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In Australia we use proportional representation to elect the federal senate (upper house). It is used at state level too, in some states. I used to be of the

In Australia we use proportional representation to elect the federal senate (upper house). It is used at state level too, in some states. I used to be of the opinion that it was fairer. I no longer think so. I agree with former PM Paul Keating, who referred to the Senate as "unrepresentative swill"[1]. When I first heard this view, I thought Keating was nuts. What could be better than PR for giving minorities a voice? All you need is portion of votes and you get a seat. Seemed pretty fair to me, and allowed members of minor parties to have a say in the passing of bills into acts. But that's the problem. Very often a few minor party seats hold the balance of power. The 2 major parties are deadlocked in disagreement over some legislation and whether it becomes law or not falls into the hands of a few senators represented by a minority. So oftentimes the "uprepresentative swill" get to pass law, or not. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cG1khlbqI9k https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cG1khlbqI9k

sampo 6y ago
> The 2 major parties are deadlocked in disagreement In Finland we have 3 major parties, so some version of A+B, A+C, B+C is usually in power. (Except now, when it's 1 major and 4 minor.) https://www.politico.eu/europe-poll-of-polls/finland/ https://www.politico.eu/europe-poll-of-polls/finland/
mr_toad 6y ago
> Very often a few minor party seats hold the balance of power. This is partly because the major parties are so partisan they refuse to agree on anything out of principle. Edit: and when I say principle, I mean shear bloody mindedness.
- tomhoward 6y ago
  That's not really true. In Australia, plenty of bills get passed with bipartisan support; you just don't hear much about it as it's not newsworthy. But on issues that are pertinent to each party's ideological position and the expectations of their members/voters, they will take strongly opposed positions. This is important, so that voters have different options to choose from, and that each party must argue convincingly for their policies when campaigning. If the parties are in consensus on most things, you end up with something not so different to one-party rule, and possibly endemic corruption.
  - refurb 6y ago
    Exactly. The US system is entirely designed around this. Two legislative bodies and a head of the executive all have to agree. If they can’t, it doesn’t get passed. That’s a feature, not a bug.
ubercow13 6y ago
Why is that a problem? Whatever legislation does get passed had wide support, the majority of which was from a major party.

sampo 6y ago

> The 2 major parties are deadlocked in disagreement In Finland we have 3 major parties, so some version of A+B, A+C, B+C is usually in power. (Except now, when it's 1 major and 4 minor.) https://www.politico.eu/europe-poll-of-polls/finland/ https://www.politico.eu/europe-poll-of-polls/finland/

mr_toad 6y ago

> Very often a few minor party seats hold the balance of power. This is partly because the major parties are so partisan they refuse to agree on anything out of principle. Edit: and when I say principle, I mean shear bloody mindedness.

tomhoward 6y ago
That's not really true. In Australia, plenty of bills get passed with bipartisan support; you just don't hear much about it as it's not newsworthy. But on issues that are pertinent to each party's ideological position and the expectations of their members/voters, they will take strongly opposed positions. This is important, so that voters have different options to choose from, and that each party must argue convincingly for their policies when campaigning. If the parties are in consensus on most things, you end up with something not so different to one-party rule, and possibly endemic corruption.
- refurb 6y ago
  Exactly. The US system is entirely designed around this. Two legislative bodies and a head of the executive all have to agree. If they can’t, it doesn’t get passed. That’s a feature, not a bug.

ubercow13 6y ago

Why is that a problem? Whatever legislation does get passed had wide support, the majority of which was from a major party.