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I bought an expensive Dyson air purifier for a couple of reasons. It has a remote so I can turn it on from bed. It looks attractive. The sound profile is much d

I bought an expensive Dyson air purifier for a couple of reasons. It has a remote so I can turn it on from bed. It looks attractive. The sound profile is much different than a box fan for sleeping at night. It can analyze the temperature, humidity, and air quality in real time and turn on if it notices air quality is getting bad. It also oscillates. That said yes it was expensive, but it replaced needing a fan for cooling and an air purifier, and if I needed a heater it could have done triple duty.

rconti 6y ago
It's obviously popular to hate on silly-expensive tech, but these quotes were telling for me: > "I think what we're trying to do is pull back a little bit from the CADR metric," he said. "Not everyone needs an enormous CADR, has huge rooms or incredibly dirty air." > Several experts told Marketplace the CADR is the most important metric and an internationally recognized benchmark. > "CADR is what you want to know, period," said Francis (Bud) Offermann, an indoor air quality researcher who has helped develop test methods for the performance of portable air cleaners with the American Association of Home Appliance Manufacturers (AHAM). CADR may well be "what you want to know, period" when it come to air filtration. However it might NOT be all you want to know when buying a consumer product. If the filter is quiet and effective and good looking and only ramps up when needed, is this not in some ways a better PRODUCT than a box fan running at full speed all the time with a filter taped to it?
- steve_adams_86 6y ago
  Yeah, it felt a bit like me (a software developer) recommending to someone to use Google Cloud for their blog infrastructure rather than some basic one-size-fits-most solution that may or may not meet their needs forever. These people come from civil engineering backgrounds where air filtration requirements might often be thought of from an industrial or at least much larger than a domestic/micro loft scale. Having any air filtration at all at a smaller scale is generally just great if you replace filters often enough, don't aren't near industry or aren't in a city, don't cook at home often... Even then, a smaller air purifier's going to do an awesome job if you let it run regularly.
- cowmoo728 6y ago
  I'm also a little suspicious of relying entirely on the CADR metric. If you're running a filter in an environment that's constantly producing particulates and you need to filter large volumes of air, it seems useful. If you're about to walk into a smoke filled room and have 25 minutes to clean the air first, there's no question that CADR is king. I think it would be interesting to run a purifier in a normal house for 48 hours and see what the steady state particulate levels settle at around the house. I would guess that over a certain threshold CADR, there might not be that much difference. Room air circulation combined with a good enough CADR might even be more important, which is what Dyson claims. For all the people in the bay area worried about the next fire season, CADR is probably the most important since there's an extreme source of particulates. I'm just not sure that's the final say on air purifier effectiveness in less extreme conditions.
  - bluGill 6y ago
    I'm more worried about the random friend who drops by. Sure we wear a mask, but when can we take it off when they are gone?
    - Bakary 6y ago
      You have to make sure the filter is HEPA, and calculate whether the device has had the time to do a full air change given the room size and its CADR rating. Viruses are generally too small for even the best filters, but the droplets that carry them are well within what a HEPA filter can manage.
      - Maursault 6y ago
