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> an entirely different picture of the university system I disagree. When I was in college ~4 years ago there were diverse discussions in all my classes and st

by tmpz22 6y ago

> an entirely different picture of the university system I disagree. When I was in college ~4 years ago there were diverse discussions in all my classes and students freely contributed what would be considered conservative mainstream opinions without retribution - and when well argued earned some support from their more liberal colleagues. University means different things to different people. For many it means partying. For others it means the paper certificate you may then use to get a higher paying job. To me the heart of a university is the discussion sections where students pick and prod at their lectures and each other's ideas. Diversity initiatives did not, anecdotally, affect those for me personally.

musingsole 6y ago
Unless you're the one stating the views, you're not in a position to know if those students received no retribution for their views. What you perceived as your peers listening and responding thoughtfully to the non-tribal thoughts may well have been anything but to someone without your set of assumptions. You simply cannot know. Claiming that you know otherwise is highly indicative you're part of the problem when it comes to diversity of thought in these venues.
- AnHonestComment 6y ago
  It’s a self-serving lie: even places like HN use shadow and to enforce ideological conformity — and then people like this come along to give everyone a pat for being open minded.
asciident 6y ago
Isn't the premise already a problem? Even the mainstream conservative views did not result in retribution. Yet extremist liberal views would never be considered for retribution.
ordinaryradical 6y ago
> students freely contributed what would be considered conservative mainstream opinions without retribution Sure, but the presence of these opinions is not the same thing as proof of a diverse, free-thinking environment. I shared unpopular opinions too—when I felt I could. It wasn't always easy to do so. The chilling effect is hard to measure because people self-censor and self-censorship is invisible. It's a bit hard to explain, but if we take your metric and extend it, you can see where it falls short: just because there are black students on campus doesn't mean they feel welcome or comfortable to share their minds.

by tmpz22 6y ago

musingsole 6y ago

Unless you're the one stating the views, you're not in a position to know if those students received no retribution for their views. What you perceived as your peers listening and responding thoughtfully to the non-tribal thoughts may well have been anything but to someone without your set of assumptions. You simply cannot know. Claiming that you know otherwise is highly indicative you're part of the problem when it comes to diversity of thought in these venues.

AnHonestComment 6y ago
It’s a self-serving lie: even places like HN use shadow and to enforce ideological conformity — and then people like this come along to give everyone a pat for being open minded.

asciident 6y ago

Isn't the premise already a problem? Even the mainstream conservative views did not result in retribution. Yet extremist liberal views would never be considered for retribution.

ordinaryradical 6y ago

> students freely contributed what would be considered conservative mainstream opinions without retribution Sure, but the presence of these opinions is not the same thing as proof of a diverse, free-thinking environment. I shared unpopular opinions too—when I felt I could. It wasn't always easy to do so. The chilling effect is hard to measure because people self-censor and self-censorship is invisible. It's a bit hard to explain, but if we take your metric and extend it, you can see where it falls short: just because there are black students on campus doesn't mean they feel welcome or comfortable to share their minds.