6 ms·

Behold The Leaked TouchPad--HP's Response To The iPad

33 points by mikecane 15y ago

tgraydar 15y ago
There is tons of smacktalk coming from HP on this. Is the confidence justified? WebOS has plenty of lovers, but iPad's a market share monster. Competition, still, is healthy.
- thesheenamedina 15y ago
  I agree. Competition is healthy but I'm sick of companies trying to jump on a bandwagon just to scrape whatever profit they can. It's so uninspired. It does nothing but clutter the market with things we really don't need. Now, if HP were truly doing something new and innovative, that would be different. But all they're doing here is leaching and creating more trash for landfills.
  - mikelbring 15y ago
    Have you seen WebOS? I find it rather interesting and thinks its better for a tablet than iOS is.
    - CamperBob 15y ago
      Mostly what I'm seeing (watching the video) are what look like garbage-collection hitches, and instances where the demonstrator has to repeatedly hit the same spot on the screen to make something happen. It doesn't look anywhere near as smooth as a first-gen iPad. This stuff matters, as it turns out. As for the rest of the demo, well -- shrug -- it looks like iOS. I tend to agree with the downvoted grandparent: bring something new to the table, or don't waste my time. My guess is that few people other than patent attorneys will end up making any money from this product.
      - smackfu 15y ago
        The task switching is nothing like and far better than iOS. Unless you like that hacky double-tap home thing.
        CamperBob 15y ago
        Well, no, the task-switching UI is better than iOS, I do agree with that. It's perplexing that someone at Apple of all places thought the double-tap home thing was a good idea. In any case, if someone at Apple were to load up on Red Bull and pizza and camp out in their office for a weekend, iOS's task-switcher could look and work exactly the same. They apparently believe they're doing it the right way now, though, for whatever reason.
  - metamatt 15y ago
    I'll echo the other reply to your post -- have you any experience with webOS? I've gone back and forth between webOS and iOS phones over the past couple years, and while webOS is not better in every way, and is significantly handicapped in some ways, it's also significantly better than iOS in some ways. I really don't see webOS phones as poor attempts to jump on a bandwagon just to scrape whatever profit they can. This is much more a case of healthy competition. I too expect Apple will eventually adopt a similar multitasking paradigm for iOS (you could call it Exposé-inspired, or webOS-inspired, as you wish), negating webOS's most obvious advantage. Which you could attribute to the effects of competition. Or maybe Apple would have inevitably done it once the hardware got powerful enough -- who knows.
- r00fus 15y ago
  It doesn't matter how strong Apple is... 2nd place is still profitable, and honeycomb tablets have been pretty lackluster in sales. If HPalm can take a solid niche (better UI than iPad, free-er than Android) and make 2nd place out of it, they will have a sustainable foothold to re-establish the WebOS brand. Apple doesn't have to lose for HP to succeed.
  - cpeterso 15y ago
    HP can also leverage its huge enterprise market to sell Palm enterprise "solutions". Think RIM Blackberry.
- encoderer 15y ago
  My speculation is that relatively few iPads have been sold versus the size of the total market in coming years. They may stay on top but I speculate it'll be like iPhone market share before Android was a real contender. Nearly all the Android tablets that are out now are down-market compared to iPad. This could really shake it up.
  - metamatt 15y ago
    The forces in HP's favor in the tablet market are pretty different from the forces in Android's favor in the phone market. But that said, I agree the tablet market is just heating up. The iPad is a pretty formidable competitor, not just because of its existing market share but really because it's a good product. Still, there's room for more than one product. My impression (from reading press, not from firsthand experience) is that a few Android vendors (notably Samsung and Motorola) and RIM have all stepped up to the plate, took a swing, and pretty much struck out. Maybe they'll get better over time -- probably they will -- but it looks like they shipped too early and quality suffered as a result; the reviews I've read have been largely negative. Meanwhile Microsoft doesn't have anything coming soon. All that means HP has a really good shot at the #2 spot right out of the gate. If that's enough to get developers to return to webOS, the platform might still have a chance.
darrenkopp 15y ago
I was one of the people who waited in line for the Palm Pre on launch day, but I left for android after about a year because of the limited app selection. I've been extremely happy with android, but have always missed how WebOS does multitasking. I'm genuinely excited by the Touchpad and I hope that HP doesn't screw it up.
adolph 15y ago
In the email app demo, the controls at the bottom to hide/reveal the accounts and message lists are pretty nice.
jinushaun 15y ago
People are all over the Tweetie iPad interface. (Sliding stacked split views) The TouchPad email app isn't the only tablet app I've seen that uses that design. Along with pull to refresh, fast scrolling, flick for menu, and many other UX gems, the developer of Tweetie is a genius.
- mikecane 15y ago
  Lacking an iOS device, I've never seen the Tweetie UI. Was it developed before HP showed its multipane email app?
- achompas 15y ago
  The three-column view dates back to NeXT, if I recall correctly. It's a great implementation of the three-column view on touch-based devices, but this is no different... whoa, wait, the columns SLIDE OVER?! Wow...brilliant.
  - tvon 15y ago
    > whoa, wait, the columns SLIDE OVER?! Wow...brilliant. FWIW, that's how Reeder works on OSX (though Reeder is relatively new).
    - achompas 15y ago
      Only on iPad though, right? I have the iPhone version.
      - tvon 15y ago
        I'm referring to the desktop client which came a few months after the iOS version, I haven't used the iPad one myself.
paulnelligan 15y ago
Using your own platform with 2 Giants already out in the market is ballsy to say the least. Another way of putting it would be "not very clever". I'm going with the latter here. Unless WebOS is extremely innovative and porting an app from another platform to this is ridiculously simple, it's surely going to fail.
- smackfu 15y ago
  WebOS apps are Javascript/HTML. So porting from Web to WebOS is the simple thing. https://developer.palm.com/content/resources/develop/building_your_first_app.html https://developer.palm.com/content/resources/develop/buildin...
- DougBTX 15y ago
  Two giants? I'm not sure which you mean. iOS, sure. Microsoft has been in tablets for years, and HP has shrugged them off, rightly as far as Windows goes. It will be interesting once they make a tablet size version of the Metro UI. RIM's PlayBook is just getting started, still waiting for an email client. Android is out, but it doesn't seem to be making much impact. Perhaps once it is good enough for Google to release the source for a wider range of hardware something interesting will come out. So, the second place looks like it Is still up for grabs.
  - paulnelligan 15y ago
    I was referring to Android
- zinkem 15y ago
  >porting an app from another platform to this is ridiculously simple This has been at least a part of the sell. It runs Linux with libSDL, they said they ported the Unreal Engine in about 2 weeks. It also uses gcc, so you could compile Objective-C. http://youtu.be/40ga1lyFPFg http://youtu.be/40ga1lyFPFg
Apocryphon 15y ago
Forget beating the iPad, let's start with the basics- does it beat the Playbook? Can it challenge the Galaxy Tab or other Android tablets?
bitwize 15y ago
Keep chasin them taillights, everyone-else-but-Apple.

