4 ms·

It’s always amazing to think in the complete chaos of war there were still rules to follow. Things like after sinking a ship letting the enemy know where they

It’s always amazing to think in the complete chaos of war there were still rules to follow. Things like after sinking a ship letting the enemy know where they should come pick up their survivors. Not using hollow point rounds. Banning gas. Etc. The problem is that in most wars there always seems to be a force of good and a force of evil who is not willing to follow the rules. The Germans, Japanese, Italians, Russians of that time were led by truly evil regimes. Or maybe this is just our collective 20th century bias. How did Europe see Napoleon for example? How did countries see the actions of other nations during the previous decades? Back to the point though, it did seem like Britain saw themselves on the side of the light and fought within the rules as much as possible. To fight an evil without becoming evil yourself is quite a challenge for humanity in general.

mrec 6y ago
> Things like after sinking a ship letting the enemy know where they should come pick up their survivors. This did happen, at least early on, in the Battle of the Atlantic. And some U-boat crews not only stopped to pick up survivors but gave up their own bunks for them. Eventually Dönitz had to order them to stop, on the grounds that it put the sub at risk. You might also be interested in the Charlie Brown and Franz Stigler incident [1] - sometimes a spark of human decency shines through even when you'd least expect it. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Brown_and_Franz_Stigler_incident https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Brown_and_Franz_Stigle...
- derivagral 6y ago
  As I understand it, this generally stopped because of the Laconia incident. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laconia_incident https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laconia_incident
  - mrec 6y ago
    That was '42; the (in)famous Dönitz order below was from November or December '39. > Rescue no one and take no one with you. Have no care for the ships’ boats. Weather conditions and the proximity of land are of no account. Care only for your own boat and strive to achieve the next success as soon as possible! We must be hard in this war. The enemy started the war in order to destroy us, therefore nothing else matters. I'm not sure what happened in between that led the U-boats in the Laconia incident to ignore that order.
    - n4r9 6y ago
      Dönitz gave two orders: "War Order No.154" which you quote, then the "Laconia Order" following that incident, which doubles down on the message. > All efforts to save survivors of sunken ships, such as the fishing out of swimming men and putting them on board lifeboats, the righting of overturned lifeboats, or the handing over of food and water, must stop. I assume that between these two events the Prize Rules were followed to greater or lesser degree according to the Captain's inclinations (on both sides)
  - robin21 6y ago
    Thanks - great read.
- robin21 6y ago
  Wow. Thanks for that - such a great read.

mrec 6y ago

> Things like after sinking a ship letting the enemy know where they should come pick up their survivors. This did happen, at least early on, in the Battle of the Atlantic. And some U-boat crews not only stopped to pick up survivors but gave up their own bunks for them. Eventually Dönitz had to order them to stop, on the grounds that it put the sub at risk. You might also be interested in the Charlie Brown and Franz Stigler incident [1] - sometimes a spark of human decency shines through even when you'd least expect it. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Brown_and_Franz_Stigler_incident https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Brown_and_Franz_Stigle...

derivagral 6y ago
As I understand it, this generally stopped because of the Laconia incident. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laconia_incident https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laconia_incident
- mrec 6y ago
  That was '42; the (in)famous Dönitz order below was from November or December '39. > Rescue no one and take no one with you. Have no care for the ships’ boats. Weather conditions and the proximity of land are of no account. Care only for your own boat and strive to achieve the next success as soon as possible! We must be hard in this war. The enemy started the war in order to destroy us, therefore nothing else matters. I'm not sure what happened in between that led the U-boats in the Laconia incident to ignore that order.
  - n4r9 6y ago
    Dönitz gave two orders: "War Order No.154" which you quote, then the "Laconia Order" following that incident, which doubles down on the message. > All efforts to save survivors of sunken ships, such as the fishing out of swimming men and putting them on board lifeboats, the righting of overturned lifeboats, or the handing over of food and water, must stop. I assume that between these two events the Prize Rules were followed to greater or lesser degree according to the Captain's inclinations (on both sides)
- robin21 6y ago
  Thanks - great read.
robin21 6y ago
Wow. Thanks for that - such a great read.