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The "born that way" argument was always a compromise/simplification. The true argument is that gay relationships, regardless of cause, are just as worthwhile a

The "born that way" argument was always a compromise/simplification. The true argument is that gay relationships, regardless of cause, are just as worthwhile and life affirming as straight relationships. But, if you're stubborn, and refuse to acknowledge that, "they're born this way" might temporarily get you to acknowledge the absurdity of your position. It feels cruel to condemn someone for something they can't control. But that's not much of an argument--I don't think pedophiles choose to be attracted to minors. The difference is that pedophilic relationships are harmful, not worthwhile and life-affirming.

nashashmi 6y ago
If that is true then the far right are correct to say this was a lie and a hoax. We reconstructed laws and systems worldwide to make an accommodation that as per you had no genetic basis or reason. In other words, this has been the greatest fraud to humanity and all those who went down this path in belief that it was a gene they could not change.
- hyperpape 6y ago
  Of course not. 1) Several other posts in this thread explain that genetics isn't the only way you can be born a certain way. The environment includes the prenatal womb. So the premise isn't false. It's part of a sound argument that you should not persecute homosexuals. It is just that the truth is that you should view homosexual relationships as the full equal of straight relationships, equally real and valuable. Once you realize that, the first argument is just a stepping stone. 2) Even more importantly, this discussion only happened because ignorant moral codes prohibited homosexuality. But such a moral principle is no better than demanding that people crack their eggs from a certain side. In fact, it's worse, because you can just switch sides of the egg with no consequences. Meanwhile, in the real world, these moral codes prevented people from experience love in peace. You don't get to embrace an absurd and stupid moral code, then whine because someone didn't use a perfect argument to knock you out of your ignorance.

nashashmi 6y ago

If that is true then the far right are correct to say this was a lie and a hoax. We reconstructed laws and systems worldwide to make an accommodation that as per you had no genetic basis or reason. In other words, this has been the greatest fraud to humanity and all those who went down this path in belief that it was a gene they could not change.

hyperpape 6y ago
Of course not. 1) Several other posts in this thread explain that genetics isn't the only way you can be born a certain way. The environment includes the prenatal womb. So the premise isn't false. It's part of a sound argument that you should not persecute homosexuals. It is just that the truth is that you should view homosexual relationships as the full equal of straight relationships, equally real and valuable. Once you realize that, the first argument is just a stepping stone. 2) Even more importantly, this discussion only happened because ignorant moral codes prohibited homosexuality. But such a moral principle is no better than demanding that people crack their eggs from a certain side. In fact, it's worse, because you can just switch sides of the egg with no consequences. Meanwhile, in the real world, these moral codes prevented people from experience love in peace. You don't get to embrace an absurd and stupid moral code, then whine because someone didn't use a perfect argument to knock you out of your ignorance.