        > Viruses are generally too small for even the best filters... The average diameter of coronavirus particles is around 0.12 μm. The diameter of the envelope is 0.08 μm and the spikes are 0.02 μm long. A P100 HEPA filter will remove as much as 99.97% (for P95 it is 95%) of all airborne particulates with an aerodynamic diameter of 0.3 μm, and particles both larger and smaller are removed with an efficiency greater than 99.97%. Even if viruses are smaller than 0.3 μm, they are an easy target for HEPA filters.
- pfortuny 6y ago
  Exactly. Like dB. Same as "processor speed is all that matters"... well, not. I honestly would gladly pay more for a QUIET computer (they are become more available).
- unreal37 6y ago
  I own this Dyson, and like it. It has a remote. Works from an app on my phone. It has a heater and a fan. It monitors the air quality which is usually fine. The "filter" is the least interesting part to me.
kelvie 6y ago
We're also in the same boat. It's something that stays out all the time. It's just unsightly to keep a box fan filter out all the time (we used one when we first moved out, and man, the back of the filter gets disgusting). Looks do matter, and at least for our decor, there isn't really much choice. We pick our furniture based on how it mathes our interior decor, why would an air purifier be any different if it's out and on all the time?
- ska 6y ago
  I suspect the answer here isn't "replace your dyson with a box fan and bungie cords" but - if you care about air filtration, buy a cheaper more effective one that looks ok. It's not surprising a 3-in-1 product isn't very good at (at least) 1 of those functions.
ListenLinda 6y ago
Compare to your furnace (on fan mode) + air filter ... > It has a remote Check > It looks attractive Check. It's invisible. > sound profile Check. Furnace fans are in the garage. > analyze the temperature, humidity, and air quality Nope. But purpleair will sell it to your for $175. > oscillates Check. Covers entire flat.
- post_break 6y ago
  Check your electric bill vs running a fan all night.
- casion 6y ago
  Uh, mine doesn't have s remote, It's visible in living space, loud and doesn't effectively circulate all rooms. I suspect that you're fairly lucky.
- tallanvor 6y ago
  Many people who live in apartments don't have furnaces.
- efreak 6y ago
  White I agree with everything else, a furnace/ac does _not_ oscillate. It's fixed. You can adjust the vents to aim them, but you cannot make them push air to every part of the room on a rotating basis. Having said that, oscillating fans annoy me because the degree of rotation is almost never controllable. I have very rarely seen fans with a clip underneath that causes the rotation to reverse direction.
ACow_Adonis 6y ago
Disclaimer: Own the dyson cool-tower thingy, not the heat/cool one (as it didn't seem worth the money IMO). It was $200-$300 cheaper iirc. It does seem that they're comparing apples to oranges. Of course if you optimise for one metric ignoring the trade-offs and extra features: fixed air flow for a single given particulate removal measure, the cheapest solution that arrives at and maximises that metric is going to come out on top. But if you consider: - Hepa vs Merv - Additional carbon filter - Remote control - Multiple pivot options - Multiple power options - In built sensors and real-time reporting for small particles, large particles, no2, volatile organics, temperature and humidity - smaller horizontal footprint - Smartphone integration + remote operation - noise footprint then "shock", you have to pay more to have those features! (and they do provide value). Dyson certainly offers "I like to burn my money" options like many other companies, and they're not priced cheaply, but it's dishonest to review a sports car and a utility van on the metric of boot space and proclaim a "one little trick they don't want you to know about" type headline. Also, I haven't seen anyone else tackle it: what the hell is up with this "corona-virus protection" hints and claims in this article? Is that not enough to set off most people's internal alarms that the article is quackery?
pugworthy 6y ago
What I don't see anywhere in there is whether it's effective at filtering air.

