shareholder, but service needs to be fixed.
  - camjohnson26 6y ago
    “Love the car, but” has become a Tesla quality issue meme at this point.

by pound 6y ago

jbob2000 6y ago

Haha, if you think that's bad, try driving a jeep. You don't even have to drive it for it to break!

TheSpiceIsLife 6y ago
"There's only one Jeep" because all the others fell apart.
camjohnson26 6y ago
My jeep has 60k miles and never any issues
- fl0wenol 6y ago
  Even as an anecdote, that's not impressive.
  - camjohnson26 6y ago
    Ok? Counter example to “breaks even if you don’t drive it”
  - dylan604 6y ago
    It is for a Jeep though
SigmundA 6y ago
My Jeep Wrangler does not have any physical interference issues regarding seats breaking mirrors and the only issue I have had is the rear main seal started leaking and they happily replaced under warranty at 4 years and 6 months no questions asked.
Foomf 6y ago
This is exactly my experience with the jeep my family had. However, there's a big caveat: the jeep engine itself was perfect. Over the 15 or so years we had it, that engine was solid. Everything else in the jeep failed at some point or another, and had nothing to do with driving. I have a few examples off the top of my head: The heated seats died after a few months. The insides of the car doors became detached because the glue wasn't strong enough. One by one the dashboard knobs all split apart at one point or another. We were a normal family, there were no crazy kids or pets in it that went nuts on the inside. Our jeep just kind of disintegrated around us, and none of the problems had to do with actually driving the jeep. So yes, we didn't even need to drive it for it to fall apart.
- sokoloff 6y ago
  The 4.0 liter L6 was a great engine. The 5.2/5.9 liter V8 was almost exactly the opposite of that.

walrus01 6y ago

Just out of morbid curiosity, what does this visor cost to replace? I'm guessing $299

pound 6y ago
Actually it wasn't too expensive - something like half of that (I don't remember exact number, but mid-100s). It was more of a feeling that I shouldn't be paying for it at all that displeased me :( (and reddit is full of stories when it happened with others (with the same service centers' experience))
- pound 6y ago
  One more thing that has no solution now but I'm sure Tesla will not fix it at all or will charge a lot for it: White interior and black seatbelts. Despite Musks's promises how durable white interior is, seatbelts they use are dyed with I don't know what and they mar the seats. It's permanently baked in and cannot be removed.. Tesla responded long time ago that they are looking for solution, but whatever they will change will definitely not apply to any existing (screwed-up) white interior owners.
  - adamcstephens 6y ago
    Musk really said the white interior is durable? Maybe they got a deal on white material and wanted to sucker people into buying it.
    - pound 6y ago
      Tbh, it actually is okay. After about two years most prominent marks we have on them are those left by seatbelts.

buran77 6y ago

One thing people don't understand about cost saving is that it almost always looks good in the short term. You save a lot of money by using commercial grade parts (like eMMC, the dashboard screen, etc.), or by hiring SW and HW engineers who have never worked in the automotive or embedded environment. It's sacrificing quality for quantity and price. But it's usually the customers who pay for it all, one way or another. From Tesla's perspective the bet might have payed off, by the time this becomes an actual problem for them, they're already over the hump and weathered the worst of times, and can afford to spec them better (one would hope they learned something from this although I have my doubts). In reality probably the real reason this worked for Tesla is Musk's ability to build a fanatical fanbase that can drown out any other voice.

pound 6y ago
Funny thing is while I was okay with buying Tesla, it was Musk's personality attached to it that really bugged me.. So while there is a (quite loud) fanbase, there is also a group of potential Tesla owners who may go other route just due to desire to not be associated with "meme king"
- onethought 6y ago
  The (actual) founders of Tesla are much more interesting and compelling than Elon in this regard
- buran77 6y ago
  The idea was that there is a critical mass of people which are vocal enough to help Musk push Tesla's public image past any blunder. No other car manufacturer has this kind of clout.
  - throwaway0a5e 6y ago
    >No other car manufacturer has this kind of clout. Toyota does. Though they did put out ~20yr of great cars (emphasis on cars) to get that.

toddmorey 6y ago

That's really disappointing to hear. I've owned a Model S since before the Model 3 arrived and have always fretted that the level of service I received wasn't sustainable at scale. They AGGRESSIVELY attacked any problems and replaced parts, even when that's not what I asked for. It's kinda nuts. Just the things I can remember: - All 4 door handles were replaced with newer versions - I complained about a corner of stitching on the driver's seat and got an entirely new driver's seat - Glovebox cover replaced (to address latch) - Steering wheel controls replaced - Driver display unit replaced entirely - Sunroof replaced Granted, that's A LOT of parts to address, but their attitude was we'll do anything to make it right. Never once pushed back or questioned. Usually told me that they wanted to replace the part (rather than fix) because Tesla had engineered an improved version. And, to their credit, the new parts they put in seemed to have meaningful improvements and have worked really well.

andykellr 6y ago
As a 2013 Model S owner and now a 2018 and 2021 Model 3 owner (Tesla only family), I agree 100%. I assumed there were a few reasons for the Model S service I received: 1. Small scale 2. Desire to keep early adopters happy 3. 2x the cost of the Model 3 However, my Model 3 service has been really poor. In my new 2021 the charge port bolt was loose and wouldn't charge. Known issue that took several days and many phone calls to get fixed while traveling. Eventually a service manager got involved and the fix took 5 minutes. Then they installed Homelink and forgot to plug the front sensors back in. Full self-driving was unavailable for 3 weeks until they returned to plug in the sensors. Also ordered snow tires from Tesla and the TPMS sensors don't work in my car (2021 uses BLE sensors). They're ordering new sensors and I will need to take my wheels to a tire store to have them installed. It's been less than 2 months since I took delivery. Love the car, love the company, an enthusiastic shareholder, but service needs to be fixed.
- camjohnson26 6y ago
  “Love the car, but” has become a Tesla quality issue meme at this point.