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This is why I generally support universal basic income if it could replace the US safety net. Currently we spend more than it would take to eliminate poverty if

This is why I generally support universal basic income if it could replace the US safety net. Currently we spend more than it would take to eliminate poverty if we just gave it away. But the beauracratic machine just destroys so much wealth.

abfan1127 6y ago
> the bureaucratic machine just destroys so much wealth that can be said enough!
chadash 6y ago
Do you have numbers? How much do we spend eliminating poverty? And how much would we spend on universal income? Assuming 200 million adults get universal income, that would cost $1 trillion per $5,000 of income. But $5000 hardly gets you out of poverty.
- Dma54rhs 6y ago
  I suppose the question is does it mean people don't flock them to em super expensive overcrowded cities if they get UBI. I don't have an answer to it personally.
- rjmunro 6y ago
  Normally Universal basic income plans are combined with abolition of most other welfare, and changes to taxes so that people on all but the lowest incomes end up paying the money back as tax. So maybe flatten all tax rates below 24%, everyone earning more than $80000 is now paying an extra $6000, but you give that back to them as the UBI. Everyone earning less than $80000 pays more tax than before but still gets $6000 UBI, so is better off.
adolph 6y ago
the beauracratic machine just destroys so much wealth In theory I sympathize with the sentiment, but 1) the dole is not wealth 2) the administration costs of the dole don't make money disappear, its just routed into income for the admin workers, 3) the administration costs of the dole do not necessarily decrease with UBI and might increase given a larger population to administer. I generally do not support UBI since the key problem isn't cash in people's pockets, it is lack of engagement with society in ways that add value. UBI papers over the core problem.

abfan1127 6y ago

> the bureaucratic machine just destroys so much wealth that can be said enough!

chadash 6y ago

Do you have numbers? How much do we spend eliminating poverty? And how much would we spend on universal income? Assuming 200 million adults get universal income, that would cost $1 trillion per $5,000 of income. But $5000 hardly gets you out of poverty.

Dma54rhs 6y ago
I suppose the question is does it mean people don't flock them to em super expensive overcrowded cities if they get UBI. I don't have an answer to it personally.
rjmunro 6y ago
Normally Universal basic income plans are combined with abolition of most other welfare, and changes to taxes so that people on all but the lowest incomes end up paying the money back as tax. So maybe flatten all tax rates below 24%, everyone earning more than $80000 is now paying an extra $6000, but you give that back to them as the UBI. Everyone earning less than $80000 pays more tax than before but still gets $6000 UBI, so is better off.

adolph 6y ago

the beauracratic machine just destroys so much wealth In theory I sympathize with the sentiment, but 1) the dole is not wealth 2) the administration costs of the dole don't make money disappear, its just routed into income for the admin workers, 3) the administration costs of the dole do not necessarily decrease with UBI and might increase given a larger population to administer. I generally do not support UBI since the key problem isn't cash in people's pockets, it is lack of engagement with society in ways that add value. UBI papers over the core problem.