33 points by mikecane 15y ago

There is tons of smacktalk coming from HP on this. Is the confidence justified? WebOS has plenty of lovers, but iPad's a market share monster. Competition, still, is healthy.

thesheenamedina 15y ago
I agree. Competition is healthy but I'm sick of companies trying to jump on a bandwagon just to scrape whatever profit they can. It's so uninspired. It does nothing but clutter the market with things we really don't need. Now, if HP were truly doing something new and innovative, that would be different. But all they're doing here is leaching and creating more trash for landfills.
- mikelbring 15y ago
  Have you seen WebOS? I find it rather interesting and thinks its better for a tablet than iOS is.
  - CamperBob 15y ago
    Mostly what I'm seeing (watching the video) are what look like garbage-collection hitches, and instances where the demonstrator has to repeatedly hit the same spot on the screen to make something happen. It doesn't look anywhere near as smooth as a first-gen iPad. This stuff matters, as it turns out. As for the rest of the demo, well -- shrug -- it looks like iOS. I tend to agree with the downvoted grandparent: bring something new to the table, or don't waste my time. My guess is that few people other than patent attorneys will end up making any money from this product.
    - smackfu 15y ago
      The task switching is nothing like and far better than iOS. Unless you like that hacky double-tap home thing.
      - CamperBob 15y ago
        Well, no, the task-switching UI is better than iOS, I do agree with that. It's perplexing that someone at Apple of all places thought the double-tap home thing was a good idea. In any case, if someone at Apple were to load up on Red Bull and pizza and camp out in their office for a weekend, iOS's task-switcher could look and work exactly the same. They apparently believe they're doing it the right way now, though, for whatever reason.
- metamatt 15y ago
  I'll echo the other reply to your post -- have you any experience with webOS? I've gone back and forth between webOS and iOS phones over the past couple years, and while webOS is not better in every way, and is significantly handicapped in some ways, it's also significantly better than iOS in some ways. I really don't see webOS phones as poor attempts to jump on a bandwagon just to scrape whatever profit they can. This is much more a case of healthy competition. I too expect Apple will eventually adopt a similar multitasking paradigm for iOS (you could call it Exposé-inspired, or webOS-inspired, as you wish), negating webOS's most obvious advantage. Which you could attribute to the effects of competition. Or maybe Apple would have inevitably done it once the hardware got powerful enough -- who knows.
r00fus 15y ago
It doesn't matter how strong Apple is... 2nd place is still profitable, and honeycomb tablets have been pretty lackluster in sales. If HPalm can take a solid niche (better UI than iPad, free-er than Android) and make 2nd place out of it, they will have a sustainable foothold to re-establish the WebOS brand. Apple doesn't have to lose for HP to succeed.
- cpeterso 15y ago
  HP can also leverage its huge enterprise market to sell Palm enterprise "solutions". Think RIM Blackberry.
encoderer 15y ago
My speculation is that relatively few iPads have been sold versus the size of the total market in coming years. They may stay on top but I speculate it'll be like iPhone market share before Android was a real contender. Nearly all the Android tablets that are out now are down-market compared to iPad. This could really shake it up.
- metamatt 15y ago
  The forces in HP's favor in the tablet market are pretty different from the forces in Android's favor in the phone market. But that said, I agree the tablet market is just heating up. The iPad is a pretty formidable competitor, not just because of its existing market share but really because it's a good product. Still, there's room for more than one product. My impression (from reading press, not from firsthand experience) is that a few Android vendors (notably Samsung and Motorola) and RIM have all stepped up to the plate, took a swing, and pretty much struck out. Maybe they'll get better over time -- probably they will -- but it looks like they shipped too early and quality suffered as a result; the reviews I've read have been largely negative. Meanwhile Microsoft doesn't have anything coming soon. All that means HP has a really good shot at the #2 spot right out of the gate. If that's enough to get developers to return to webOS, the platform might still have a chance.