rconti 6y ago

It's obviously popular to hate on silly-expensive tech, but these quotes were telling for me: > "I think what we're trying to do is pull back a little bit from the CADR metric," he said. "Not everyone needs an enormous CADR, has huge rooms or incredibly dirty air." > Several experts told Marketplace the CADR is the most important metric and an internationally recognized benchmark. > "CADR is what you want to know, period," said Francis (Bud) Offermann, an indoor air quality researcher who has helped develop test methods for the performance of portable air cleaners with the American Association of Home Appliance Manufacturers (AHAM). CADR may well be "what you want to know, period" when it come to air filtration. However it might NOT be all you want to know when buying a consumer product. If the filter is quiet and effective and good looking and only ramps up when needed, is this not in some ways a better PRODUCT than a box fan running at full speed all the time with a filter taped to it?

steve_adams_86 6y ago
Yeah, it felt a bit like me (a software developer) recommending to someone to use Google Cloud for their blog infrastructure rather than some basic one-size-fits-most solution that may or may not meet their needs forever. These people come from civil engineering backgrounds where air filtration requirements might often be thought of from an industrial or at least much larger than a domestic/micro loft scale. Having any air filtration at all at a smaller scale is generally just great if you replace filters often enough, don't aren't near industry or aren't in a city, don't cook at home often... Even then, a smaller air purifier's going to do an awesome job if you let it run regularly.
cowmoo728 6y ago
I'm also a little suspicious of relying entirely on the CADR metric. If you're running a filter in an environment that's constantly producing particulates and you need to filter large volumes of air, it seems useful. If you're about to walk into a smoke filled room and have 25 minutes to clean the air first, there's no question that CADR is king. I think it would be interesting to run a purifier in a normal house for 48 hours and see what the steady state particulate levels settle at around the house. I would guess that over a certain threshold CADR, there might not be that much difference. Room air circulation combined with a good enough CADR might even be more important, which is what Dyson claims. For all the people in the bay area worried about the next fire season, CADR is probably the most important since there's an extreme source of particulates. I'm just not sure that's the final say on air purifier effectiveness in less extreme conditions.
- bluGill 6y ago
  I'm more worried about the random friend who drops by. Sure we wear a mask, but when can we take it off when they are gone?
  - Bakary 6y ago
    You have to make sure the filter is HEPA, and calculate whether the device has had the time to do a full air change given the room size and its CADR rating. Viruses are generally too small for even the best filters, but the droplets that carry them are well within what a HEPA filter can manage.
    - Maursault 6y ago
      > Viruses are generally too small for even the best filters... The average diameter of coronavirus particles is around 0.12 μm. The diameter of the envelope is 0.08 μm and the spikes are 0.02 μm long. A P100 HEPA filter will remove as much as 99.97% (for P95 it is 95%) of all airborne particulates with an aerodynamic diameter of 0.3 μm, and particles both larger and smaller are removed with an efficiency greater than 99.97%. Even if viruses are smaller than 0.3 μm, they are an easy target for HEPA filters.
pfortuny 6y ago
Exactly. Like dB. Same as "processor speed is all that matters"... well, not. I honestly would gladly pay more for a QUIET computer (they are become more available).
unreal37 6y ago
I own this Dyson, and like it. It has a remote. Works from an app on my phone. It has a heater and a fan. It monitors the air quality which is usually fine. The "filter" is the least interesting part to me.

kelvie 6y ago

We're also in the same boat. It's something that stays out all the time. It's just unsightly to keep a box fan filter out all the time (we used one when we first moved out, and man, the back of the filter gets disgusting). Looks do matter, and at least for our decor, there isn't really much choice. We pick our furniture based on how it mathes our interior decor, why would an air purifier be any different if it's out and on all the time?

ska 6y ago
I suspect the answer here isn't "replace your dyson with a box fan and bungie cords" but - if you care about air filtration, buy a cheaper more effective one that looks ok. It's not surprising a 3-in-1 product isn't very good at (at least) 1 of those functions.

ListenLinda 6y ago

Compare to your furnace (on fan mode) + air filter ... > It has a remote Check > It looks attractive Check. It's invisible. > sound profile Check. Furnace fans are in the garage. > analyze the temperature, humidity, and air quality Nope. But purpleair will sell it to your for $175. > oscillates Check. Covers entire flat.

post_break 6y ago
Check your electric bill vs running a fan all night.
casion 6y ago
Uh, mine doesn't have s remote, It's visible in living space, loud and doesn't effectively circulate all rooms. I suspect that you're fairly lucky.
tallanvor 6y ago
Many people who live in apartments don't have furnaces.
efreak 6y ago
White I agree with everything else, a furnace/ac does _not_ oscillate. It's fixed. You can adjust the vents to aim them, but you cannot make them push air to every part of the room on a rotating basis. Having said that, oscillating fans annoy me because the degree of rotation is almost never controllable. I have very rarely seen fans with a clip underneath that causes the rotation to reverse direction.

ACow_Adonis 6y ago

Disclaimer: Own the dyson cool-tower thingy, not the heat/cool one (as it didn't seem worth the money IMO). It was $200-$300 cheaper iirc. It does seem that they're comparing apples to oranges. Of course if you optimise for one metric ignoring the trade-offs and extra features: fixed air flow for a single given particulate removal measure, the cheapest solution that arrives at and maximises that metric is going to come out on top. But if you consider: - Hepa vs Merv - Additional carbon filter - Remote control - Multiple pivot options - Multiple power options - In built sensors and real-time reporting for small particles, large particles, no2, volatile organics, temperature and humidity - smaller horizontal footprint - Smartphone integration + remote operation - noise footprint then "shock", you have to pay more to have those features! (and they do provide value). Dyson certainly offers "I like to burn my money" options like many other companies, and they're not priced cheaply, but it's dishonest to review a sports car and a utility van on the metric of boot space and proclaim a "one little trick they don't want you to know about" type headline. Also, I haven't seen anyone else tackle it: what the hell is up with this "corona-virus protection" hints and claims in this article? Is that not enough to set off most people's internal alarms that the article is quackery?

pugworthy 6y ago

What I don't see anywhere in there is whether it's effective at filtering air.