5 ms·

Cancel culture is a cancer. Having everything documented online doesn’t help. People are supposed to learn from mistakes. They are supposed to make them because

Cancel culture is a cancer. Having everything documented online doesn’t help. People are supposed to learn from mistakes. They are supposed to make them because we all make mistakes. There are mistakes that are considered table stakes for a role or a job and I’m for demotion of those individuals for it, but I don’t like seeing this cancel culture ruin lives. It’s very high school and immature.

jacques_chester 6y ago
I've no idea how you decided this was "cancel culture". It's a garden-variety cockup. Mistakes are not binary, some of them are worse than others. Messing up the spelling of someone's name is common and a subject of regular jest amongst journalists. Slightly misquoting someone might be subject to some kind of internal discipline, it will at least lead to a correction being published. Publishing mostly fiction without the exercise of fact-checking is much less forgivable in a news organisation. Willing credulity is not the standard journalists should be held to.
- xupybd 6y ago
  Was he fired for his bad journalism or for his past misconduct? I couldn't tell from the article.
  - katbyte 6y ago
    He resigned do to social media backlash it appears
- ng12 6y ago
  Cancel culture is what happened after the revelations about the podcast. Some people got angry they felt he wasn't punished enough and turned to cancel culture to punish him instead.
  - free_rms 6y ago
    It's concerning that that's the lever, though. Break every rule of your profession and publish a bunch of BS? We'll give you another chance. Gave an inappropriate backrub 10 years ago? You're out! He should have been fired for Caliphate and expressly for Caliphate.
    - ogre_codes 6y ago
      Look at the title here. Look at the author of this piece. Do you think a journalist who has no journalistic integrity is going to admit he got fired because he has no journalistic integrity? Easier to get a sympathy by claiming it was about back rubs.
      - free_rms 6y ago
        Absolutely right, and I should have written that :) That said, seems like the easier narrative for the NYT to go with as well -- they don't have to own up to their editorial failures up the chain that way.
    - gabereiser 6y ago
      agreed
- irateswami 6y ago
  Agreed, "journalists" should be held to a high standard for the information they disseminate. Have we all forgotten "A Rape on Campus" and the fallout for Rolling Stone?
  - sadgrip 6y ago
    Did you read the article by chance? The author wasn't "cancelled" on account of the misreporting. That was just what put a spotlight on him leading to cancelling him for unrelated actions.
- gabereiser 6y ago
  A Twitter campaign sounds like cancel culture. There are avenues to address misbehavior. There are ways to report inaccuracies. I’m not defending the man’s mistakes or his podcast. Like I said, there are some things that are table stakes, telling the truth at a news org should definitely be one. His story isn’t unique though about how social media descends on an individual to ruin their lives. He mentioned how the campaign made its way into the NYT via Twitter. All I’m saying is that we are all human, we all make mistakes, we should all be given an opportunity to learn from and grow from those mistakes. Does he need to be publicly visible in NYT’s, probably not considering the history. Could he produce shows where he’s not asked to determine the truth but just report it, possibly. There are levels to mistakes, I hear you, and to make a public post about it on his blog definitively shows he doesn’t exactly know why this is happening to him or he wants to make a big grand stand about it. Doesn’t matter. My statement still stands. People make mistakes. Sometimes those mistakes have nothing to do with their jobs and yet, canceled...
  - omgwtfbyobbq 6y ago
    What's the difference between a cancel culture Twitter campaign and other Twitter campaigns?
    - gabereiser 6y ago
      I donate money to other Twitter campaigns
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
netrus 6y ago
People learn from mistakes when there are consequences. You are witnessing consequences. There are far more, specific stories of misconduct on Twitter than those acknowledged in this article. If they are untrue, why not specifically say so? Andy Mills is not going to prison. Being called out publically for toxic behavior towards colleagues is not exactly a ruined life. He will be fine (just not as fine as when peers did not speak up). Also "we all make mistakes". We are talking about an adult, who got a grown-up's salary, some mistakes are worse than others, and you should not make the same mistake again and again and again. Consequences help with that.
- ng12 6y ago
  > People learn from mistakes when there are consequences Oh please. If cancel culture were about learning from your mistakes we wouldn't haunt people for things they did decades ago.
  - gabereiser 6y ago
    Kevin Spacey comes to mind. There is a thing called statute of limitations for things. Kevin Spacey probably shouldn't have sexually assaulted boys. Because the internet archives everything, no one looks at the date and think how long ago was this?
    - atdrummond 6y ago
      Unfortunately, he was acting that way well into the 2010s; I had a number of friends in the London theatre scene and it was well known that a certain type of person (young, fit males) should avoid spending time with him alone.
      - gabereiser 6y ago
        I only heard about the ones from the 1990s. Thanks for adding context. He’s still canceled yet does a creepy Christmas vid considering the history. I’m not defending him at all. More attacking the process of which those allegations were brought to light.
threatofrain 6y ago
At the root of cancel culture is the freedom of association. Ultimately people either feel fraternity amongst each other or they don't. I might argue that the freedom to not bake cakes or employ gay people with regards to religious rights is also part of the freedom of association. People either feel the love or they don't.
- gabereiser 6y ago
  Except for discrimination laws...
  - threatofrain 6y ago
    My latter example would be with regards to US Constitutional rights, and is possibly something that won't change in your lifetime. If anything, there was political energy to Constitutionally define heterosexual marriage as the only marriage, as it was a presidential get-out-to-vote issue for George Bush Jr. But it does motivate discussion on fraternity. A discussion of the disarmament of relations must begin with the movement of not only words.
- worik 6y ago
  Why is a "freedom" to not employ gay people a freedom? And why freedom of association? Why another person chooses to do with their genitals is generally no not your business. It is not a "freedom". It is prejudice and bigotry
  - gabereiser 6y ago
    I agree. Businesses shouldn’t be allowed bigoted freedoms.
    - zepto 6y ago
      Who defines what counts as bigoted?
      - 6y ago

jacques_chester 6y ago

I've no idea how you decided this was "cancel culture". It's a garden-variety cockup. Mistakes are not binary, some of them are worse than others. Messing up the spelling of someone's name is common and a subject of regular jest amongst journalists. Slightly misquoting someone might be subject to some kind of internal discipline, it will at least lead to a correction being published. Publishing mostly fiction without the exercise of fact-checking is much less forgivable in a news organisation. Willing credulity is not the standard journalists should be held to.