darrenkopp 15y ago

I was one of the people who waited in line for the Palm Pre on launch day, but I left for android after about a year because of the limited app selection. I've been extremely happy with android, but have always missed how WebOS does multitasking. I'm genuinely excited by the Touchpad and I hope that HP doesn't screw it up.

adolph 15y ago

In the email app demo, the controls at the bottom to hide/reveal the accounts and message lists are pretty nice.

jinushaun 15y ago

People are all over the Tweetie iPad interface. (Sliding stacked split views) The TouchPad email app isn't the only tablet app I've seen that uses that design. Along with pull to refresh, fast scrolling, flick for menu, and many other UX gems, the developer of Tweetie is a genius.

mikecane 15y ago
Lacking an iOS device, I've never seen the Tweetie UI. Was it developed before HP showed its multipane email app?
achompas 15y ago
The three-column view dates back to NeXT, if I recall correctly. It's a great implementation of the three-column view on touch-based devices, but this is no different... whoa, wait, the columns SLIDE OVER?! Wow...brilliant.
- tvon 15y ago
  > whoa, wait, the columns SLIDE OVER?! Wow...brilliant. FWIW, that's how Reeder works on OSX (though Reeder is relatively new).
  - achompas 15y ago
    Only on iPad though, right? I have the iPhone version.
    - tvon 15y ago
      I'm referring to the desktop client which came a few months after the iOS version, I haven't used the iPad one myself.

paulnelligan 15y ago

Using your own platform with 2 Giants already out in the market is ballsy to say the least. Another way of putting it would be "not very clever". I'm going with the latter here. Unless WebOS is extremely innovative and porting an app from another platform to this is ridiculously simple, it's surely going to fail.

smackfu 15y ago
WebOS apps are Javascript/HTML. So porting from Web to WebOS is the simple thing. https://developer.palm.com/content/resources/develop/building_your_first_app.html https://developer.palm.com/content/resources/develop/buildin...
DougBTX 15y ago
Two giants? I'm not sure which you mean. iOS, sure. Microsoft has been in tablets for years, and HP has shrugged them off, rightly as far as Windows goes. It will be interesting once they make a tablet size version of the Metro UI. RIM's PlayBook is just getting started, still waiting for an email client. Android is out, but it doesn't seem to be making much impact. Perhaps once it is good enough for Google to release the source for a wider range of hardware something interesting will come out. So, the second place looks like it Is still up for grabs.
- paulnelligan 15y ago
  I was referring to Android
zinkem 15y ago
>porting an app from another platform to this is ridiculously simple This has been at least a part of the sell. It runs Linux with libSDL, they said they ported the Unreal Engine in about 2 weeks. It also uses gcc, so you could compile Objective-C. http://youtu.be/40ga1lyFPFg http://youtu.be/40ga1lyFPFg

Apocryphon 15y ago

Forget beating the iPad, let's start with the basics- does it beat the Playbook? Can it challenge the Galaxy Tab or other Android tablets?

bitwize 15y ago

Keep chasin them taillights, everyone-else-but-Apple.