4 ms·

The best teams appear to be doing nothing. If as a general rule things are always in a fire drill then your software sucks (there are other reasons for this). W

The best teams appear to be doing nothing. If as a general rule things are always in a fire drill then your software sucks (there are other reasons for this). We always measure how many things are fixed. New features added. Rarely how much time is spent baby sitting machines etc.

emteycz 6y ago
Sadly business people want to fire you when you're seemingly doing nothing (as in coming to work on time, doing your job without stress and conflict, going home on time)... Even if all the business goals were met, they just can't stomach someone not working their asses off 24/7 for them.
- ndiscussion 6y ago
  It's about power not money.
  - karmakaze 6y ago
    That's actually insightful. Wish I'd known this early in my career. Often, I'll be doing a great job with no complains from peers or project deliveries but seemingly 'tolerated' and not liked by any management types as they had no influence, I just did what needed doing of my own accord. Or maybe I didn't need to know, ignorance was bliss.
    - ndiscussion 6y ago
      Check out this post: https://daedtech.com/defining-the-corporate-hierarchy/ https://daedtech.com/defining-the-corporate-hierarchy/ I really recommend his book Developer Hegemony, although it was very depressing and I haven't quite recovered a year later :D
      - karmakaze 6y ago
        Enough of that is funny 'cause it's true or sad but true. I work at a big co but not a full-on enterprise corp. I value my own time and work, more-or-less in alignment with broader initiatives. Learning new things and technical challenges makes the journey interesting, and it's fun/easy to get work done with most people. Sometimes I have varying degrees of communications (tech vs non-tech or grok/non-grok conceptual) issues but for the most part leadership has enough technical sense to make decent choices. So far, so good.
- maximente 6y ago
  well, yeah. if you don't have air cover from a team or manager and don't appear to be engaged in shared suffering, it's no surprise people are going to ask questions, both from above and equal level. other labor will resent your non-suffering (how come /they/ get to leave on time?) and management will wonder whose reports get such a cushy setup and why.
  - emteycz 6y ago
    The thing is, there might be no suffering one is "avoiding" - the business people are often sitting around drinking coffee and beer, cracking jokes, watching developers' backs.
snidane 6y ago
The best way to motivate devs to build truly robust systems is to let them go home at 2pm when things are finished and production process is running smooth. However most organizations would pile more work onto devs if they finish early, so devs then compensate by taking more time on their current tasks. Why finish them early, when you'll be thrown another one right away.
- kamilafsar 6y ago
  Finish what? Where do you draw the line of “work for today”? I don’t think motivated devs want to go home at 2pm. Speaking as a dev, the best way to motivate me is to give me some head cracking challenge, trust (no reporting) and autonomy (don’t tell me how to do my work).
  - BossingAround 6y ago
    > I don’t think motivated devs want to go home at 2pm. I can understand the attitude when one's in their twenties, has no significant other, kids, or other commitments. Me? I just get tired. I'm very motivated and like what I do, but at some point, it's just silly to stay behind the screen. And sometimes, that point is even earlier than 2pm. That's ok. We aren't machines to be working like a Swiss watch.
    - Jtsummers 6y ago
      I was most productive when my office let us take a few hours a week to exercise. I wouldn't use it if I had anything critical pending, but otherwise I would duck out an hour early several times a week to go get in a good long run (5-10km). It felt like they had more respect for my time and well-being. When they cut it (with bullshit reasons [0]) "productivity" did not improve in the office. Instead, projects expanded to fill the time. Those 3 hours or so we got to use at the gym before became 3 hours spent to produce the exact same total work. There was zero motivation to utilize it "properly" by using it to get ahead on anything. Every project continued to hit the same deadlines they were hitting before. [0] One reason I say it was BS, we were typically on or ahead of schedule on projects. Teams that were behind weren't making use of this time while they were behind, they weren't permitted to.
mbrodersen 6y ago
You nailed it. The best engineers I have ever worked with never worked much. The bad engineers were always super busy trying (and failing) to fix the problems they put in the software in the first place.

emteycz 6y ago

Sadly business people want to fire you when you're seemingly doing nothing (as in coming to work on time, doing your job without stress and conflict, going home on time)... Even if all the business goals were met, they just can't stomach someone not working their asses off 24/7 for them.

ndiscussion 6y ago
It's about power not money.
- karmakaze 6y ago
  That's actually insightful. Wish I'd known this early in my career. Often, I'll be doing a great job with no complains from peers or project deliveries but seemingly 'tolerated' and not liked by any management types as they had no influence, I just did what needed doing of my own accord. Or maybe I didn't need to know, ignorance was bliss.
  - ndiscussion 6y ago
    Check out this post: https://daedtech.com/defining-the-corporate-hierarchy/ https://daedtech.com/defining-the-corporate-hierarchy/ I really recommend his book Developer Hegemony, although it was very depressing and I haven't quite recovered a year later :D
    - karmakaze 6y ago
      Enough of that is funny 'cause it's true or sad but true. I work at a big co but not a full-on enterprise corp. I value my own time and work, more-or-less in alignment with broader initiatives. Learning new things and technical challenges makes the journey interesting, and it's fun/easy to get work done with most people. Sometimes I have varying degrees of communications (tech vs non-tech or grok/non-grok conceptual) issues but for the most part leadership has enough technical sense to make decent choices. So far, so good.
maximente 6y ago
well, yeah. if you don't have air cover from a team or manager and don't appear to be engaged in shared suffering, it's no surprise people are going to ask questions, both from above and equal level. other labor will resent your non-suffering (how come /they/ get to leave on time?) and management will wonder whose reports get such a cushy setup and why.
- emteycz 6y ago
  The thing is, there might be no suffering one is "avoiding" - the business people are often sitting around drinking coffee and beer, cracking jokes, watching developers' backs.

snidane 6y ago

The best way to motivate devs to build truly robust systems is to let them go home at 2pm when things are finished and production process is running smooth. However most organizations would pile more work onto devs if they finish early, so devs then compensate by taking more time on their current tasks. Why finish them early, when you'll be thrown another one right away.

kamilafsar 6y ago
Finish what? Where do you draw the line of “work for today”? I don’t think motivated devs want to go home at 2pm. Speaking as a dev, the best way to motivate me is to give me some head cracking challenge, trust (no reporting) and autonomy (don’t tell me how to do my work).
- BossingAround 6y ago
  > I don’t think motivated devs want to go home at 2pm. I can understand the attitude when one's in their twenties, has no significant other, kids, or other commitments. Me? I just get tired. I'm very motivated and like what I do, but at some point, it's just silly to stay behind the screen. And sometimes, that point is even earlier than 2pm. That's ok. We aren't machines to be working like a Swiss watch.
  - Jtsummers 6y ago
    I was most productive when my office let us take a few hours a week to exercise. I wouldn't use it if I had anything critical pending, but otherwise I would duck out an hour early several times a week to go get in a good long run (5-10km). It felt like they had more respect for my time and well-being. When they cut it (with bullshit reasons [0]) "productivity" did not improve in the office. Instead, projects expanded to fill the time. Those 3 hours or so we got to use at the gym before became 3 hours spent to produce the exact same total work. There was zero motivation to utilize it "properly" by using it to get ahead on anything. Every project continued to hit the same deadlines they were hitting before. [0] One reason I say it was BS, we were typically on or ahead of schedule on projects. Teams that were behind weren't making use of this time while they were behind, they weren't permitted to.

mbrodersen 6y ago

You nailed it. The best engineers I have ever worked with never worked much. The bad engineers were always super busy trying (and failing) to fix the problems they put in the software in the first place.