xupybd 6y ago
Was he fired for his bad journalism or for his past misconduct? I couldn't tell from the article.
- katbyte 6y ago
  He resigned do to social media backlash it appears
ng12 6y ago
Cancel culture is what happened after the revelations about the podcast. Some people got angry they felt he wasn't punished enough and turned to cancel culture to punish him instead.
- free_rms 6y ago
  It's concerning that that's the lever, though. Break every rule of your profession and publish a bunch of BS? We'll give you another chance. Gave an inappropriate backrub 10 years ago? You're out! He should have been fired for Caliphate and expressly for Caliphate.
  - ogre_codes 6y ago
    Look at the title here. Look at the author of this piece. Do you think a journalist who has no journalistic integrity is going to admit he got fired because he has no journalistic integrity? Easier to get a sympathy by claiming it was about back rubs.
    - free_rms 6y ago
      Absolutely right, and I should have written that :) That said, seems like the easier narrative for the NYT to go with as well -- they don't have to own up to their editorial failures up the chain that way.
  - gabereiser 6y ago
    agreed
irateswami 6y ago
Agreed, "journalists" should be held to a high standard for the information they disseminate. Have we all forgotten "A Rape on Campus" and the fallout for Rolling Stone?
- sadgrip 6y ago
  Did you read the article by chance? The author wasn't "cancelled" on account of the misreporting. That was just what put a spotlight on him leading to cancelling him for unrelated actions.
gabereiser 6y ago
A Twitter campaign sounds like cancel culture. There are avenues to address misbehavior. There are ways to report inaccuracies. I’m not defending the man’s mistakes or his podcast. Like I said, there are some things that are table stakes, telling the truth at a news org should definitely be one. His story isn’t unique though about how social media descends on an individual to ruin their lives. He mentioned how the campaign made its way into the NYT via Twitter. All I’m saying is that we are all human, we all make mistakes, we should all be given an opportunity to learn from and grow from those mistakes. Does he need to be publicly visible in NYT’s, probably not considering the history. Could he produce shows where he’s not asked to determine the truth but just report it, possibly. There are levels to mistakes, I hear you, and to make a public post about it on his blog definitively shows he doesn’t exactly know why this is happening to him or he wants to make a big grand stand about it. Doesn’t matter. My statement still stands. People make mistakes. Sometimes those mistakes have nothing to do with their jobs and yet, canceled...
- omgwtfbyobbq 6y ago
  What's the difference between a cancel culture Twitter campaign and other Twitter campaigns?
  - gabereiser 6y ago
    I donate money to other Twitter campaigns

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

netrus 6y ago

People learn from mistakes when there are consequences. You are witnessing consequences. There are far more, specific stories of misconduct on Twitter than those acknowledged in this article. If they are untrue, why not specifically say so? Andy Mills is not going to prison. Being called out publically for toxic behavior towards colleagues is not exactly a ruined life. He will be fine (just not as fine as when peers did not speak up). Also "we all make mistakes". We are talking about an adult, who got a grown-up's salary, some mistakes are worse than others, and you should not make the same mistake again and again and again. Consequences help with that.

ng12 6y ago
> People learn from mistakes when there are consequences Oh please. If cancel culture were about learning from your mistakes we wouldn't haunt people for things they did decades ago.
- gabereiser 6y ago
  Kevin Spacey comes to mind. There is a thing called statute of limitations for things. Kevin Spacey probably shouldn't have sexually assaulted boys. Because the internet archives everything, no one looks at the date and think how long ago was this?
  - atdrummond 6y ago
    Unfortunately, he was acting that way well into the 2010s; I had a number of friends in the London theatre scene and it was well known that a certain type of person (young, fit males) should avoid spending time with him alone.
    - gabereiser 6y ago
      I only heard about the ones from the 1990s. Thanks for adding context. He’s still canceled yet does a creepy Christmas vid considering the history. I’m not defending him at all. More attacking the process of which those allegations were brought to light.

threatofrain 6y ago

At the root of cancel culture is the freedom of association. Ultimately people either feel fraternity amongst each other or they don't. I might argue that the freedom to not bake cakes or employ gay people with regards to religious rights is also part of the freedom of association. People either feel the love or they don't.

gabereiser 6y ago
Except for discrimination laws...
- threatofrain 6y ago
  My latter example would be with regards to US Constitutional rights, and is possibly something that won't change in your lifetime. If anything, there was political energy to Constitutionally define heterosexual marriage as the only marriage, as it was a presidential get-out-to-vote issue for George Bush Jr. But it does motivate discussion on fraternity. A discussion of the disarmament of relations must begin with the movement of not only words.
worik 6y ago
Why is a "freedom" to not employ gay people a freedom? And why freedom of association? Why another person chooses to do with their genitals is generally no not your business. It is not a "freedom". It is prejudice and bigotry
- gabereiser 6y ago
  I agree. Businesses shouldn’t be allowed bigoted freedoms.
  - zepto 6y ago
    Who defines what counts as bigoted?
    - 6y ago